OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: World Cup N'at

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Mr Jiggyfly

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Sports teams are not like musicians or most other forms of entertainment. Because of the competitive aspect of it, sports has a far more tribal element, and because of that fans feel they're part of that tribe, especially fans who hold season tickets. Hence the use of "we". This is probably most obvious at the HS and collegiate levels.

If you can detach yourself from the tribal aspect, good for you, but it doesn't mean those who take part are silly.

I’ve seen tons of people obsess and get attached to music groups. So that is inaccurate as hell. Grateful Dead literally had people follow them around the country everywhere they went.

And like I said if fans want to get that attached it’s not my business. My only negative comment was saying it was comical how I’ve noticed so many of these people use “we” when things are going well and “them” when things are going badly.
 

DanielPlainview

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I’ve seen tons of people obsess and get attached to music groups. So that is inaccurate as hell. Grateful Dead literally had people follow them around the country everywhere they went.

And like I said if fans want to get that attached it’s not my business. My only negative comment was saying it was comical how I’ve noticed so many of these people use “we” when things are going well and “them” when things are going badly.

Music is a very personal experience and what you get is a bunch of people gathering to experience it live. Very seldom do you get fandoms of separate artists who have a combative relationship.

Sports are communal. The teams are named after cities, states, regions, or school districts; and they typically have nicknames that represent the people or the area in some way. They are seen an extension of the community or region, not merely entertainment but something a step above.
 

Brandinho

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Nah.

I'm passionate about hockey, have been my entire life. I'm a big Pens fan as well, obviously, but I don't identify myself with the team.

It's never been a "we" situation. I was always me, and I played for my own teams, while with my favorite sports teams I knew I wasn't anything more than a fan. It's just for entertainment, just like with my favorite actors or musicians.

I don't identify with being a part of Social D just because I love their music. I don't say "we just released an album" when they cut a new CD.

When they win, they get the glory and the money. We get to be entertained. That's what I want, to be entertained and watch fast past, highly skilled hockey from my favorite team.

I don't wear Pens or Steelers gear around or let their fortunes have any effect on my life. I spent most of the second half of the Steelers-Jax game making jokes and laughing about Tomlin living through Groundhogs Day every playoffs.

You have a favorite team, ergo you identify with them on some level. You chose them over all of the other possible teams. Taking what you say at face value, you're obviously less invested than most people and that's fine, but it's certainly no more normal or rational than someone who feels more invested in the fortunes of said team. It's just a choice that you made.

I don't understand what you mean by, "I was always me". You understand that you don't lose your individuality when you identify with a group, right? If you were to say "we're getting coffee", with the "we're" referring to a group of friends, you're still an individual as well. Any association that humans form exists on a spectrum. There probably are football fans who feel as if they're actually part of the team and have an unhealthy emotional dependency (something like Big Fan). There are also football fans who just want to see the sport be played well and don't really care about the outcome. Then there's you and me and everyone else that falls somewhere between those two extremes. No one degree between said extremes is inherently the right one so this whole discussion is really peculiar to me.

I think that if you (in the general sense, not you specifically) genuinely care about something as insignificant as someone's pronoun usage, you're pitiable.
 

Mr Jiggyfly

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Music is a very personal experience and what you get is a bunch of people gathering to experience it live. Very seldom do you get fandoms of separate artists who have a combative relationship.

Sports are communal. The teams are named after cities, states, regions, or school districts; and they typically have nicknames that represent the people or the area in some way. They are seen an extension of the community or region, not merely entertainment but something a step above.

You assume everyone cares about sports. I have a number of friends and cousins that are musically inclined and don't give a rats ass about sports, but feel very connected to certain musical artists/groups and defend them with a rabid fervor.

My cousin almost lost his shit when I said Hendrix was a better gutiarist than Stevie Ray Vaughn.

It's about people's passions and some feel connected to teams/artists/actors etc and others like myself just care about the entertainment value.

You have a favorite team, ergo you identify with them on some level. You chose them over all of the other possible teams. Taking what you say at face value, you're obviously less invested than most people and that's fine, but it's certainly no more normal or rational than someone who feels more invested in the fortunes of said team. It's just a choice that you made.

I don't understand what you mean by, "I was always me". You understand that you don't lose your individuality when you identify with a group, right? If you were to say "we're getting coffee", with the "we're" referring to a group of friends, you're still an individual as well. Any association that humans form exists on a spectrum. There probably are football fans who feel as if they're actually part of the team and have an unhealthy emotional dependency (something like Big Fan). There are also football fans who just want to see the sport be played well and don't really care about the outcome. Then there's you and me and everyone else that falls somewhere between those two extremes. No one degree between said extremes is inherently the right one so this whole discussion is really peculiar to me.

I think that if you (in the general sense, not you specifically) genuinely care about something as insignificant as someone's pronoun usage, you're pitiable.

I'm just me, nothing more. I don't take accomplishments others have and pretend I'm part of it. If I love a movie by a director I like or a song from my favorite group, I'm not going to refer to it as "our movie" or "our song"... I had nothing to do with it, I was simply entertained by the art and supported the artist by paying for the movie/CD. That's my part in it, nothing more.

With the Pens or Steelers, I don't identify with them or place my self-esteem in how they do. I want them to win, but it's not life or death for me.

I'm passionate about hockey and love talking about it, well beyond the Pens. I'm just not connected to the Pens on a personal level where I feel like a part of the team.

It's just how I'm wired and always was.

I just want the Pens/Steelers/Social D etc to entertain me, nothing more. I don't care about meeting any of them or their personal lives. I don't feel a connection to people I don't know. Just because I see them on TV doesn't mean we have a real connection beyond them being entertainers.

And once again, I don't care about other people's business and if they want to pretend to be a part of a team they don't play for. My point was for the third time, it's just funny how so many people conveniently switch their pronouns based on how well their team is doing, from "we" to "they".
 
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KIRK

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Watched the 30 for 30 'The Two Bills' last night. Interesting tidbit from the year the Giants, who weren't a top end team, beat the Bills in the SB: Belichick actually used 3 different game plans for each playoff game . . .

1. Against the power running Bears with a meh passing game, the 3-4 Giants used a 4-3 that completely threw the Bears.

2. Against the 49ers, Belichick told Parcells that their typical zone package would get shredded, so they ran man, which caught the 49ers off guard.

3. Against the Bills, who were as good as it got offensively in those days, they ran two down linemen with a bunch of dime behind it. They let Thurman run wild and basically forced the Bills receivers to make tough catches over the middle and take hits all day.

Look, feelings about Belichick are known. But, you look at that team, with that HC, that defensive coordinator, Al Groh and Romeo Crennel for assistants, an incomparable work ethic, and even THEY aren't so arrogant as to think that one size fits all defensively.

Reminded me yet again of why the Steelers defense fails in big games . . .
 

Shrimper

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Pittsburgh Riverhounds rebranding, new badge, jersey and 5k seats at stadium.





iPoTjpgG_400x400.jpg


New logo
 
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Shrimper

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The logo is better than the previous one but I feel like it would be better with 1999 across the middle with the footprint in the middle. No shield.
 

Big McLargehuge

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A shield within a shield is weird, and having a generic clip-art soccer ball on one of the shields is a knock. There's some decent elements in there as well, it's a huge upgrade on the 90s garbage it's replacing, but it could have been better.

Either way I'm glad they've erased the Everton blue from the motif. I have no feelings in any direction towards Everton, but having a Pittsburgh team with blue as a primary color bothered the hell out of me.
 

Brandinho

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A shield within a shield is weird, and having a generic clip-art soccer ball on one of the shields is a knock. There's some decent elements in there as well, it's a huge upgrade on the 90s garbage it's replacing, but it could have been better.

Either way I'm glad they've erased the Everton blue from the motif. I have no feelings in any direction towards Everton, but having a Pittsburgh team with blue as a primary color bothered the hell out of me.

Personally, I like the steel beams around the perimeter. That's a design that looks good even without context. Everything inside that is a mess. Look at the outline of the shield, for example. There's a uniform thickness of the outer layer until you get to the bottom. I guess they're trying to simulate being under the surface of the water, but it's so jarring and unaesthetic. The clip art football and the paw print just seem so lazy too. They could have designed something around a stylized hound's head that'd be so much nicer.

What they should have done was solicit submissions from fans. It would have been a cool way to energize the fanbase and they'd have probably come up with something far nicer. Just look at Leeds United. They designed an utter abortion of a badge, everyone hated it and, within an hour, they had scores of better submissions via twitter. Obviously, there's a big difference between football mad Leeds and Pittsburgh, but surely there are some fans with a graphic design background who can do better than that.
 

DanielPlainview

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You assume everyone cares about sports. I have a number of friends and cousins that are musically inclined and don't give a rats ass about sports, but feel very connected to certain musical artists/groups and defend them with a rabid fervor.

My cousin almost lost his **** when I said Hendrix was a better gutiarist than Stevie Ray Vaughn.

It's about people's passions and some feel connected to teams/artists/actors etc and others like myself just care about the entertainment value.

No, I don't assume that. I'm talking about people who care about sports.

That's fine but it's not the same. I'm guessing your cousin doesn't listen exclusively to Hendrix because liking Vaughn's or anyone else's rock music would be liking an opponent.

Music is just not combative like sports are. Get over it and yourself.
 

Mr Jiggyfly

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No, I don't assume that. I'm talking about people who care about sports.

That's fine but it's not the same. I'm guessing your cousin doesn't listen exclusively to Hendrix because liking Vaughn's or anyone else's rock music would be liking an opponent.

Music is just not combative like sports are. Get over it and yourself.

I follow other NFL and NHL teams, just like my cousin has other musicians he likes, but he adopted Vaughn’s style and that’s who he is loyal to.

You are literally trying to tell me something I know is true, isn’t. Silly as hell.

And if it offends you I don’t adopt others accomplishments as my own, that’s your own problem, not mine.

It’s entertainment, nothing more.
 

Brandinho

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Arizona might fire Sean Miller. IIRC he's from Pittsburgh. Pitt should scoop him up if they want to return to hoops relevancy.

Sean Miller's next job might be through a prison work program.

Pitt should throw money at Danny Hurley if they want to win. It remains to be seen if the administration will ever pony up the money for a good coach, though.
 

TNT87

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Sean Miller's next job might be through a prison work program.

Pitt should throw money at Danny Hurley if they want to win. It remains to be seen if the administration will ever pony up the money for a good coach, though.

Yeah, I think it's safe to say that Miller has bigger problems than coaching right now.
 

DanielPlainview

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I think trading Martavis Bryant would be damn stupid, but if they do it, I hope they can grab DaeSean Hamilton in the draft. Kid is being criminally underrated by the "experts" and I have no idea why.
 

ziggyjoe212

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Sean Miller's next job might be through a prison work program.

Pitt should throw money at Danny Hurley if they want to win. It remains to be seen if the administration will ever pony up the money for a good coach, though.
Excuse my ignorance but.... why would Miller go to prison? For paying recruits?
Why would the law care about NCAA violations at all?

This reminds me of when the senate was investigating steroid use in baseball. How is that even remotely relevant to US law in any way.
 
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