Toronto FC: TFC Discussion

[Incognito]

The better team truly lost tonight. Seattle had zero shots on goal. It makes me feel gross that a championship was decided by a shootout (but that's the hockey fan in me talking - I get that it's not plausible to keep playing continuous OTs in soccer).

 

[SenorDingDong]

So take players off in OT and open it up, and don't have the possibility for PK and fatigue will decide the game which seems fair enough to me.

I get these guys run a lot, but I swear there's like a dozen guys on the sidelines warming up while the game is going. Allow more substitutions in OT. Heck allow endless substitutions but only during stoppage, allow guys that were previously substituted to come back.

I just think there are solutions to this type of ending to a game and football people are really reluctant to try something different. The PK is just a really lame way to end such a tight match IMO.

But I'm not a fan (love the Euro and World cup though) so I'll leave it at that.

The Euro and World Cup use the exact same formula.

No soccer fan likes PK's though. They just haven't figured out anything better yet.

 

[Quarter]

So take players off in OT and open it up, and don't have the possibility for PK and fatigue will decide the game which seems fair enough to me.

I get these guys run a lot, but I swear there's like a dozen guys on the sidelines warming up while the game is going. Allow more substitutions in OT. Heck allow endless substitutions but only during stoppage, allow guys that were previously substituted to come back.

I just think there are solutions to this type of ending to a game and football people are really reluctant to try something different. The PK is just a really lame way to end such a tight match IMO.

But I'm not a fan (love the Euro and World cup though) so I'll leave it at that.

Reducuing the number of players on the field, especially after 90 minutes when players have already started to fatigue, would make it even easier to play keep-away with the ball. Increasing the number of subs in extra time has been talked about. It's a solution, but I have no idea how close FIFA or any other league is to implementing it. But in the end it doesn't matter what sort of format is used. You'll always have teams not wanting to risk anything in extra time. You can't outlaw playing cautiously.

 

[ErnieLeafs]

The better team loat to.curcumstance. simple as that.

 

[Rayban*]

A team just won a championship game without a shot on goal, let alone actually scoring...this is why soccer is a joke. Defending it is like defending 3rd world social policies just because millions of ignorant people believe in them lol.

 

[garyjones93]

You would have to increase the amount of subs then.

It's not like hockey or basketball where you can change lines and swap players. Or like football or baseball where the players have constant breaks.

Actually this would be a good idea, either an additional sub during ET, or and addition sub per ET half.

 

[bobermay]

To those saying that soccer is a joke because the better team lost, or they didn't get a shot on goal...

Thats what actually makes soccer unique and great in a way... Had we been in Seattles shoes, we'd be cellebrating like no other. It doesn't matter who played the better game, it matters who gets the better result. This was a well fought game by both sides, and could have gone either way.

 

[SEER]

Dude you picked a really old pick of BMO field.

It now looks like this:

But yea. first cup game in Toronto since the Jays in 93.

I thought it was a nice photo.. and didn't take into account about the changes... Probably, because I haven't seen them, yet.. Apologies..

 

[htpwn]

For all my hate towards shootouts in the NHL, penalty kicks in soccer have always had a special place in hell in my mind. It is inconceivable that a game, let alone a championship, should end with goalies guessing sides in an episode of 90% luck. Last night's loss was one of the more egregious examples: If you fail to put a shot on goal in 120 minutes of football (and put only three attempts at the net), you should not win the game. It's not the beauty of the game, it's an affront to it and sport in general.

The MLS had an opportunity last night to make some real in-roads. In spite of themselves, they still might make them, but there's no doubt that ending is going to leave a lot of casual fans miffed. Another opportunity now presents itself. With a championship being awarded to a team in such ridiculous circumstances, they now have the excuse needed to change this system. They're a young league, not needing to be bound to the traditions of Europe. Figure something out. Experiment. The NHL struck gold with the 3-on-3 system. Maybe consider something similar: Remove players from the pitch, opening up space on the pitch for skill to flourish. Heck, shoot corners for all I care. I'd be a massive improvement and at least they are regular part of the game. Recently, FIFA got rid of the meaningless requirement that teams go forward with the ball at the beginning of games/halves. It was well-received. Tradition be damned.

 

[Morbo]

Seattle pulls a Portugal. No shots and they win, insane.

not sure what there is to say. At least we beat the Impact in an important game, that felt good.

 

[hoglund]

Seattle pulls a Portugal. No shots and they win, insane.

not sure what there is to say. At least we beat the Impact in an important game, that felt good.

I thought they had 3 shots, I can't give an informed opinion on this because I didn't watch the game, but if you can't even get a shot on net, then there's no way that you deserved to win.

 

[Daisy Jane]

I thought they had 3 shots, I can't give an informed opinion on this because I didn't watch the game, but if you can't even get a shot on net, then there's no way that you deserved to win.

Mirtle said they attempted 3 shots on goal - but none of them really hit the net.

I'm not the biggest soccer fan, (I'll watch Canada in a championship game, or TFC in the playoffs). but as totally a casual fan - this really turned me off. I mean sure. congrats to Seattle, and their fan base. you won, legitimately, good on you.

However, had ti been reversed, I'd say that while it was great that TFC won, that would have been a chinzy way to win it. ah well. we build on this and hopefully win next year.

 

[Shimso]

Mirtle said they attempted 3 shots on goal - but none of them really hit the net.

I'm not the biggest soccer fan, (I'll watch Canada in a championship game, or TFC in the playoffs). but as totally a casual fan - this really turned me off. I mean sure. congrats to Seattle, and their fan base. you won, legitimately, good on you.

However, had ti been reversed, I'd say that while it was great that TFC won, that would have been a chinzy way to win it. ah well. we build on this and hopefully win next year.

Seattle was outshot 19-3; none of those 3 shots were on net (and if I'm not mistaken, the first shot of theirs came 8 minutes before the end of regulation).

It's disappointing to see a team play like that and win.

 

[egd27]

Remove the goalie in OT. Another player can play the posit but cannot use their hands.

30 min full OT, if still tied, sudden death, with some kind of "crease" that defenders cannot enter.

 

[Zybalto]

Its one of the big things thats always turned me off soccer....penalties.

I dont understand why they dont just play till a goal is scored in finals. One team is going to run outta gas eventually and its not going to harm future games cause there are none. Coaching, stamina and strategy get pushed to new levels and there will never be any dispute that the best team won.

Ive seen too many inferior teams win championships because of skills competitions over the years. Could you imagine if the NHL adopted it for the playoffs?

The weirdest thing I always hear is...."well thats football".......

If thats football, then football needs to be changed.

NHL hockey, the NFL, MLB, the NBA....they all are far more satisfying in determining a champion. MLS should break with this stupid rule and institute an unlimited time golden goal rule for finals. It would be the most riveting soccer anyone will ever see.

 

[BTP]

lmao montreal board celebrating our loss as if they won the championship. embarrassing.

anyhow. penalties to decide a championship game is a joke, zero shots on net and winning it all... take your soccer ball and go home. thats ridiculous

 

[hoglund]

lmao montreal board celebrating our loss as if they won the championship. embarrassing.

anyhow. penalties to decide a championship game is a joke, zero shots on net and winning it all... take your soccer ball and go home. thats ridiculous

I've never been a fan of shoot outs, since the NHL introduced the shoot out to decide games, I've hated it. WTF would a game be decided on luck? please explain how a team game gets decided on one on one luck, play until someone really wins.

 

[Lust4LEAFS]

i tuned in to watch the 2nd half and was not surprised to see a soccer match end in again a 0-0 tie, i just dont get it i really dont. Not 1 shot on net for Seattle!

You dont have a shootout to determine a championship, just gross!

People are saying players get tired so you cant go on longer than 120 minutes. Why do soccer teams have a 100 spares and only allow 3 subs? Hilarious. Substitute like a normal sport and let changes in and out at any time, even on the fly like hockey.

 

[The CyNick]

To those saying that soccer is a joke because the better team lost, or they didn't get a shot on goal...

Thats what actually makes soccer unique and great in a way... Had we been in Seattles shoes, we'd be cellebrating like no other. It doesn't matter who played the better game, it matters who gets the better result. This was a well fought game by both sides, and could have gone either way.

Of course if you win you're happy with the result.

You can still be objective and say is bush league to decide a league title on penalties. Its what soccer does throughout the world, but it's still ********.

Play til someone scores seems like a simple solution.

 

[Epictetus]

Just some of my thoughts...

-Portugal had 3 shots on target (5 off target), one post, and 5 corners. Plus, they scored in the extra period time period to win the game, 1-0 over France. The Final did not go to penalty kicks. Why is that even mentioned here? What's the relevance?

-Some teams are more defensive than others, and they are constructed to systematically, as a team-unit, smother the opposing team's individual attacking talents and pull out either a draw or that one opportunistic chance to win the game.

There's no wage or transfer cap in European football, nor any kind of barrier to teams like Spain or Germany developing international talent, so you will always see attacking styles contrasted with defensive-mentality. It's unreasonable to expect teams that cannot match the attacking talents of the other team to try and play that style and win. They will almost certainly lose. I'll take winning over being entertaining and appeasing fans, any day.

-PK's are done throughout the football world and globe, in like every major tournament. Making this a case against the MLS is....weird? Additionally, there used to be 'Golden Goal', or sudden death OT. It was widely regarded as a failure though, hence the change. Teams were way too afraid to go out and attack, preferring to keep their players in consistent positions, taking almost no chances. So you got an extremely dull spectacle with defensive football being prominent.

 

[LeafsTFC]

I mean sure you could make massive changes to extra time but I think there are smaller changes that you could make to make sure skill shines through and you don't get a 0-0 score after 120 minutes. And these changes IMO are already in the rules - it's just about properly enforcing the rules:

- An automatic yellow card for any obvious time wasting, such as when players get called for a foul and they pick up the ball and run away with it or kick it away. You were called for a foul and the other team gets to restart play when they want (subject to situations where the ref is holding things up to speak to a player). If you come down hard on this kind of time wasting and someone can get ejected for doing it twice, there will be way less of it. This stuff eats up a ton of soccer games and doesn't get accurately reflected in a lengthy stoppage time IMO. Which brings me to the next point ...
- All across the world I feel like stoppage time is underestimated. It seems like 4th officials default to calling for a single minute in the first half, no matter what happens in the first half. The reffing crew called for a bit more at the end of the first half last night but I bet if you started and stopped a stopwatch you'd get a longer period of time. The 4th official only has to coordinate subs and keep subs and coaches from not going berserk so surely we can have a game where the stoppage time called for is actually the amount of time that the ball isn't in play. AFAIK the 4th official is actually running a stopwatch to count stoppage time so I'm not sure why the amount of extra time always is so low
- Players who go down for injuries currently have to go off the field for a period of time. This is a good rule because it ostensibly discourages people from faking injuries to waste time (you effectively go on the PK (in hockey terms) while your guy is on the sideline). But refs need to hold out players from returning for much longer. If you're so injured that you require a stretcher or to slowly limp off, I'm not letting you back onto the field for at least 5 minutes. Maybe 10. After all, if you were that hurt, there's no way you're medically ready to return after 30 seconds. So players need to consider if they want to waste time to put their team down a man for quite a bit of time. And going down a man is a massive advantage for the opponent in soccer.

IMO all of these measures would discourage time-wasting and encourage the offence and skill to shine through. As I said, you can tweak extra-time if you want, but there's something to love about requiring teams to play 11 on 11 with limited subs. It puts an emphasis on strategy and good quality defending (i.e. clean slide tackles not pulling the shirt and that stuff). Those are some of the things I love about soccer and I want to keep them.

 

[AllDay28]

Just some of my thoughts...

-Portugal had 3 shots on target (5 off target), one post, and 5 corners. Plus, they scored in the extra period time period to win the game, 1-0 over France. The Final did not go to penalty kicks. Why is that even mentioned here? What's the relevance?

-Some teams are more defensive than others, and they are constructed to systematically, as a team-unit, smother the opposing team's individual attacking talents and pull out either a draw or that one opportunistic chance to win the game.

There's no wage or transfer cap in European football, nor any kind of barrier to teams like Spain or Germany developing international talent, so you will always see attacking styles contrasted with defensive-mentality. It's unreasonable to expect teams that cannot match the attacking talents of the other team to try and play that style and win. They will almost certainly lose. I'll take winning over being entertaining and appeasing fans, any day.

-PK's are done throughout the football world and globe, in like every major tournament. Making this a case against the MLS is....weird? Additionally, there used to be 'Golden Goal', or sudden death OT. It was widely regarded as a failure though, hence the change. Teams were way too afraid to go out and attack, preferring to keep their players in consistent positions, taking almost no chances. So you got an extremely dull spectacle with defensive football being prominent.

how is this any diff than parking the bus and going to a shootout? im confused.

in the end, I was trying super hard to get into soccer. for a few yrs now. but last night sent MLS back about 20 yrs as its the laughing stock of most euro fans who stayed up to watch this joke.

 

[hoglund]

To those saying that soccer is a joke because the better team lost, or they didn't get a shot on goal...

Thats what actually makes soccer unique and great in a way... Had we been in Seattles shoes, we'd be cellebrating like no other. It doesn't matter who played the better game, it matters who gets the better result. This was a well fought game by both sides, and could have gone either way.

I don't think anyone would be happy to "win" when you didn't deserve it, it's a shallow victory, how can you feel proud of yourself when you didn't play well?

 

[LeafsTFC]

in the end, I was trying super hard to get into soccer. for a few yrs now. but last night sent MLS back about 20 yrs as its the laughing stock of most euro fans who stayed up to watch this joke.

I'm confused as to why any European soccer fan would use a championship ending in a 0-0 tie and going to penalties as a reason to not follow MLS? That happens all the time in Europe. Chelsea won the Champions's League by parking the bus and no one was advocating massive rule changes after that.

 

[AllDay28]

I'm confused as to why any European soccer fan would use a championship ending in a 0-0 tie and going to penalties as a reason to not follow MLS? That happens all the time in Europe. Chelsea won the Champions's League by parking the bus and no one was advocating massive rule changes after that.

because the game looked like 3rd level soccer. It wasn't even entertaining.

also im guessing the parked bus was Chelsea-Bayern? When it was 1-1 at PK? So..Chelsea got a shot and scored? also they had 9 shots, 3 on target, and 44% possession so I dont quite get the "park the bus" reference..