Taylor Hall - from one losing team to another

[AnInjuredJasonZucker]

These are no where near as common as you're implying, and are actually quite rare. Larsson's gap control and ability to cut off controlled zone entries are some of his biggest attributes. If people don't understand how important these 2 aspects are to goal prevention and puck possession then I don't know what to tell you.

Make no mistake, Klefbom is the one who makes the majority of the defensive gaffes on their pairing, and they are the #1 pair on Edmonton, not the #2. Sekera and Russell had a stretch where they were playing fantastic, but outside of that short stretch Sekera has been a 3 and Russell has been a 4/5.

I didn't say or imply that they were common. I'm referring to the six bell giveaways that lead to chaos in the defensive zone. I also made no mention of Klefbom's mistakes, probably because I was talking about Larsson. It's arguable that they are the #1 pairing on the Oilers, but it's disingenuous to call them a #1 pair. Right now, they are 2nd pairing calibre, with a very good chance of developing into a first pairing.

 

[nystromshairstylist]

Still wish Snow would've sent Hamonic for him.

Ha, you're right about that; Hamonic and his -20 have helped screw us almost out of a playoff spot.

The only real thing he's contributed this season is being hurt/on IR for 1/4 of the season, which 1-limited his hurting the team 2-probably kept his +/- from being even worse.

Anders Lee-JT-Taylor Hall would have been a dynamite line for years to come.

Yet another Snow fiasco....

 

[PatrikOverAuston]

Dunno, i'm not a GM so i don't really know who's available and what their price-point is.

Good admission, but you then proceed to contradict yourself with:

All i'm saying is Hall's value is higher than the return they got and that's pretty obvious to see. Yes Edmonton ended up getting Lucic which made the trade tolerable but if we look at the trade at face value it wasn't a good deal.

I dunno, i would have tried to land someone like Lindholm (and a cap dump to make the trade work). He had contractual issues and Anaheim was close to the cap, for a PPG 1st OA player i'm sure Anaheim would have considered an offer (and it was rumoured that Anaheim was trying to move 1 of their LD's). I know Lindholm isn't a RD but he's still one of the best puck moving defensive dmen in the league. Heck maybe Edmonton could have added someone like Davidson (who was coming off a pretty good season) and some other pieces to get Manson aswell. Another player is Trouba.

So you're not a GM and thus don't know who else was available, but you then go off about how Chi should have obtained Lindholm or Trouba and how Hall's value "is higher than the return they got".

I think even Bryan Berard could clearly see the hypocrisy here.

 

[McRpro]

good admission, but you then proceed to contradict yourself with:



So you're not a gm and thus don't know who else was available, but you then go off about lindholm and how hall's value "is higher than the return they got".

I think even Stevie Wonder could see the hypocrisy here.

ftfy.

Hall's value, is what he was traded for. You'd think he was a perennial 90 point superstar the way some people value him. The guy hasn't even hit 50 points yet this season. Had 65 the year before and 38 the season before that. All while contributing little in the way of two-way play. To suggest he was worth Hampus Lindholm, Anaheim's #1 D is just ridiculous.

 

[TT1]

Good admission, but you then proceed to contradict yourself with:



So you're not a GM and thus don't know who else was available, but you then go off about how Chi should have obtained Lindholm or Trouba and how Hall's value "is higher than the return they got".

I think even Bryan Berard could clearly see the hypocrisy here.

I don't understand this statement at all, sorry. Trouba asked to get traded and it was widely speculated (by Bobby Mac) that Anaheim was looking to move a dman, there were rumors of Fowler to MTL/Buf at the draft. It's not a stretch to say Lindholm could have been had due to Anaheim's cap trouble and his contract status. In any case i would have taken Severson or Trouba over Larsson. I don't think it was a coincidence that NJ kept Severson and gave up Larsson.

Bottom line is it was a bad trade (value-wise), no matter how much Edmonton fans wanna deny it. That being said adding Lucic AND Larsson ended up making the team better. I just think the trade was rushed and Edmonton should have got a better return for him.

 

[PatrikOverAuston]

I don't understand this statement at all, sorry.

This is like telling the cop who pulls you over for speeding that you don't speak English. Nice try.

Trouba asked to get traded and it was widely speculated (by Bobby Mac) that Anaheim was looking to move a dman, there were rumors of Fowler to MTL/Buf at the draft. It's not a stretch to say Lindholm could have been had due to Anaheim's cap trouble and his contract status.

And yet neither were traded, so it's impossible to know what price tag they had. Keep trying.

In any case i would have taken Severson or Trouba over Larsson. I don't think it was a coincidence that NJ kept Severson and gave up Larsson.

So if you think New Jersey was willing to trade Larsson before Severson, why would Winnipeg and Anaheim give up Trouba and Lindholm, respectively? Way to play yourself.

Bottom line is it was a bad trade (value-wise), no matter how much Edmonton fans wanna deny it.

You'd have to prove superior value was available. You've failed to do that yet again.

That being said adding Lucic AND Larsson ended up making the team better. I just think the trade was rushed and Edmonton should have got a better return for Hall.

Yes, so rushed they did it after missing the playoffs for over ten years. You're right, Edmonton totally should have waited another decade to make a trade that the geniuses on HF agreed with. Too bad we don't have you running the show here.

 

[TT1]

This is like telling the cop who pulls you over for speeding that you don't speak English. Nice try.



And yet neither were traded, so it's impossible to know what price tag they had. Keep trying.



So if you think New Jersey was willing to trade Larsson before Severson, why would Winnipeg and Anaheim give up Trouba and Lindholm, respectively? Way to play yourself.



You'd have to prove superior value was available. You've failed to do that yet again.



Yes, so rushed they did it after missing the playoffs for over ten years. You're right, Edmonton totally should have waited another decade to make a trade that the geniuses on HF agreed with. Too bad we don't have you running the show here.

Ok you're right, you win. It was a great trade, good luck lads!

 

[Conduit]

I didn't say or imply that they were common. I'm referring to the six bell giveaways that lead to chaos in the defensive zone. I also made no mention of Klefbom's mistakes, probably because I was talking about Larsson. It's arguable that they are the #1 pairing on the Oilers, but it's disingenuous to call them a #1 pair. Right now, they are 2nd pairing calibre, with a very good chance of developing into a first pairing.

Oilers are 10th best in goals against and 11th in shots against. Rather difficult to do that if your top D pairing is really only 2nd-pair calibre.

 

[A91]

Dunno, i'm not a GM so i don't really know who's available and what their price-point is. Did anyone even think Larsson or Hall would have gotten traded at the time? No, the trade happened out of the blue.

All i'm saying is Hall's value is higher than the return they got and that's pretty obvious to see. Yes Edmonton ended up getting Lucic which made the trade tolerable but if we look at the trade at face value it wasn't a good deal. Right now Larsson is playing 20 mins a night which is like #3 minutes, you gave up a legit 1st liner for him. Personally i though Severson was even better than Larsson at the time.

I dunno, i would have tried to land someone like Lindholm (and a cap dump to make the trade work). He had contractual issues and Anaheim was close to the cap, for a PPG 1st OA player i'm sure Anaheim would have considered an offer (and it was rumoured that Anaheim was trying to move 1 of their LD's). I know Lindholm isn't a RD but he's still one of the best puck moving defensive dmen in the league. Heck maybe Edmonton could have added someone like Davidson (who was coming off a pretty good season) and some other pieces to get Manson aswell. Another player is Trouba.

- Lindholm was not happening I'm sure Chia tried.
- What makes Manson better than Larsson exactly? Also both of those players would require us to send Hall to a rival... Wasn't happening
- You don't think we kicked tires on Trouba as well? Wasn't going to happen.

 

[Peanut]

Ok you're right, you win. It was a great trade, good luck lads!

I see you have been trying to have a discussion with an Oiler fan good call lol

 

[TT1]

- Lindholm was not happening I'm sure Chia tried.
- What makes Manson better than Larsson exactly? Also both of those players would require us to send Hall to a rival... Wasn't happening
- You don't think we kicked tires on Trouba as well? Wasn't going to happen.

I never said Manson is a better than Larsson, Hall for Manson would have been a terrible trade.

 

[Zaddy]

I don't understand this statement at all, sorry. Trouba asked to get traded and it was widely speculated (by Bobby Mac) that Anaheim was looking to move a dman, there were rumors of Fowler to MTL/Buf at the draft. It's not a stretch to say Lindholm could have been had due to Anaheim's cap trouble and his contract status. In any case i would have taken Severson or Trouba over Larsson. I don't think it was a coincidence that NJ kept Severson and gave up Larsson.

Bottom line is it was a bad trade (value-wise), no matter how much Edmonton fans wanna deny it. That being said adding Lucic AND Larsson ended up making the team better. I just think the trade was rushed and Edmonton should have got a better return for him.

What makes Lindholm, Trouba and Severson better options than Larsson? Lindholm has same number of points as Larsson, makes $1.6M more and is LHD. Yeah I like him and he's probably better than Larsson, but Larsson is cheaper and plays RHD, nevermind that I highly, highly doubt Lindholm was ever available at all. Would've been a huge mistake for Anaheim to give up their best defenseman, especially for a winger like Hall lol.

Trouba wanted big money and is likely to get it after his bridge deal. Not the type of money Oilers want to give up with looming extensions to McDavid, Drai, Nurse etc. I'm not even convinced he's a better player than Larsson, at least not defensively.

Severson is definitely not even close in terms of defense to what Larsson brings and it is very obvious. He's a team-high -27 and no one else is really even close to him on the Devils in that regard. Guy can't handle Larssons minutes. He wouldn't have helped the Oilers one bit this year.

 

[Tad Mikowsky]

Dunno, i'm not a GM so i don't really know who's available and what their price-point is. Did anyone even think Larsson or Hall would have gotten traded at the time? No, the trade happened out of the blue.

All i'm saying is Hall's value is higher than the return they got and that's pretty obvious to see. Yes Edmonton ended up getting Lucic which made the trade tolerable but if we look at the trade at face value it wasn't a good deal. Right now Larsson is playing 20 mins a night which is like #3 minutes, you gave up a legit 1st liner for him. Personally i though Severson was even better than Larsson at the time.

I dunno, i would have tried to land someone like Lindholm (and a cap dump to make the trade work). He had contractual issues and Anaheim was close to the cap, for a PPG 1st OA player i'm sure Anaheim would have considered an offer (and it was rumoured that Anaheim was trying to move 1 of their LD's). I know Lindholm isn't a RD but he's still one of the best puck moving defensive dmen in the league. Heck maybe Edmonton could have added someone like Davidson (who was coming off a pretty good season) and some other pieces to get Manson aswell. Another player is Trouba.

Well in that case, Kris Russell is a top pairing defenceman.

Not one Oiler defenceman is playing over 25 minutes a night on average. Does that mean that there is no number one defenceman?

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Hall should have been traded for a better dman, simple as that. Wasted asset.

If that's wasting an asset Chiarelli should maybe waste some more assets.

 

[TT1]

Well in that case, Kris Russell is a top pairing defenceman.

Not one Oiler defenceman is playing over 25 minutes a night on average. Does that mean that there is no number one defenceman?

Over 25 minutes usually means elite #1 dman, around ~23 minutes = legit top pairing dman (obviously it's not always black and white like that, you have to factor other stuff aswell such as the strength of a team's d-core etc.).

20 minutes = high 2nd pairing dman, it's not a very good sign when Russell is getting more minutes than him.

 

[Peanut]

If that's wasting an asset Chiarelli should maybe waste some more assets.

He did Griffin Reimhart traded from New York Islanders to Edmonton Oilers for round 1 pick in the 2015 draft (Mathew Barzal) and round 2 pick in the 2015 draft (Mitchell Stephens)