Prospect Info: The Prospect Thread (Part XXXIII)

[Fonzerelli]

"What’s happened with Jake is that in junior he was a big scorer, so he really didn’t have to play a well-rounded game, because his coaches and the team would always count on him to get the big goal."

Was he even a first line player his last year in the WHL?

He was not.

Calgary's top line in Jake's final season was Adam Tambellini with Pavel Karnukhauv and Conner Rankin. They matched up against Sam Reinheart in the first round of the WHL Playoffs in a beauty of a series that went the full 7 games - all of them broadcast on Shaw - 4 of the games were settled by a single goal and 3 of the games went to OT.

The Shaw announcers tried to bill the series as Reinheart vs Virtanen but Jake didn't help them out very much. 3 games into it he was pointless and -4. He never did score a single goal in the entire 7 games series, though he did pick up a couple 2nd assists later in the series. Travis Sanheim and Adam Tambellini drove the bus.

He did a little better in the 2nd round series win over the Tigers but it was the Tambellini and Sanheim show by then.

In the third series he ended up throwing a tantrum and taking a suspension. He only played 2 games of the 0-4 sweep, going -3 with a point.

Later, rumours would leak about attitude issues, that he was playing with one foot out the door and didn't care to be there. Not sure if there's legs to that or not, but it sure matched the effort level, or lack thereof.

That fall both Reinheart and Jake were on NHL opening day rosters, but for Jake it was likely a year to soon, as rushing him there might've set him back. Travis Sanheim was much more NHL ready and he stayed back for his 19 year old junior season. In almost 50 years watching WHL hockey, I've yet to see a player who was ruined by staying to long in junior, but have seen plenty who were ruined, or at least minimized, by rushing it.

 

[VanJack]

I get the fact that disappointment with Virtanen is running rampant on these boards, but you have to put it into the context of the entire top-15 of that draft year, 2014....with the exception of Draisaitl who went top-3, and Nylander-Ehlers who went 8-9 and Larkin at 15, the rest of the draft is looking pretty pedestrian.

And at the top of the draft, Ekblad isn't in the conversation for a Norris Trophy; the Sabres have soured on Reinhart; and the Flames are less than enthralled with Sam Bennett....Michael Dal Colle is shaping up as a bust; and the rest are pretty pedestrian in terms of their development.....shaping up as just an off-year in the draft.

 

[Kryten]

I get the fact that disappointment with Virtanen is running rampant on these boards, but you have to put it into the context of the entire top-15 of that draft year, 2014....with the exception of Draisaitl who went top-3, and Nylander-Ehlers who went 8-9 and Larkin at 15, the rest of the draft is looking pretty pedestrian.

And at the top of the draft, Ekblad isn't in the conversation for a Norris Trophy; the Sabres have soured on Reinhart; and the Flames are less than enthralled with Sam Bennett....Michael Dal Colle is shaping up as a bust; and the rest are pretty pedestrian in terms of their development.....shaping up as just an off-year in the draft.

I would disagree with all of this. The 2014 draft is looking really good despite having a D go #1 overall. After next season it should be more apparent to stat watchers that only Bleackley is a worse 1st rounder than Virtanen

 

[Fonzerelli]

I get the fact that disappointment with Virtanen is running rampant on these boards, but you have to put it into the context of the entire top-15 of that draft year, 2014....with the exception of Draisaitl who went top-3, and Nylander-Ehlers who went 8-9 and Larkin at 15, the rest of the draft is looking pretty pedestrian.

And at the top of the draft, Ekblad isn't in the conversation for a Norris Trophy; the Sabres have soured on Reinhart; and the Flames are less than enthralled with Sam Bennett....Michael Dal Colle is shaping up as a bust; and the rest are pretty pedestrian in terms of their development.....shaping up as just an off-year in the draft.

It was no 2015, but it wasn't bad at all ... 9 of the top 12 picks are looking just fine. Only 5-6-7 were flops. Not to mention Larkin at 15 and Pastrnak at 25 ... that's just pure gold. A few other promising youngsters in there with Fabbri, Schmalz, maybe even Ho-Sang. Perlini, Kapanen, DeAngeo, Tuch, Sanheim and Quenneville are all coming along nicely. It's a pretty good group.
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2014e.html

I'm not sure the Canucks made a bad pick with Virtanen, but I don't think you can argue that they managed those young guys very poorly. Virtnanen and McCann should have both been left in junior. They aren't generational talents. They needed to go through the process.

 

[MS]

It was no 2015, but it wasn't bad at all ... 9 of the top 12 picks are looking just fine. Only 5-6-7 were flops. Not to mention Larkin at 15 and Pastrnak at 25 ... that's just pure gold. A few other promising youngsters in there with Fabbri, Schmalz, maybe even Ho-Sang. Perlini, Kapanen, DeAngeo, Tuch, Sanheim and Quenneville are all coming along nicely. It's a pretty good group.
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2014e.html

I'm not sure the Canucks made a bad pick with Virtanen, but I don't think you can argue that they managed those young guys very poorly. Virtnanen and McCann should have both been left in junior. They aren't generational talents. They needed to go through the process.

Fleury isn't a flop. He's just being brought along slowly on a team absurdly loaded with top young defenders. If he was a Canuck, he would have been an NHL regular this year.

Granted, Carolina should have taken Nylander or Ehlers, especially given how their current needs have turned out. But Fleury will be a solid player for a long time.

 

[604]

I think we were supposed to take 1 of Ehlers, Nylander, or Ritchie.

I had them ranked Ritchie, Ehlers, Nylander...the Canucks took Virtanen...i would have been happy with any of the three we were supposed to pick pat the rankings.

 

[VanJack]

I think we were supposed to take 1 of Ehlers, Nylander, or Ritchie.

I had them ranked Ritchie, Ehlers, Nylander...the Canucks took Virtanen...i would have been happy with any of the three we were supposed to pick pat the rankings.

Yep....that's what's so infuriating.....posters were pleading for any of those guys in the '014 draft, and they're not even being paid as 'professional scouts'......I swear over the years the Canucks would have been better off sacking their entire scouting staff and just going with the picks from Craig Button or Bob McKenzie.

 

[Kryten]

Yep....that's what's so infuriating.....posters were pleading for any of those guys in the '014 draft, and they're not even being paid as 'professional scouts'......I swear over the years the Canucks would have been better off sacking their entire scouting staff and just going with the picks from Craig Button or Bob McKenzie.

Im pretty sure it was proven that we would have a better draft record if the highest scoring CHLer left on the board was taken instead of what scouts and management have taken over the years

 

[Verviticus]

I get the fact that disappointment with Virtanen is running rampant on these boards, but you have to put it into the context of the entire top-15 of that draft year, 2014....with the exception of Draisaitl who went top-3, and Nylander-Ehlers who went 8-9 and Larkin at 15, the rest of the draft is looking pretty pedestrian.

And at the top of the draft, Ekblad isn't in the conversation for a Norris Trophy; the Sabres have soured on Reinhart; and the Flames are less than enthralled with Sam Bennett....Michael Dal Colle is shaping up as a bust; and the rest are pretty pedestrian in terms of their development.....shaping up as just an off-year in the draft.

2014 was an excellent year, lol

 

[NuxFan09]

Will the Canucks sign Zhukenov?

 

[The Iron Goalie]

Will the Canucks sign Zhukenov?

I think he's headed back to Russia (not confirmed yet?), but we hold his rigjt for 2 more years, so if he plays well we can just bring him back.

 

[Bad Goalie]

I think he's headed back to Russia (not confirmed yet?), but we hold his rigjt for 2 more years, so if he plays well we can just bring him back.

Didn't I just read on one of these threads that he just signed a 3yr somewhere in the KHL? Did anyone else read that or am I dreaming?

If I did and it was 3 years and the Canucks hold his rights for 2, doesn't that release him from any Canucks' hold?

 

[Siludin]

Didn't I just read on one of these threads that he just signed a 3yr somewhere in the KHL? Did anyone else read that or am I dreaming?

If I did and it was 3 years and the Canucks hold his rights for 2, doesn't that release him from any Canucks' hold?

That depends if he has an NHL out clause

 

[VanJack]

Have posters being following Botch's series on top-Canuck prospects in the Sun/Province?....the countdown so far: #10 Virtanen; #9 Brisebois; #8 Lockwood; #7 Subban; and Goldobin at #6, apparently....agree so far?

 

[Braeden]

Have posters being following Botch's series on top-Canuck prospects in the Sun/Province?....the countdown so far: #10 Virtanen; #9 Brisebois; #8 Lockwood; #7 Subban; and Goldobin at #6, apparently....agree so far?

Where did he say Goldobin was at 6? Boeser will be #1, Juolevi #2, Demko #3, Dahlen #4, Gaudette #5 and Goldobin #6 if that's the case.

 

[VanJack]

That could well be the order.....so where does this year's fifth overall pick fit into the top-10?

 

[Braeden]

That could well be the order.....so where does this year's fifth overall pick fit into the top-10?

Beneath Goldobin, above Subban.

 

[VanJack]

Is anybody surprised that a guy like Subban made it into the top-10 at all?......doesn't seem to have much a future in VanCity even though his former coach in Utica is now the bench-boss.....hopefully he gets a longer look in training camp than one cursory exhibition game.

 

[me2]

Is anybody surprised that a guy like Subban made it into the top-10 at all?......doesn't seem to have much a future in VanCity even though his former coach in Utica is now the bench-boss.....hopefully he gets a longer look in training camp than one cursory exhibition game.

A little bit it isn't like he is pushing out sure thing prospects. I can see a decent case for him being ahead of those guys.

 

[M2Beezy]

Is anybody surprised that a guy like Subban made it into the top-10 at all?......doesn't seem to have much a future in VanCity even though his former coach in Utica is now the bench-boss.....hopefully he gets a longer look in training camp than one cursory exhibition game.

Yeah kinda. Definitely shouldnt be ahead of Brisebois and Lockwood

 

[Braeden]

Yeah kinda. Definitely shouldnt be ahead of Brisebois and Lockwood

He has a pretty big upside if he becomes a pure threat like his brother every night of the week.

Consistency and the ability to defend is something Subban needs. And maybe keep working on his shot like Green told him to in his exit interview. He's still only 22, there's no need for a 22 year old to be a superstar prospect already. Especially for a 4th rounder. Development takes time, we won't rush someone if they aren't ready as we've learnt from that mistake (Virtanen, McCann)

 

[TruGr1t]

Is anybody surprised that a guy like Subban made it into the top-10 at all?......doesn't seem to have much a future in VanCity even though his former coach in Utica is now the bench-boss.....hopefully he gets a longer look in training camp than one cursory exhibition game.

Not really, considering the source. Botch is a noted Subban enthusiast. He criticizes the fact he hasn't been given time in the NHL routinely.

 

[Nucker101]

Beneath Goldobin, above Subban.

#7?

That's waaay too low lol

 

[Braeden]

#7?

That's waaay too low lol

Considering that Gaudette is 5th and Dahlen is 4th, we have a top 3 of Boeser, Juolevi and Demko.

http://theprovince.com/feature/canucks-top-10-prospects-2017/chapter-2 -Gaudette's article

 

[MS]

Is anybody surprised that a guy like Subban made it into the top-10 at all?......doesn't seem to have much a future in VanCity even though his former coach in Utica is now the bench-boss.....hopefully he gets a longer look in training camp than one cursory exhibition game.

Green hates him. If anything he'll get a shorter look here in the preseason.

Subban has now spent 130 games in the AHL and hasn't separated himself as an elite player at that level. He is almost surely a bust at this point and is way too high on this list.