Taylor Hall 80 points 6th in League Scoring

[Aceboogie]

To start the year he had the points but was still making bad plays, coughing the puck up, not back checking etc. But in the last half of the season he entered beast mode. Every time he touched the puck I'd expect a chance to be created. Was very responsible with the puck, and improved in his own end.

I agree he still has to be responsible in his own end. Once he makes a consistent effort to back check and doesn't fly the zone to early, hell be a top 6 NHL player (in the league)

 

[Oil In My Veins]

Hopefully he starts getting te respect he deserves. It's bad enough that he doesn't get it from the East coast media, it was pathetic how often he didn't even get the respect from his own fans.

 

[Mc5RingsAndABeer]

And yet Seguin is going to the playoffs.

Hockey is a team sport. This isn't tennis.

 

[Everest]

A fellow Oiler fan mentioned this in another thread... Hall has 42 points in 42 games against playoff teams. Hall is playing against the other teams top lines and defencemen night in and night out and doing more than well. Its not Hall's fault that the Oilers are out of the playoffs, nor is it Seguins fault the Stars made it. I would take Halls consistent point production over a player with multiple 4+ point games, any day of the week and 3 times on sundays. Consistent point production is what helps teams out the most... not Halls fault the Oilers are bad.

I'm not saying its Hall's fault the Oilers aren't in the playoffs.

I'm saying there is still another level of the game that he can (and will) get to.

And the fact I am giving him the benefit of the doubt...saying he WILL still improve his overall game...Is a good thing! He's had next to ZERO coaching or guidance here up to the point. To my eye...the kid is mostly self-taught. So...its impressive.

But...He played the entire season with little to zero regard for what the scoreboard was reading.

And really...there was no point in looking at the scoreboard because the team was buried...early and easily.

It was an open invitation for him to go full throttle on the attack all season long & it paid off with HUGE point production.

Its MUCH HARDER to drive up your personal point totals if your having to make in-game decisions based on the game being winnable/losable depending on what choices you make as a player.

This is why the point totals of guys like Perry, Seguin, Getzlaf, Pacioretty et al...are more impressive than what Hall delivered.

 

[Staghorn]

Yeah but Crosby is in the playoffs all Halls stats are reset to 0 they mean nothing.

With all the new hockey metrics, I wonder how many of Hall's points were completely meaningless this year... Like the late goal in a 6-1 loss..

 

[Zap Brannigan]

Ovechkins 50 goals are worthless and not as impressive as Ben Smiths 14 goals because Ben Smith made the playoffs

 

[Everest]

Ovechkins 50 goals are worthless and not as impressive as Ben Smiths 14 goals because Ben Smith made the playoffs

No.

Ovechkin's 50 goals are not as impressive as...oh...say...Pacioretty's 40 (or did it stay at 39?) because MTL made the playoffs.

And Pacioretty wasn't -10,000.

Unlike Ovechkin.

 

[Oiltankjob Fail]

No.

Ovechkin's 50 goals are not as impressive as...oh...say...Pacioretty's 40 (or did it stay at 39?) because MTL made the playoffs.

And Pacioretty wasn't -10,000.

Unlike Ovechkin.

Serious guy Hockey is a team sport, in this sport you have indviduals at different skill levels . To say patches 39 is more impressive because the team made the playoffs is foolish. One guy netted 51 in 82 the other 39 . Like saying Ovies 38 in 11/12 was more impressive than Stamkos 60 because Washington made the playoffs and Tampa did not.

 

[trilogytime]

No.

Ovechkin's 50 goals are not as impressive as...oh...say...Pacioretty's 40 (or did it stay at 39?) because MTL made the playoffs.

They play in the same league man, against all the same teams.

 

[Quality Oil]

I'm happy for Hall, and with him being one of the oldest of the "bunch" I'm hoping that we see the others begin to turn the corner as quickly as Hall has, his last two years of development have been very encouraging. No less, I still think he has plenty more to offer.

 

[Up the Irons]

I'm not saying its Hall's fault the Oilers aren't in the playoffs.

I'm saying there is still another level of the game that he can (and will) get to.

And the fact I am giving him the benefit of the doubt...saying he WILL still improve his overall game...Is a good thing! He's had next to ZERO coaching or guidance here up to the point. To my eye...the kid is mostly self-taught. So...its impressive.

But...He played the entire season with little to zero regard for what the scoreboard was reading.

And really...there was no point in looking at the scoreboard because the team was buried...early and easily.

It was an open invitation for him to go full throttle on the attack all season long & it paid off with HUGE point production.

Its MUCH HARDER to drive up your personal point totals if your having to make in-game decisions based on the game being winnable/losable depending on what choices you make as a player.

This is why the point totals of guys like Perry, Seguin, Getzlaf, Pacioretty et al...are more impressive than what Hall delivered.

ok. How many times did Hall get the first goal of the game (which is quit probably the most important in today's game)? I'm betting he leads all four of your examples. Your scoreboard point doesn't apply there. Also, with Hall's team so often trailing by 2 goals early, his opponents go into shutdown mode, where as your examples are on teams that are often leading, ergo, their opponents take chances and penalties.

How about even strength. Hall trails only Getzlaf and Crosby. not too shabby.

I can come up with reasons to suport my position, too.

furthermore, care to comment on the considerably superior teammates all four of those guys play with for 82 games a year. I'm thinking that might help just a tiny bit. Having Markov and Subban probably helped Patch on a few of those 39 goals, don't you think. Seguin? He is not even the best player on his line. Put Benn with Hall and see what happens. Yikes. he'd be sitting in 2nd in the scoring race.

we can all cherry pick if we want too.

As others have said, it's a team sport, man.

 

[AJGass4]

I agree it's a team sport but every other player on that list played on a better team.

It doesn't matter the win/loss ratio if you are looking at a player's stats. You have to consider what each player deals with.

No one will deny Hall makes blunders out there but I would take him over the others based on sheer desire to carry a team on his back. At times he does way too much to help his team and it backfires at times.

When you are playing goal to prevent an empty netter in a game that is already lost, well I'd never turn my back on a guy like that.

 

[Backhand]

Points contribution % of the top 20 LW scorers (as listed on NHL.com).

Calculated based on pts per game of each player divided by goals per game of their respective teams...

Hall 43.1%
Benn 34.0%
Sharp 29.2%
Marleau 28.1%
Kunitz 28.7%
Vanek 33.9%
Landeskog 26.3%
Steen 30.2%
van Riemsdyk 27.1%
Pacioretty 31.4%
Lucic 23.2%
Palat 24.9%
Zuccarello 28.8%
Perron 29.5%
Jokinen 23.2%
Parise 33.1%
Schwartz 23.1%
MacArthur 24.2%
Skinner 30.2%
Ladd 25.0%

It's not even close... Hall is the best offensive LW in the NHL when you take into account the team he plays on.

You can question his overall game but obviously his deficiencies are further exposed on this mediocre team as well... it's a catch 22 and other players would have the same happen to them on the Oilers (as we've seen often).

Does this speak to Hall's talent or the lack of Oilers secondary scoring? An interesting stat but I don't think it helps the argument either way. Edmonton was 24th in goals for. Only player on that list with a worse or same scoring team is Parise. Minny had same amount of goals.

 

[Oil In My Veins]

Does this speak to Hall's talent or the lack of Oilers secondary scoring? An interesting stat but I don't think it helps the argument either way. Edmonton was 24th in goals for. Only player on that list with a worse or same scoring team is Parise. Minny had same amount of goals.

Both, Hall is an elite talent and he doesn't get much support.

 

[CorpseFX]

He's a top 30 overall player in the league (including goalies and D). He's at worst the no.3 LW in the league. Personally, I think Benn and Sharp are better overall, but that's elite company.

meh... i think he'll bypass both of them...

Benn is a weird player to me. skates so upright. he gets the job done for sure but he looks awkward as hell out there. maybe it's his skinny legs. Sharp is a great player (speed, great snipe) but living on a stacked team is easy money. does he dominate this hard as a LW if he's on the Oilers? doubt it.

Hall putting up what he did on one of the worst teams in the league at executing any type of "HOCKEY GAME" is a feat that shouldnt be undervalued in the least.

 

[CorpseFX]

Points contribution % of the top 20 LW scorers (as listed on NHL.com).

Calculated based on pts per game of each player divided by goals per game of their respective teams...

Hall 43.1%
Benn 34.0%
Sharp 29.2%
Marleau 28.1%
Kunitz 28.7%
Vanek 33.9%
Landeskog 26.3%
Steen 30.2%
van Riemsdyk 27.1%
Pacioretty 31.4%
Lucic 23.2%
Palat 24.9%
Zuccarello 28.8%
Perron 29.5%
Jokinen 23.2%
Parise 33.1%
Schwartz 23.1%
MacArthur 24.2%
Skinner 30.2%
Ladd 25.0%

It's not even close... Hall is the best offensive LW in the NHL when you take into account the team he plays on.

You can question his overall game but obviously his deficiencies are further exposed on this mediocre team as well... it's a catch 22 and other players would have the same happen to them on the Oilers (as we've seen often).

great stat, + 100% agree.

 

[PaPaDee]

No.

Ovechkin's 50 goals are not as impressive as...oh...say...Pacioretty's 40 (or did it stay at 39?) because MTL made the playoffs.

And Pacioretty wasn't -10,000.

Unlike Ovechkin.

Would you take Ovie or Patches on the team if you had a choice?

 

[Tyrolean]

Even Strength Points Per 60 minutes this year :

Perreault is a stud

Stats never tell the whole story.

 

[Aerchon]

Hall this year compared to last took steps back in a couple areas but by the end of the year he looked very good.

BAD

- more turnovers especially at the start of season
- questionable decision making
- less puck possession
- weaker on the PP

Good

- better 5v5.
- showed huge improvement on his back checking and defensive zone awareness at the end of the year.
- improved decision making by the end of the year.

In the end Hall is overall a slightly better player going into next year because 5v5 and back checking is more important than just points or zone time.

He is clearly better than Kunitz and arguably as good as Sharp or Benn. If he keeps improving he well could drag this team into the playoffs kicking and screaming.

It's scary to think how good this kid is at 22. Still a few years off of his peak.

 

[sepHF]

Stats never tell the whole story.

of course, I just figured it was worth sharing in a Hall thread specifically about points.

 

[Spawn]

I don't think we fully realize how special his last two seasons have been. Back to back years in the top 10 in scoring? That is an incredible feat. The last two years the only player with more points and a higher ppg in the western conference than him is Ryan Getzlaf. Ahead of players like Kane, Kopitar, Toews, Perry, Benn, Thornton etc.

Also ahead of Tavares in total points and ppg over the past two seasons. Which I only bring up because everyone in the world holds Tavares on so much higher of a pedestal despite Hall matching/bettering him every step of the way in their respective careers.

One other thing, I do agree that Taylor Hall needs to work on his defensive game. But I feel like it is one of the most grossly over exaggerated arguments used in regards to him. You watch some of the other elite players in the game. Steven Stamkos, John Tavares, Alex Ovechkin, Patrick Kane etc... these guys all also have pretty weak defensive games. It just seems to get glossed over much easier than with Hall. I guess partially because they don't play on such an awful team as Hall.

I think it will be important to remember the past two seasons at the start of next year as Hall is a slow starter and people seem to turn on him rather quickly around here at the start of each year.

 

[fuswald]

I find it interesting how close Hall and Seguins stats have been since they were drafted (and before). Totally different paths and still similar. 1 and 2 drafts don't usually seem so close.

I'd still take Hall, he makes any line better. Actually Seguin does this as well (but not as well as Hall)

 

[Spawn]

I find it interesting how close Hall and Seguins stats have been since they were drafted (and before). Totally different paths and still similar. 1 and 2 drafts don't usually seem so close.

I'd still take Hall, he makes any line better. Actually Seguin does this as well (but not as well as Hall)

They are both really really good hockey players. That is a heck of a 1-2 in that draft.

 

[OilerTyler]

I find it interesting how close Hall and Seguins stats have been since they were drafted (and before). Totally different paths and still similar. 1 and 2 drafts don't usually seem so close.

I'd still take Hall, he makes any line better. Actually Seguin does this as well (but not as well as Hall)

Seguin also needed Boston to trade him because of his streaky/soft play and off-ice issues before he was finally able to wake up and reach his potential.

Pre-trade Seguin would've been a disaster in Edmonton. He is so much better in Dallas.

 

[McGlassbangers]

Over the last two years, Hall's PPG (130 points in 120 games, 1.08PPG) is fifth best in the NHL. Crosby, Malkin, Stamkos and Getzlaf are ahead of him. Ovechkin, Kane and Tavares behind. Seguin/Benn/Duchene isn't even remotely close.