The Canadiens' popularity compared to that of the Maple Leafs

[Devourers]

I believe at the end of the day its about dead even, with the Toronto fanbase maybe being more lucrative due to their fans being in closer proximity, kind of like the yankees vs the red sox.

I do think they are very close in total numbers though. No way to really know for sure though.

 

[ADifferentTim]

As an outsider looking in, the fact that Montreal Canadiens fans do not refer to their hometown franchise as "Canada's Team" reminds me of Yankees fans, not referring to the Bronx Bombers as "America's Team".

No wonder parallels between the Dallas Cowboys and Toronto Maple Leafs makes sense in context.

 

[RealityBytes]

Population isn't the ultimate factor when comparing fan bases, Ditchweed. What you forgot to add was the fact that Ontario - specifically the Toronto area - is populated by numerous people who relocated there from the other provinces. Many maintaining their sports allegiances (NHL, CFL, etc).

By your rationale. Are the N.Y. Rangers the most beloved U.S. team? I'd say no. NFL's Jets and/or Giants? Hardly. Knicks? Doubt it. Yankees? Yes! Mostly because of their vast success over the past century.

The major difference between Montreal and Toronto's following is simple. As I, and others, have already stated. Each team has many supporters across Canada. Whereas there's a plethora of Canadiens fans living right here in Ontario - myself included. The same can't be said about Toronto's (very minimal) influence within Quebec.

As one drives towards London, Windsor and Sarnia. They will encounter a vibrant Red Wings base. No different out around Niagara Region where the Sabres have a long standing presence. Travel towards Ottawa and Kingston and the amount of Leaf fans is replaced by those cheering for Ottawa or Montreal.

We're about 40 km west of Toronto. I look no further my my little one's school. The noticeable amount of young children wearing Canadiens, Capitals, Penguins, Bruins, Wings or Flyers gear. Some of this is encouraged by a parent or the kids just want to follow a team that usually qualifies in the playoffs.

Scroll up and read that (Edmonton) article. It might enlighten you.

Do you think Luongo felt at home during this goal?

Well, I've lived in many areas across Canada including southern Ontario and I have seen many fans jerseys, Habs jerseys included but certainly not a predominance of Habs jerseys over any others. No more than I have seen Boston jerseys in Montreal of which there are quite a few. Of course there are many fans for many of the NHL teams across Canada, and some are Habs fans but that does not equate to Montreal being Canada's team. Canada has many fans of many NHL teams all across the country, Canadian and US teams as well, and that's the point.

The point still stays the same, Montreal is a regional team and no more, the Leafs are the same, just in different areas and neither have the right to claim to being called Canada's team. Any biased data or ostrich like personal perceptions you may want to dig up to support anything different can be countered with the like and deny your argument. Maybe you should get enlightened and take off the homer hat.

(BTW, population of Quebec is 8 million, population of the golden horseshoe and connected areas is 11.5 million.) If you are to say there are more other fans than Leafs fans in southern Ontario, you are absolutely nuts. It's Leafs nation all over down there.

As for success for teams, keep in mind that within the last 35 years, the Edmonton Oilers are the most successful team in Canada with five Stanley cup wins. Are the Oilers Canada's team? ... no. Vancouver had the last big run at a Stanley cup going to the 7th game of the finals. Are the Canuck's Canada's team? ... no. Neither is Montreal or Toronto who are just "also ran" regional teams with larger fan bases that haven't done much in the last few decades.

Canada's team is the national team captained by Sid Crosby and other Canadian players that played in the Olympics. That is Canada's team and no one NHL league team is Canada's team nor can make the claim. Period.

 

[Raimu]

Depends on how you define fan. 90% of Toronto "fans" I know aren't aware that Doug Gilmore doesn't play anymore.

 

[InAG-P]

It`s funny, I just moved to Toronto, have been wearing my jersey and using my Habs cup at work (over 2000 employees) and have getting more compliments than jeers (hardly any). This city has become quite indifferent over the years, the Habs fans are more vocal and all Leaf fans end up saying is..... ''yeah, I know '' hahahaha. What a fan base, what a proud base

I just moved to T.O. in October as well and have been doing the same and get a lot more compliments than jeers as well.

1) There are a lot more Habs Fans in Toronto than Leafs fans in Montreal. Walking around downtown you'll see at least one-two people per day wearing Habs apparel.

2) Hardcore Leafs fans themselves (at work etc) were surprisingly supportive of the Habs during the playoff run this year.

 

[habfaninvictoria]

awesome, MTL beats the TO'S facebook and twitter numbers. Now that the 12 year old girls have spoken, i wonder who the rest prefer. please close this thread soon. the comments are going to be cringeworthy

So says the 14 year old boy.

Cynicism aside.
Even if this were only the 12 year old girls, presumably each team would have the same numbers proportionally through demographics (I'm sure the leafs have 12 year old girls as fans).

Arguably the more years that pass with the leafs being irrelevant a larger portion of their fans are dying (the Don Cherry's of the world).
Toronto views itself as the centre of the universe.

The franchise is worth more than any in the league, there revenue is higher, but how much of this is because they have been unfairly positioned by CBC as "Canada's Team".

The habs, in spite of that disadvantage nationally, still have roughly the same sized fanbase. Hab fans have had to be resourceful in order to follow their team, whereas the leafs are crammed down everyone's throat.

I like having the information this OP provides.

 

[RealityBytes]

I just moved to T.O. in October as well and have been doing the same and get a lot more compliments than jeers as well.

1) There are a lot more Habs Fans in Toronto than Leafs fans in Montreal. Walking around downtown you'll see at least one-two people per day wearing Habs apparel.

2) Hardcore Leafs fans themselves (at work etc) were surprisingly supportive of the Habs during the playoff run this year.

I sort of agree with this and, as mentioned to me by a female Habs fan is that a lot has to do with emotions. "Habs fans definitely are more emotionally involved than Leafs fans." As she said, "Yes we're very emotional about the Canadiens because hockey is pretty much all we have."

In Montreal, it is now basically a one sport town with the dismal Alouettes and Impact not doing anything so sports passion all rides on the Habs for an all or nothing emotional roller coaster ride of extreme. In Toronto, at the end of hockey season, fans just turn to the Blue Jays to continue sports, and also have the Raptors during the season if the Leafs lose, and even their MLS and CFL teams are doing fairly well. The Leafs are just one of their teams and they have more options to turn to and dilute their emotions. They just aren't as emotionally involved.

To add, walking around with a Habs jersey in Toronto is considered OK with the Habs just considered another team, but in Montreal, if a person would walk around with a Leafs or Senators jersey they get jeered and heckled like a hated pariah with some of it getting extreme even to the point where it even affects kids. Closer to home, a friend of my wife who moved here from Toronto wore her Leafs jersey once to her part time school job and was literally berated as an enemy so she said she'll never wear it in Montreal again. In Toronto it's more like ... meh, Habs are just another team.

In the other five Canadian cities, it seems to be more like Toronto in that there is more tolerance of other teams, at least from what I saw and hear, even though there aren't other major sports in all those cities. In Montreal though, it is like there is such an emotional hatred of Toronto that it would be safer to walk around with a swastika instead of a Leafs jersey.

I think she's right. I wasn't born here and just don't get emotionally involved with any sports but rather just try to look at it in a pure analytical fashion. It's probably why I don't get why some posters get so overly emotional about little nothings.

 

[S Bah]

Due to their respective history. Both clubs are popular Original Six franchises that have legions of passionate fan support.

We all know the Dallas Cowboys old moniker of being "America's Team." The Canadiens, as an organization, have never bothered to label themselves as "Canada's Team." Should they?

While a number of Toronto fans believe in their own (biased) self-proclamations of the Maple Leafs being "Canada's Team."



The TML's arena was built on the backs of Canadian tradesmen, that were paid in kind for work with shares in the Leafs, making their success the common man's success. During the 60's the Leafs had F.Mahovlich, D.Keon, J.Bower and brought together a team for 1967's Olympics in Montreal. The Stanley Cup Final being between the Habs/TML's, the spotlight squarely focused upon the epic struggle of Canada's teams.

The timing a precursor to the election of P.E.Trudeau in 1968, a time of unrest for many Conservatives and Canadians, all in the spotlight of the world, the FLQ still to play out yet. The TML's won that series, the underdog team that beat the invincible Habs, becoming Canada's team mainly due to that win during a time of unrest in the country.

The simple facts are that the Montreal team and it's Quebec based fans, adored the Flying Frenchmen as they were called. Many of the Habs from those teams weren't of French descent, Doug Harvey for one, native born Montrealer though. The Habs were the best team with the most depth of talent, due to the efforts of their front office being the most knowledgeable hockey people money could buy.

Toronto Maple Leafs often slagged by our fans, as their fans are equally guilty of doing, should embrace their team, Toronto based teams winning 14 SC's, Montreal based teams winning 39 SC's, for a grand total of 53 SC's won between the two greatest Canadian SC winning cities. A fact that all Canadians can be proud of instead of deriding the efforts of each others cities, at least IMHO.

With a grand total of three SC's won in the last three decades by Canadian teams, the focus by all the Canadian teams should be cooperation in efforts to help build our cities teams into profitable winning organizations. Hockey is on the verge of joining the elite sports, with TV and sponsorships from advertising/marketing bringing our national sport into the world spotlight. Not nearly in the World Cup(Soccer) range, but certainly better than ever before in it's 111 seasons.

While it's fun bragging about our teams successes to other teams fans, true Canadian & Hockey fans should be concerned with the health of our franchises and the sport's welfare also. My love for hockey knows no boundaries and the yearning for another Montreal, Stanley Cup win is IMHO needed for continuous growth for our youth programs. WJHC's are nice, having a huge percentage of NHL players from Canada is equally important, but having a Canadian city win the SC symbol of the world's best hockey team, is far more important after a 21yr. absence as Title Holder.:nod

I have lived in 5 provinces and spent significant time in the remainder of them and the territories....as well as the US and Europe.

The Leafs are popular in ONT and western Canada, But the Habs seem to be right on par or moreso. Habs have a marked advantage in the US and Europe.

Being considered the home or "french" team in Quebec definately helps them there.

Being a rounder myself, I can verify the Habs following worldwide is without doubt the greatest in hockey, while the Leafs is like you say huge in Ont. and the western provinces, as is matched only by the Habs fans therein.

 

[Noisespektrum]

Due to their respective history. Both clubs are popular Original Six franchises that have legions of passionate fan support.

We all know the Dallas Cowboys old moniker of being "America's Team." The Canadiens, as an organization, have never bothered to label themselves as "Canada's Team." Should they?

While a number of Toronto fans believe in their own (biased) self-proclamations of the Maple Leafs being "Canada's Team."



The TML's arena was built on the backs of Canadian tradesmen, that were paid in kind for work with shares in the Leafs, making their success the common man's success. During the 60's the Leafs had F.Mahovlich, D.Keon, J.Bower and brought together a team for 1967's Olympics in Montreal. The Stanley Cup Final being between the Habs/TML's, the spotlight squarely focused upon the epic struggle of Canada's teams.

The timing a precursor to the election of P.E.Trudeau in 1968, a time of unrest for many Conservatives and Canadians, all in the spotlight of the world, the FLQ still to play out yet. The TML's won that series, the underdog team that beat the invincible Habs, becoming Canada's team mainly due to that win during a time of unrest in the country.

The simple facts are that the Montreal team and it's Quebec based fans, adored the Flying Frenchmen as they were called. Many of the Habs from those teams weren't of French descent, Doug Harvey for one, native born Montrealer though. The Habs were the best team with the most depth of talent, due to the efforts of their front office being the most knowledgeable hockey people money could buy.

Toronto Maple Leafs often slagged by our fans, as their fans are equally guilty of doing, should embrace their team, Toronto based teams winning 14 SC's, Montreal based teams winning 39 SC's, for a grand total of 53 SC's won between the two greatest Canadian SC winning cities. A fact that all Canadians can be proud of instead of deriding the efforts of each others cities, at least IMHO.

With a grand total of two SC's won in the last three decades by Canadian teams, the focus by all the Canadian teams should be cooperation in efforts to help build our cities teams into profitable winning organizations. Hockey is on the verge of joining the elite sports, with TV and sponsorships from advertising/marketing bringing our national sport into the world spotlight. Not nearly in the World Cup(Soccer) range, but certainly better than ever before in it's 111 seasons.

While it's fun bragging about our teams successes to other teams fans, true Canadian & Hockey fans should be concerned with the health of our franchises and the sport's welfare also. My love for hockey knows no boundaries and the yearning for another Montreal, Stanley Cup win is IMHO needed for continuous growth for our youth programs. WJHC's are nice, having a huge percentage of NHL players from Canada is equally important, but having a Canadian city win the SC symbol of the world's best hockey team, is far more important after a 21yr. absence as Title Holder.:nod




Being a rounder myself, I can verify the Habs following worldwide is without doubt the greatest in hockey, while the Leafs is like you say huge in Ont. and the western provinces, as is matched only by the Habs fans therein.

proof?

 

[Chet-Nick]

Well, I've lived in many areas across Canada including southern Ontario and I have seen many fans jerseys, Habs jerseys included but certainly not a predominance of Habs jerseys over any others. No more than I have seen Boston jerseys in Montreal of which there are quite a few. Of course there are many fans for many of the NHL teams across Canada, and some are Habs fans but that does not equate to Montreal being Canada's team. Canada has many fans of many NHL teams all across the country, Canadian and US teams as well, and that's the point.

The point still stays the same, Montreal is a regional team and no more, the Leafs are the same, just in different areas and neither have the right to claim to being called Canada's team. Any biased data or ostrich like personal perceptions you may want to dig up to support anything different can be countered with the like and deny your argument. Maybe you should get enlightened and take off the homer hat.

(BTW, population of Quebec is 8 million, population of the golden horseshoe and connected areas is 11.5 million.) If you are to say there are more other fans than Leafs fans in southern Ontario, you are absolutely nuts. It's Leafs nation all over down there.

As for success for teams, keep in mind that within the last 35 years, the Edmonton Oilers are the most successful team in Canada with five Stanley cup wins. Are the Oilers Canada's team? ... no. Vancouver had the last big run at a Stanley cup going to the 7th game of the finals. Are the Canuck's Canada's team? ... no. Neither is Montreal or Toronto who are just "also ran" regional teams with larger fan bases that haven't done much in the last few decades.

Canada's team is the national team captained by Sid Crosby and other Canadian players that played in the Olympics. That is Canada's team and no one NHL league team is Canada's team nor can make the claim. Period.

My original point (post) was the Canadiens popularity versus that of the Maple Leafs. By drawing parallels/comparisons with TV ratings, social media interest, public opinion polls and internet habits. Montreal, if you recall, fared better in all four of these areas. Yes, Canada's Olympic Team definitely unifies the country. That's a separate topic/entity.

There you go with population again. The most recent regional viewing data I found was from 2009-10. Montreal (RDS) 688,000 and Toronto (Sportsnet Ont) 656,400. With such a massive amount of people around the Golden Horseshoe. As you keep reminding us. Why wasn't Toronto ahead, in this category, by hundreds of thousands? Vancouver (Sportsnet Pacific), if you care, was third with 398,500.

Toronto lost much of their swagger after 1967. Especially during the infamous Ballard era. That has created generations of people, from Southern Ontario, that simply don't care for the Maple Leafs. After the Canadiens hoisted the cup in 1993. In a matter of years, they began to slip from their perch. Detroit has gained tons of support, in this region, over the past two decades. I'm sure that applies in other parts of Canada too. Success breads interest. Star power is everything.

 

[RealityBytes]

My original point (post) was the Canadiens popularity versus that of the Maple Leafs. By drawing parallels/comparisons with TV ratings, social media interest, public opinion polls and internet habits. Montreal, if you recall, fared better in all four of these areas. Yes, Canada's Olympic Team definitely unifies the country. That's a separate topic/entity.

There you go with population again. The most recent regional viewing data I found was from 2009-10. Montreal (RDS) 688,000 and Toronto (Sportsnet Ont) 656,400. With such a massive amount of people around the Golden Horseshoe. As you keep reminding us. Why wasn't Toronto ahead, in this category, by hundreds of thousands? Vancouver (Sportsnet Pacific), if you care, was third with 398,500.

Toronto lost much of their swagger after 1967. Especially during the infamous Ballard era. That has created generations of people, from Southern Ontario, that simply don't care for the Maple Leafs. After the Canadiens hoisted the cup in 1993. In a matter of years, they began to slip from their perch. Detroit has gained tons of support, in this region, over the past two decades. I'm sure that applies in other parts of Canada too. Success breads interest. Star power is everything.

What on earth are you babbling about ... if you want to make believe you are right with some trumped up blurbs, so be it. Believe any delusion you want.

However, on track to the main point of all this, neither the Leafs nor the Habs, nor any regional NHL team can make the valid claim they are Canada's team. Period. Live with it.

 

[Chet-Nick]

What on earth are you babbling about ... if you want to make believe you are right with some trumped up blurbs, so be it. Believe any delusion you want.

However, on track to the main point of all this, neither the Leafs nor the Habs, nor any regional NHL team can make the valid claim they are Canada's team. Period. Live with it.

You know. I don't remember specifically asking for your opinion. But, like everyone here, you're most certainly entitled to one. Not that I have to abide by it. I'm glad you got those (strong personal beliefs) out of your system though. By the way, I generally deal with facts/numbers. SHEESH!

 

[RealityBytes]

You know. I don't remember asking for your opinion. But, like everyone here, you're most certainly entitled to one. Not that I have to believe or respect it. I'm glad you got that out of your system. SHEESH!

Out of my system? Seriously ...

Your quote of "The Canadiens, as an organization, have never bothered to label themselves as "Canada's Team." Should they?"

It's just that when I see some silly nonsense like that based on garbage data I try to refute it since other people may start believing it.

 

[habs88]

Just came back from Toronto wore nothing but habs shirtseys or wtv they're called and got more compliments and only 1 dirty look not even an insult it was a joke lol I was expecting at least one person to say something but nothing only habs fans were stopping me and their were quiete a few

 

[Chet-Nick]

Out of my system? Seriously ...

Your quote of "The Canadiens, as an organization, have never bothered to label themselves as "Canada's Team." Should they?"

It's just that when I see some silly nonsense like that based on garbage data I try to refute it since other people may start believing it.

"Garbage data?" To whom - you? Please. Spare us of your message board self-righteousness.

I initially presented four areas where the Canadiens had an edge with their fan base. You can attempt to "refute" it until you're red/blue in the face.

It is what it is. Results. Research. Numbers. All of which hold more credibility than you trying to diminish/ignore them. Be well.

 

[Chet-Nick]

Just came back from Toronto wore nothing but habs shirtseys or wtv they're called and got more compliments and only 1 dirty look not even an insult it was a joke lol I was expecting at least one person to say something but nothing only habs fans were stopping me and their were quiete a few

You don't have to live in Toronto to realize how the face of that city has rapidly changed.

Huge influx of immigrants over the years. Tons of people, from other provinces, have also found employment there. The only place that's somewhat comparable, these days, is Alberta.

On a Habs aspect. You have Torontonians that grew up being fans of the Canadiens. Then, from the mid-70's until the early 80's, a number of Quebecers left a very chaotic political climate and found peace in Toronto. A perfect storm.

 

[Akhurite]

Well Toronto and its surroundings have a way higher population then Montreal.
I also live in Toronto and can tell you straight up that most Toronto fan's aren't as passionate.

 

[Compile]

I live 25 mins from TO. There are equal amount of Habs fans in my area.

No one gives a **** about Toronto as they have done nothing the past 40 years, and the intelligent fans have given up as all MLSE cares about is money (ticket prices went up 40% last play offs, after not making them for 8 ****ing years).

Their fan base is a joke.

 

[Ice Poutine]

Well Toronto and its surroundings have a way higher population then Montreal.
I also live in Toronto and can tell you straight up that most Toronto fan's aren't as passionate.

A question comes to mind: since you live in Toronto maybe you could tell me something: do they sell a lot of Leafs jersey with the number 1967 in the back? You know.. for very old times sake?

 

[S Bah]

Canada's team is called Team Canada, you know the one that wins most WJHC's & of late the Olympic Gold Medals both Men's & Women's usually. Not a stretch considering hockey is our sport, when our best are playing they usually win, other countries emulate our teams in hopes of becoming the best, not a stretch either!

 

[bigtimehockeyfan999*]

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/canadiens-considered-canada-s-team-poll-1.846893

 

[JohnLennon]

awesome, MTL beats the TO'S facebook and twitter numbers. Now that the 12 year old girls have spoken, i wonder who the rest prefer. please close this thread soon. the comments are going to be cringeworthy

He posted the viewership for extremely comparable playoff games between Habs and Leafs. Habs had more viewers by a large margin. Are you trying to say only 12 year old girls watch NHL playoffs?

Why be childish just because you're upset with the data someone has presented to you?

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

awesome, MTL beats the TO'S facebook and twitter numbers. Now that the 12 year old girls have spoken, i wonder who the rest prefer. please close this thread soon. the comments are going to be cringeworthy

"As of March 2013, Facebook reported having 1.11 billion monthly active users, globally."

I would just like to point out that is 1/7th of the entire world's population. Lot of "12 year old girls," I guess.

 

[digmor crusher]

1.1 billion losers who need a life.

 

[Picaroon]

It`s funny, I just moved to Toronto, have been wearing my jersey and using my Habs cup at work (over 2000 employees) and have getting more compliments than jeers (hardly any). This city has become quite indifferent over the years, the Habs fans are more vocal and all Leaf fans end up saying is..... ''yeah, I know '' hahahaha. What a fan base, what a proud base

This about sums it up. I moved to Toronto 2 years ago. On a whole, Toronto is very indifferent towards the leafs. There are lots of die hard fans, but they even seem to give up on the team quite easily. Can't say I blame them.

Our passion outweighs their's by a looooooot. Nobody can argue that.