GDT: Stars @ Flames, 7:30PM on TSN & Fan960

[TheHudlinator]

I'm neither an Irving apologist or hater, but he had a terrible game last night. Possibly his worst IMO. That 3rd Dallas goal by Morrow was a disaster. If that were to have given DAL a 3-0 lead and we end up losing, everyone would be screaming to get him out of the net. Pretty sure it was not long after that that Irving misplayed the puck into the slot and would've been an easy tap in for any Dallas player. If that also goes in, my god.

But nobody cares right now because we scored 7 and won the game. I personally think Irving is a good goalie, but last night was awful.

One bad goal and a misplayed puck = terrible? The guy made some great saves in the game including on a 5v3 and for the majority of the third period was great. He wasn't stellar but terrible isn't the right word either.

 

[Lunatik]

I'm neither an Irving apologist or hater, but he had a terrible game last night. Possibly his worst IMO. That 3rd Dallas goal by Morrow was a disaster. If that were to have given DAL a 3-0 lead and we end up losing, everyone would be screaming to get him out of the net. Pretty sure it was not long after that that Irving misplayed the puck into the slot and would've been an easy tap in for any Dallas player. If that also goes in, my god.

But nobody cares right now because we scored 7 and won the game. I personally think Irving is a good goalie, but last night was awful.

He had a tough game for sure, and while he was definitely in the wrong for not getting that puck covered, but where the hell was everyone? In no situation is it acceptable for the skaters to allow Morrow to drive through the slot unimpeded. Someone gets a slight bump or maybe even a stick on Morrow and it slows him just enough that Irving has it covered.

 

[Beats By CoRD]

One bad goal and a misplayed puck = terrible? The guy made some great saves in the game including on a 5v3 and for the majority of the third period was great. He wasn't stellar but terrible isn't the right word either.

No, it was obviously not just those 2 things. IMO every goal other than the 2nd Morrow goal were stoppable pucks. His rebound control last night was bush league. I also understand the guy is under the microscope, but I'm just calling it as I saw it.

Watch the goals for yourself: http://video.flames.nhl.com/videocenter/console?hlg

Like I said I think he's a good goalie, but if we don't score 7 last night, everyone here is singing a different tune. I still want to see him in goal tomorrow.

 

[Beats By CoRD]

He had a tough game for sure, and while he was definitely in the wrong for not getting that puck covered, but where the hell was everyone? In no situation is it acceptable for the skaters to allow Morrow to drive through the slot unimpeded. Someone gets a slight bump or maybe even a stick on Morrow and it slows him just enough that Irving has it covered.

Watch the goal again (I posted the highlights above this post). Nobody was there because Irving should have it covered. It was a quick play, but Irving HAASSSS to have that one. HAS to.

 

[Lunatik]

Watch the goal again (I posted the highlights above this post). Nobody was there because Irving should have it covered. It was a quick play, but Irving HAASSSS to have that one. HAS to.

Yes it was a quick play, but that is not excuse for no one to be near Morrow in the slot. Irving is as much to blame as anyone, but the defense and forwards should not get a pass on that goal since they screwed up almost as badly. They should be there on Morrow whether that play happens or not!

 

[TheHudlinator]

No, it was obviously not just those 2 things. IMO every goal other than the 2nd Morrow goal were stoppable pucks. His rebound control last night was bush league. I also understand the guy is under the microscope, but I'm just calling it as I saw it.

Watch the goals for yourself: http://video.flames.nhl.com/videocenter/console?hlg

Like I said I think he's a good goalie, but if we don't score 7 last night, everyone here is singing a different tune. I still want to see him in goal tomorrow.

The first goal we only had 4 players and Nystrom was alone in the slot in what world is that stoppable? The 2nd goal was a essentially a 5v3 as Stajan had fallen on the pk and it was just a nice play again not stoppable. The third was a ****** we all know it, and 4th goal was a nice shot. You are being way to hard on Irving to call him terrible last night had it not been for his ****** goal he had a sv% of .912 IN WHAT WORLD IS THAT TERRIBLE

 

[Beats By CoRD]

The first goal we only had 4 players and Nystrom was alone in the slot in what world is that stoppable? The 2nd goal was a essentially a 5v3 as Stajan had fallen on the pk and it was just a nice play again not stoppable. The third was a ****** we all know it, and 4th goal was a nice shot. You are being way to hard on Irving to call him terrible last night had it not been for his ****** goal he had a sv% of .912 IN WHAT WORLD IS THAT TERRIBLE

That last sentence is laughable. If not for his garbage goal, he would've been great! Revisionist history at it's finest.

I realize no Flames can do no wrong in your eyes. You are here defending every player, every play, every stat to death. I get it.

Irving was brutal last night, bar none.

 

[Hand of Gaudreau]

The first goal we only had 4 players and Nystrom was alone in the slot in what world is that stoppable? The 2nd goal was a essentially a 5v3 as Stajan had fallen on the pk and it was just a nice play again not stoppable. The third was a ****** we all know it, and 4th goal was a nice shot. You are being way to hard on Irving to call him terrible last night had it not been for his ****** goal he had a sv% of .912 IN WHAT WORLD IS THAT TERRIBLE

Side note, he made 5 absolutely brilliant saves including one when we were only up 1-0 and we scored immediately after. He lets that in, different game, goaltending is about timely saves and last night Irving made them. Also think Jagr, late second. Lets that in its 6-4 going into the third instead of 6-3, they still have a pp so its likely 6-5 after. Irving may not have won us the game but he allowed us to win it. That game could have gone either way if Irving doesn't keep it 1-0.

 

[TheHudlinator]

That last sentence is laughable. If not for his garbage goal, he would've been great! Revisionist history at it's finest.

I realize no Flames can do no wrong in your eyes. You are here defending every player, every play, every stat to death. I get it.

Irving was brutal last night, bar none.

the only thing brutal in this thread is your logic, he let in a bad goal must be a terrible night

 

[Beats By CoRD]

the only thing brutal in this thread is your logic, he let in a bad goal must be a terrible night

Yea cause that's exactly what I said. Thanks for oversimplifying.

That was his worst game as a Flame. Thank god Dallas and Bachman had an even worse game. My point to begin with was; I don't think his performance should be overshadowed by the W. That game has me worried about his ability to be a capable starter in this league. Tomorrow will be a huge test for him. I'm still rooting for him.

 

[TheHudlinator]

Yea cause that's exactly what I said. Thanks for oversimplifying.

That was his worst game as a Flame. Thank god Dallas and Bachman had an even worse game. My point to begin with was; I don't think his performance should be overshadowed by the W. That game has me worried about his ability to be a capable starter in this league. Tomorrow will be a huge test for him. I'm still rooting for him.

I agree that was his worse game as a Flame but saying he had a terrible game isn't right, he made some very good saves and when he had to make the big saves he did (in the third and the 5v3). He wasn't great last night that is for sure but he also wasn't terrible.

 

[MarkGio]

So all we gotta do is limit our opponents opportunities and shots while scoring a lot of goals!

I think Irving will be OK. And if not, we're hooped because there is no one else. With goalies, you never know if they'll be good or pulled at any given period. As long as the players give Irving a fighting chance, I'm sure he'll do the same.

 

[Hand of Gaudreau]

Yea cause that's exactly what I said. Thanks for oversimplifying.

That was his worst game as a Flame. Thank god Dallas and Bachman had an even worse game. My point to begin with was; I don't think his performance should be overshadowed by the W. That game has me worried about his ability to be a capable starter in this league. Tomorrow will be a huge test for him. I'm still rooting for him.

He may have oversimplified your statement, but you blew one goal way out of proportion, Irving wasn't terrible, he wasn't even bad, he was good enough to win, and in his rookie season that's all I'll ask of him. It's funny how you can talk all day about his flaws last night but completely ignore all the things he did incredibly well, like the 5 saves he had no business making or how he was a rock in the third when the Flames needed him to be. Also u comment on his puck handling mistakes, and yet no one seems to remember how positively atrocious Kipper used to be at handling the puck. Maybe next time watch the whole game instead of just commenting on the highlights you saw the next day.

 

[Beats By CoRD]

He may have oversimplified your statement, but you blew one goal way out of proportion, Irving wasn't terrible, he wasn't even bad, he was good enough to win, and in his rookie season that's all I'll ask of him. It's funny how you can talk all day about his flaws last night but completely ignore all the things he did incredibly well, like the 5 saves he had no business making or how he was a rock in the third when the Flames needed him to be. Also u comment on his puck handling mistakes, and yet no one seems to remember how positively atrocious Kipper used to be at handling the puck. Maybe next time watch the whole game instead of just commenting on the highlights you saw the next day.

I watched the whole game, but thanks champ.

So allowing 4 goals is usually good enough to win? For the Flames, no it sure isn't. Actually on probably any team, it isn't. That was his worst game as a Flame, everyone is agreeing on that. He made some key saves yes, as any goalie is expected to, but he was not sharp. He was sloppy and if not for the play of Bachman and the DAL D, that game is loss every time. And regardless how bad Kipper was at puck-handling, I've never seen him give the puck away like that, ever.

Regardless, I didn't come in here to flame Irving, I just wanted to point out that the win shouldn't overshadow his play. That's it, that's all.

Thanks.

 

[Hand of Gaudreau]

I watched the whole game, but thanks champ.

So allowing 4 goals is usually good enough to win? For the Flames, no it sure isn't. Actually on probably any team, it isn't. That was his worst game as a Flame, everyone is agreeing on that. He made some key saves yes, as any goalie is expected to, but he was not sharp. He was sloppy and if not for the play of Bachman and the DAL D, that game is loss every time. And regardless how bad Kipper was at puck-handling, I've never seen him give the puck away like that, ever.

Regardless, I didn't come in here to flame Irving, I just wanted to point out that the win shouldn't overshadow his play. That's it, that's all.

Thanks.

Once again you focused entirely on the goals 3/4 which weren't his fault, and secondly every goalie mishandles the puck, every player mishandles the puck, he is actually quite a good puck handler and he has made one puck handling mistake as a flame and all of a sudden his ability to play goal is in question for you. I'm really glad you don't coach hockey...

Also the saves I'm speaking of no goalie is 'expected' to make, and if they go in no one questions them, the fact is Irving made 5 of them last night, he doesn't make those 5 the game is 9-7 and you know what, I still would have said only 1 was his fault, the flames were atrocious defensively last night, the game was extremely wide open and Irving won a game that would have been tough for any NHL goalie. Simple as that.

 

[Northern Neighbour]

That post isn't by me

Ahhh shoot. My apologies. I just saw the double IIs.

Irving does deserve credit for making the big stop on the SH chance. He lets that go in, and it's possibly a different game.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Ward is the coach running the Heat, and its clear its his show. But in many cases the way certain decisions are being made down there is hurting the development of our prospects (ie. Nemisz, Howse, Wahl). Ward is all about winning which is great, but a farm teams priority should be to foster the development of their prospects to their out most potential.

Irving was on fire last season for the Heat before being called up, he was arguably the best goalie in the AHL. After the birth of his baby, and an injury, his play slipped somewhat and in turn Ward gave his starting job away.

If the decision was made to let go of HK to make Irving the anointed backup, then during the lockout Irving should of been getting the majority of starts regardless of his struggles when he was assigned to the Heat. How the hell is a goalie supposed to work his way out of slump riding the pine?

I never bought the talk that Irving had regressed so much from one year. Irving no question has had his struggles since Kipper went down, but I've also seen many positive signs out of his game. I truly believe Kipper's injury is somewhat of a blessing in disguise because we have been so reliant on Kipper since he has become a Flame and no backup has had any ample opportunity to grown their game being the #2 here.

Let's give the kid a little more time, he is a quality prospect and I still think he is going to have a good career in the NHL whether that is in Calgary or somewhere else.

 

[MarkGio]

Ward is the coach running the Heat, and its clear its his show. But in many cases the way certain decisions are being made down there is hurting the development of our prospects (ie. Nemisz, Howse, Wahl). Ward is all about winning which is great, but a farm teams priority should be to foster the development of their prospects to their out most potential.

Irving was on fire last season for the Heat before being called up, he was arguably the best goalie in the AHL. After the birth of his baby, and an injury, his play slipped somewhat and in turn Ward gave his starting job away.

If the decision was made to let go of HK to make Irving the anointed backup, then during the lockout Irving should of been getting the majority of starts regardless of his struggles when he was assigned to the Heat. How the hell is a goalie supposed to work his way out of slump riding the pine?

I never bought the talk that Irving had regressed so much from one year. Irving no question has had his struggles since Kipper went down, but I've also seen many positive signs out of his game. I truly believe Kipper's injury is somewhat of a blessing in disguise because we have been so reliant on Kipper since he has become a Flame and no backup has had any ample opportunity to grown their game being the #2 here.

Let's give the kid a little more time, he is a quality prospect and I still think he is going to have a good career in the NHL whether that is in Calgary or somewhere else.

I concur. Honestly, Irving has looked pretty good in my eyes relative to our back-ups over the years. And even compared to Kipper this season. I know he needs a few more games to settle because he was given the shaft last year. It's too bad because Irving has some amazing fundamentals and simply needs adjustment more than anything.

 

[Svenner]

Irving had a shaky 1st and 2nd period vs the Stars, but he came through with some big saves in the third to keep it a 2 goal game. Im not worried about Irving. He played great in almost all his games, obviously it was probably his worst game on wednesday, but it also wasnt the defense's best game either. Sure he let in a couple softies, but he also made a couple of big saves to compensate. Every goalie has an off game here and there and im not too concerned about this, Im sure he'll come back with a solid effort.

 

[MuffinMerc]

I watched the whole game, but thanks champ.

So allowing 4 goals is usually good enough to win? For the Flames, no it sure isn't. Actually on probably any team, it isn't. That was his worst game as a Flame, everyone is agreeing on that. He made some key saves yes, as any goalie is expected to, but he was not sharp. He was sloppy and if not for the play of Bachman and the DAL D, that game is loss every time. And regardless how bad Kipper was at puck-handling, I've never seen him give the puck away like that, ever.

Regardless, I didn't come in here to flame Irving, I just wanted to point out that the win shouldn't overshadow his play. That's it, that's all.

Thanks.

You cant blame 4 goals entirely on the guy either. I spend most of the games watching the teams defensive play, and that is the part of Hartley's system that they either haven't mastered yet, or something that has to change. There are way to many turnovers because of the stretch pass game they like. I cannot blame any one line either, because it has happened to all of them. The Flames win a puck battle down behind their own net, and in an attempt to spring our offensive rush with a stretch pass they find an opposing player pinching and intercepting the pass.

The Flames are excellent in the opposing end. Simply adequate in their own zone.

 

[berto14]

You cant blame 4 goals entirely on the guy either. I spend most of the games watching the teams defensive play, and that is the part of Hartley's system that they either haven't mastered yet, or something that has to change. There are way to many turnovers because of the stretch pass game they like. I cannot blame any one line either, because it has happened to all of them. The Flames win a puck battle down behind their own net, and in an attempt to spring our offensive rush with a stretch pass they find an opposing player pinching and intercepting the pass.

The Flames are excellent in the opposing end. Simply adequate in their own zone.

Not disagreeing with you, just wondering how you account for the fact that we've averaged the 4th fewest shots against/game?

 

[Lunatik]

Not disagreeing with you, just wondering how you account for the fact that we've averaged the 4th fewest shots against/game?

shots =/= scoring chances. Shots may be down but the team has given up alot of scoring chances.

 

[berto14]

shots =/= scoring chances. Shots may be down but the team has given up alot of scoring chances.

I agree but you would think that both would be up in that case. Just seems odd to me that shots are down but scoring chances are up? It's not like we're blocking a lot of shots either.

 

[Lunatik]

I agree but you would think that both would be up in that case. Just seems odd to me that shots are down but scoring chances are up? It's not like we're blocking a lot of shots either.

Actually I am seeing alot more shot blocks. I haven't looked at the numbers but maybe I will later.

 

[berto14]

Actually I am seeing alot more shot blocks. I haven't looked at the numbers but maybe I will later.

Currently 19th in the league with 13.45 blocks/game