Blue Jays Discussion: The Good-bye Loup Version

[zeke]

I’m okay with this, especially if they are getting back another top prospect. Giles is legit, despite apparently having his own “baggage”.

if by "baggage" you mean a contender willingly stuck him in AAA permanently rather than have him on the team.

 

[phillipmike]

Geez, can you imagine if you are the Astros, you make this trade and he gets suspended again.

 

[hoc123]

they better sell Giles pronto.

Why? Better to bet on his underlying stats correcting his ERA and trade him this offseason, or next trade deadline.

 

[Melo Meds]

"Rebuilding"

 

[Discoverer]

if by "baggage" you mean a contender willingly stuck him in AAA permanently rather than have him on the team.

Yep. It's a very pre-2015 AA acquisition.

 

[The Nemesis]

Would it be better to forego Giles and get just prospects back? trading for a soon to by 28 year old closer seems like a good idea to buy low on the eve of a deep playoff run. At the start of what I had hoped would be a rebuild of sorts, I'm not sure.

There's always a market for good relievers at the deadline. Always. It's probably the most reliably tradeable asset a team can have outside of having extra solid starters to sell off (which doesn't always happen except in transition periods like with the Jays right now)

 

[zeke]

Why? Better to bet on his underlying stats correcting his ERA and trade him this offseason, or next trade deadline.

the astros couldn't even stand having him on their roster.

 

[Advanced stats]

While the supposed return isn't "terrible persay, it's still nonsensical.

What's the point in trading for a 28 year old closer? We won't compete till he's 30, and by then his arm is shot, or he signs somewhere else.

There's a scenario where we flip him, but that's a sell low scenario again, because GM's would know that we're up against a wall..

 

[Mach85]

I’m okay with this, especially if they are getting back another top prospect. Giles is legit, despite apparently having his own “baggage”.

Agreed. Giles was traded for Velasquez and Appel+, back when the latter was still a legit prospect and the former has turned out about as expected (mid-rotation arm). We were talking about selling Osuna for pennies on the dollar, but we're buying a former top closer for pennies on the dollar whose decline doesn't appear to be stuff or age-related. Don't get me wrong, I still hate making the deal now from a position of weakness. But if it was going to be done, Giles + another good piece isn't HORRIBLE. Gimme Whitley and I won't really complain.

 

[thehockeysong]

There's always a market for good relievers at the deadline. Always. It's probably the most reliably tradeable asset a team can have outside of having extra solid starters to sell off (which doesn't always happen except in transition periods like with the Jays right now)

100% on that front. I'm just wondering why they need to take him back in the first place as opposed to adding similar value in prospects now. Not sure why the jays need a closer right now.

 

[Mach85]

While the supposed return isn't "terrible persay, it's still nonsensical.

What's the point in trading for a 28 year old closer? We won't compete till he's 30, and by then his arm is shot, or he signs somewhere else.

There's a scenario where we flip him, but that's a sell low scenario again, because GM's would know that we're up against a wall..

Not if we rehabilitate his value and flip him next year.

 

[hoc123]

the astros couldn't even stand having him on their roster.

Yeah cause of his freakout at the Astros manager.

 

[Anthrax442]

Boo

 

[Woodman19]

I heard someone say Paulino + which would be a good starting point for me if we can't get Whitley or Tucker

 

[The Nemesis]

100% on that front. I'm just wondering why they need to take him back in the first place as opposed to adding similar value in prospects now. Not sure why the jays need a closer right now.

They can't get the really juicy pieces from the Astros right now, so rather than take some less interesting B-tier guys, they take Giles, let him get his **** together, and stand a chance of flipping him at the next deadline for something better than what the alternative offer from Houston was.

Basically it's like instead of taking $0.50 now they take Giles and figure they can turn him into $1 next year (or the off-season)

 

[zeke]

Yeah cause of his freakout at the Astros manager.

 

[BAM]

I really hope they get Tucker or Whitley lmao...jesus christ what a bad trade.

 

[phillipmike]

Remember Shapiro liking Francis Martes 2016.

Rumored Paulino would be solid too.

 

[Advanced stats]

Not if we rehabilitate his value and flip him next year.

That's tough to sell me on considering his chronic attitude issues.

 

[Walshy7]

Beating a water container the same as beating a girlfriend?

Edit: sorry that looks like a glove I thought it was a water container at first

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

If Tucker or Whitley aren't coming back......

Who'd we get? How many years control does Giles have?

If we don't get at least one of their top 10 prospects then Atkins really is a beta-male. lol

 

[Morgs]

Beating a water container the same as beating a girlfriend?

He punched himself in the face.

 

[Kurtz]

They can't get the really juicy pieces from the Astros right now, so rather than take some less interesting B-tier guys, they take Giles, let him get his **** together, and stand a chance of flipping him at the next deadline for something better than what the alternative offer from Houston was.

Basically it's like instead of taking $0.50 now they take Giles and figure they can turn him into $1 next year (or the off-season)

It's going to be hard getting the same type of value for Giles as we should have for Osuna, even if Giles rebounds...so let's hope the prospect add in is good.

 

[Paladin2799]

They can't get the really juicy pieces from the Astros right now, so rather than take some less interesting B-tier guys, they take Giles, let him get his **** together, and stand a chance of flipping him at the next deadline for something better than what the alternative offer from Houston was.

Basically it's like instead of taking $0.50 now they take Giles and figure they can turn him into $1 next year (or the off-season)

I still don't like dumping Osuna. He was a staple in Toronto and one of the best young closers in the game.

You should build around that and hope to rehab him.

 

[Mach85]

That's tough to sell me on considering his chronic attitude issues.

What chronic attitude issues? Swearing in the general direction of his manager once on his way off the mound? He's a loose cannon, alright. We're not talking about John Rocker here, or even Jonathan Papelbon. And Pap never had a problem finding work.