OT: Team Defence Discussion - 2022/23

[GCK]

So in an effort to find a pair that didn't suck, DJ proceeds to ice a pair in Chabot and Zaitsev that absolutely sucks? When a player has played 3 games, there's not enough data to even say a game is an outlier. DJ upped Zaitsev's play even though there is more than enough ice time to go around for other players not named Chabot.

What kinda of coach increases a 7th defender's, who has only played 2 games, ice time from 12 to 19 if a game is a shitshow? A minute or two more sure, but when every other defender available is better, it doesn't make sense and is absolutely valid critique of DJ, not just making up random reasons.

The 3 options to play with Chabot were Brannstrom, Holden or Zaitsev. Not great

 

[bicboi64]

The 3 options to play with Chabot were Brannstrom, Holden or Zaitsev. Not great

Holden and Brannstrom are better than Zaitsev, but even then, neither of them see jumps in their ice time that are so abrupt the way we've seen 3 games into the season with Zaitsev.

You'd think that he'd place some more faith in a guy like Brannstrom who's shown some progress in development, but nope, its turning to Zaitsev and having Chabot play absurd minutes.

Its still very early into the season and DJ has a lot of time to make better deployments, but its obvious that he put too much faith in Zaitsev last game. It can't be happening again.

 

[GCK]

Holden and Brannstrom are better than Zaitsev, but even then, neither of them see jumps in their ice time that are so abrupt the way we've seen 3 games into the season with Zaitsev.

You'd think that he'd place some more faith in a guy like Brannstrom who's shown some progress in development, but nope, its turning to Zaitsev and having Chabot play absurd minutes.

Its still very early into the season and DJ has a lot of time to make better deployments, but its obvious that he put too much faith in Zaitsev last game. It can't be happening again.

Zaitsev play about 1 minute more at EV strength than Brannstrom.

Let’s see tonight’s deployment for Zaitsev, hopefully back around the 9 minutes at even strength.

 

[Cosmix]

Well 5-6 years ago... I had to look it up lol (that's the year Letang was injured)

By TOI/GP :

Dumoulin
Hainsey
Maata
Schultz
Daley
Cole
Streit

It's not spectacular but a good coaching staff can work with that (Jacques Martin IIRC)



I'm sure there would be some coaching staffs able to do well with Chabot, Sanderson, Zub, Brannstrom and Holden.

Sure Hamonic and Zaitsev are not very good anymore but you have 5 decent to great D-men to work with.

Look at the Habs and how bad they were supposed to be. It's still early in the season but they have a 3.00 GA/GP while we have 3.38 GA/GP. This is the 2nd year of their rebuild, this is our 6th.

Our GM has failed to improve the goaltending over the 6 year period and the defence is not where it needs to be to be a playoff team. The money being spent on Zaitsev and Hamonic could be much better spent.

 

[GCK]

Our GM has failed to improve the goaltending over the 6 year period and the defence is not where it needs to be to be a playoff team. The money being spent on Zaitsev and Hamonic could be much better spent.

Hamonic is making 3.25M as a top 4 mentor to Sanderson. You are going to have a hard time getting a better replacement for less.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I love Chabot and do not want to pile on him at all but he has to be a stud for us and he hasn't been. Could be banged up. He plays through pain.

I think they should start off loading some of the bigger minutes when we are trying to come back late to Sanderson. Just start managing that more. Sanderson has shown a lot of poise and good decision making. Its going to happen so start making it happen bit by bit sooner.

 

[KnuckChuckinTkachuk]

Serious question, has Chabot drastically improved over the last 3 seasons? Like what specifically about his game developed to the point where there was noticeable improvements? I feel like the fanbase was waiting for him to take the next step after Karlsson left but imo he seems stalled in his development.

Because right now, here's how I evaluate his game.

GOOD:
- Cardio
- First step, skating
- First pass
- Decent offensive instincts 5v5

BAD:
- PP QB (I'm sorry but Brannstrom and Sanderson deserve that spot atm..)
- Intense play (when he should fire off a rocket/crisp pass, he does a soft touch that either gets intercepted, fanned or easy to read. Maybe he's exhausted from playing so much that by period 3 he's gassed but some of his plays are unacceptable, especially late in games with points on the line).
- No deception to his intentions on the ice (easy player to read imo when he's alone at the point)
- Defensive reads in his own zone
- Defending in front of the net and down low.
- Caught puck watching a lot

I don't know if it's just me but he's playing soft hockey. He doesn't appear focused, he's not intense, no urgency, appears very lackadaisical at times. Just watching star players on other teams, especially on D and unfortunately Chabby isn't on their level.

I said at the beginning of the year that Sanderson will be our best defensemen at some point, I just didn't think it would be this soon (Sanderson passes are what I want from Chabot, hard, crisp and accurate).

 

[Alex1234]

Serious question, has Chabot drastically improved over the last 3 seasons? Like what specifically about his game developed to the point where there was noticeable improvements? I feel like the fanbase was waiting for him to take the next step after Karlsson left but imo he seems stalled in his development.

Because right now, here's how I evaluate his game.

GOOD:
- Cardio
- First step, skating
- First pass
- Decent offensive instincts 5v5

BAD:
- PP QB (I'm sorry but Brannstrom and Sanderson deserve that spot atm..)
- Intense play (when he should fire off a rocket/crisp pass, he does a soft touch that either gets intercepted, fanned or easy to read. Maybe he's exhausted from playing so much that by period 3 he's gassed but some of his plays are unacceptable, especially late in games with points on the line).
- No deception to his intentions on the ice (easy player to read imo when he's alone at the point)
- Defensive reads in his own zone
- Defending in front of the net and down low.
- Caught puck watching a lot

I don't know if it's just me but he's playing soft hockey. He doesn't appear focused, he's not intense, no urgency, appears very lackadaisical at times. Just watching star players on other teams, especially on D and unfortunately Chabby isn't on their level.

I said at the beginning of the year that Sanderson will be our best defensemen at some point, I just didn't think it would be this soon (Sanderson passes are what I want from Chabot, hard, crisp and accurate).

Sometimes he goes in the Dzone corner so slowly that the attacker tangles him and it ends up in the other team possession
Not a direct turn over but no urgency at all to retrieve the puck as quick as possible
Please tell me he's injured or else it's very concerning

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

No system.

 

[KnuckChuckinTkachuk]

No system.

While I agree our system lacks hard, I think that's more of an excuse right now for Chabot's bad play.

It's on him to play like a 8mil dollar player and lead this team but so far, he's far from the ideal role model and watching him is painful this year (I love Hotsam too).

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

While I agree our system lacks hard, I think that's more of an excuse right now for Chabot's bad play.

It's on him to play like a 8mil dollar player and lead this team but so far, he's far from the ideal role model and watching him is painful this year (I love Hotsam too).

He's been trash.

But he is not responsible for back to back -50 shot differential last 2 games.

If anything, it shows just how much we need him to be excellent to mask the atrocious lack of system and all he has done for us when playing constant 30+ minutes.

-50 shot differential, lmfao. What pathetic shit is this.

 

[Flamingo]

Serious question, has Chabot drastically improved over the last 3 seasons? Like what specifically about his game developed to the point where there was noticeable improvements? I feel like the fanbase was waiting for him to take the next step after Karlsson left but imo he seems stalled in his development.

Because right now, here's how I evaluate his game.

GOOD:
- Cardio
- First step, skating
- First pass
- Decent offensive instincts 5v5

BAD:
- PP QB (I'm sorry but Brannstrom and Sanderson deserve that spot atm..)
- Intense play (when he should fire off a rocket/crisp pass, he does a soft touch that either gets intercepted, fanned or easy to read. Maybe he's exhausted from playing so much that by period 3 he's gassed but some of his plays are unacceptable, especially late in games with points on the line).
- No deception to his intentions on the ice (easy player to read imo when he's alone at the point)
- Defensive reads in his own zone
- Defending in front of the net and down low.
- Caught puck watching a lot

I don't know if it's just me but he's playing soft hockey. He doesn't appear focused, he's not intense, no urgency, appears very lackadaisical at times. Just watching star players on other teams, especially on D and unfortunately Chabby isn't on their level.

I said at the beginning of the year that Sanderson will be our best defensemen at some point, I just didn't think it would be this soon (Sanderson passes are what I want from Chabot, hard, crisp and accurate).

As someone else opined a week ago, it seems like he's used to running a marathon. He will have to take time to play like a sprinter again. It's a mental adjustment as well as physical.

 

[Cosmix]

Hamonic is making 3.25M as a top 4 mentor to Sanderson. You are going to have a hard time getting a better replacement for less.

What we are paying Zaitsev and Hamonic together could be used instead to pay a much better defenseman.

 

[Sting]

The problem with Chabot is that he's been told for so long by coaching/management here that he's amazing (due to no other quality NHL d-men) that to me it looks like he has really slacked off in the development aspect.

I truly think a good coach would shape him up good and I really worry about his career trajectory if nobody gives it to him straight. He looked better at 20 years old than he does now.

 

[GCK]

What we are paying Zaitsev and Hamonic together could be used instead to pay a much better defenseman.

That’s not a legitimate argument. Zaitsev was here and we needed to add someone who could play minutes and mentor Sanderson. You can’t just make Zaitsev disappear and reuse his money.

 

[KnuckChuckinTkachuk]

As someone else opined a week ago, it seems like he's used to running a marathon. He will have to take time to play like a sprinter again. It's a mental adjustment as well as physical.

That actually might be the best way to put it.

The problem with Chabot is that he's been told for so long by coaching/management here that he's amazing (due to no other quality NHL d-men) that to me it looks like he has really slacked off in the development aspect.

I truly think a good coach would shape him up good and I really worry about his career trajectory if nobody gives it to him straight. He looked better at 20 years old than he does now.

Okay good so I'm not the only one who noticed this.

 

[CorrectOpinion]

Remember when we let DeMelo go for nothing?

 

[bicboi64]

Props to Hamonic who is quietly, but consistently doing his job. After Zub, he's probably our next best shut down guy and that's considering him aging.

 

[Senovision]

Holden is pretty steady. He seems fairly reliable, the other dmen other than Sanderson and Zub are having a tough go.

 

[Senovision]

Who are the alltime Senators hardest
shots from the point as defencemen? Not in any order.
Salo.
Chara
Karlsson

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Can we borrow Boston's medical team to work on Zub? He might legitimately be the most important Sens d-man right now.

 

[coladin]

Which is the exact opposite of the last game. Against Minny, they did have good stretches , but you could see the forwards starting to get beat to pucks. The defence are doing a decent job in their end, but it is the forwards who are not impedeing the opposition from gaining the blueline. It was so damn easy and looking at the goals and where they were scored from, you can see that the forwards have more to do with the losses than the defence

Very good team defence last night. THAT was the structure that this team plays with. Pressure the neutral zone and support the defence. They did it last night and shots were harder to come by. They gave three gifts last night and was a truly winnable game. More of that, and they will be playing meaningful games at the TDL

 

[OD99]

Very good team defence last night. THAT was the structure that this team plays with. Pressure the neutral zone and support the defence. They did it last night and shots were harder to come by. They gave three gifts last night and was a truly winnable game. More of that, and they will be playing meaningful games at the TDL

Yes I agree but the tough part is that one of the easiest plays in hockey is to dump the puck in and if we don't break out quick we get caught up the cycle.

As soon as teams gain any control in our end the tire fire begins - we need to sort that out too as we can't just rely on the neutral zone and offensive zone forecheck.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Remember when we let DeMelo go for nothing?

I remember that Demelo and Chabot played pretty well together .. and DJ shoe horned Zaitsev into that spot .. moving Demelo down the lineup which led to not even talking to him or his agent about an extension.

 

[Yak]

We need help no doubt.Their are a few UFA's in off-season that could be worth it but not sure we can wait long for help.

Structure and system is flawed, said this for 3 years now.

This won't fix issue but may help, let's bring in Methot with Redden as consultant! Jack has lost control of the defense.