Star Wars: Obi-Wan Kenobi is happening

NyQuil

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There are like, a hundred other things, but I don't want to write a wall of text. Suffice to say this is bad and whoever wrote it should feel bad. Finally, whoever allowed this version of the scripts to be shot should be mocked, pointed at, and possibly kicked in the knee.

I think you have a lot of valid points.

But I also look at some of the OT situations (the Millennium Falcon getting two Star Destroyers to run into each other, the heroes somehow eluding an entire battle station of soldiers, how badly the stormtroopers shoot, etc. etc.) and am sort of glad that the internet didn't exist back then. ;)
 

Richard

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Feb 8, 2012
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I think you have a lot of valid points.

But I also look at some of the OT situations (the Millennium Falcon getting two Star Destroyers to run into each other, the heroes somehow eluding an entire battle station of soldiers, how badly the stormtroopers shoot, etc. etc.) and am sort of glad that the internet didn't exist back then. ;)
I don't know the Star Destroyer thing was pretty clever in my opinion. Much better than the Last JEdi we are gonna run outta fuel oh noZ!
 

Twisted Sinister

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I think you have a lot of valid points.

But I also look at some of the OT situations (the Millennium Falcon getting two Star Destroyers to run into each other, the heroes somehow eluding an entire battle station of soldiers, how badly the stormtroopers shoot, etc. etc.) and am sort of glad that the internet didn't exist back then. ;)
I'm not saying the OT is the Godfather in terms of scripting (although Empire isn't too shabby here) but at least most of the stuff makes sense. It's simple, there's a logical progression, character motivations are clear and obvious... Almost like people were paying attention. Marcia Lucas deserves a lot of credit here as editor, particularly for A New Hope. The movie was apparently a mess before she got her hands on it.

For fun, here are 5 more things that make no sense in Obi-Wan Kenobi.

-An imperial star destroyer chasing a small freighter that survives by zig-zagging. This is after it's established a Star Destroyer has no issue catching a superior ship in ANH. Vader then says "increase firepower," which is nonsense dialogue. Were... they not trying before?

-Obi-Wan then decides he urgently has to go to save the people on the freighter. Urgently. With Urgency. He then proceeds to take 10 minutes and dick around before he leaves because we have to fill time I guess.

-Once he leaves, Vader has to decide whether to follow Obi-Wan or the freighter. Oh Noes!! Except Vader can just follow him with a shuttle (which he does anyway to get to the dark planet of rocks and bad lighting) while the SD could continue to ineffectually chase the freighter.

-Reva is mad at Darth Vader for stabbing her and killing her Jedi family. Her solution is to... Go kill more Jedi so she can get close to him? What?

-Getting run through with a lightsaber is not only easily survivable, but is now nothing but a flesh wound. You can totally go to Tatooine and battle Uncle Owen and Aunt Beru with a giant gaping hole in your chest. Easy breezy!

As a bonus, I'll leave you with a 3-minute scene from a children's show that's better written than the entirety of the Kenobi s***-show put together.

 
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Emperoreddy

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Meh that Rebels scene comes across at trying to be too serious for no reason. Not Alec Guinness talking in riddles. Maul doing his mustache twirling gimmick. Pure kids show fan service.
 

I am not exposed

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I'm not saying the OT is the Godfather in terms of scripting (although Empire isn't too shabby here) but at least most of the stuff makes sense. It's simple, there's a logical progression, character motivations are clear and obvious... Almost like people were paying attention. Marcia Lucas deserves a lot of credit here as editor, particularly for A New Hope. The movie was apparently a mess before she got her hands on it.

For fun, here are 5 more things that make no sense in Obi-Wan Kenobi.

-An imperial star destroyer chasing a small freighter that survives by zig-zagging. This is after it's established a Star Destroyer has no issue catching a superior ship in ANH. Vader then says "increase firepower," which is nonsense dialogue. Were... they not trying before?

-Obi-Wan then decides he urgently has to go to save the people on the freighter. Urgently. With Urgency. He then proceeds to take 10 minutes and dick around before he leaves because we have to fill time I guess.

-Once he leaves, Vader has to decide whether to follow Obi-Wan or the freighter. Oh Noes!! Except Vader can just follow him with a shuttle (which he does anyway to get to the dark planet of rocks and bad lighting) while the SD could continue to ineffectually chase the freighter.

-Reva is mad at Darth Vader for stabbing her and killing her Jedi family. Her solution is to... Go kill more Jedi so she can get close to him? What?

-Getting run through with a lightsaber is not only easily survivable, but is now nothing but a flesh wound. You can totally go to Tatooine and battle Uncle Owen and Aunt Beru with a giant gaping hole in your chest. Easy breezy!

As a bonus, I'll leave you with a 3-minute scene from a children's show that's better written than the entirety of the Kenobi s***-show put together.



I still don't get why Obi Wan didn't finish Darth off. He now knows his friend Anakin has truly gone, yet he leaves this incredibly dangerous and brutal Sith Lord alive!
 

Baby Punisher

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So I finally caught up and finished and no I did not get that "it was all worth it" feeling at all in the end like some were reporting. It did reinforce to me that scenes without Leia were generally much better.
I actually liked the strategy battle between Obi Wan and Vader. I didn't like their fight very much, though, especially beat Vader AGAIN and letting him live AGAIN. Vader should have beaten him and spared him, maybe wound him in the Force so we seen the Ben Kenobi we see in Episode 4 where he is more Force wise than Force strong and strengthening the likelihood of his death by Vader and Vader's dialog in their final duel.

And poor Reva. What a waste of a character. What a waste of the whole implication of the opening of the show. It really feels like they smashed two separate show ideas together.
As much as I like that idea I don't think it would fit with his personality. Dude was way too far gone.
 

Bowski

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It was a decent series. Leia and Obi-Wan's progression was nice.

Not into reading books about what cartoons to watch in order to get "the full story," have at them!
 

Twisted Sinister

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I don't know the Star Destroyer thing was pretty clever in my opinion. Much better than the Last JEdi we are gonna run outta fuel oh noZ!
I thought it was pretty bad but still enjoyable, Dont see what the point of this series was but hey I wont say no to more Star Wars content as long as it's not 7,8,9
Hey, no one's arguing that 8 isn't one of the unholiest abominations in cinematic history and that it should die in a fire.

I'm just saying Kenobi is bad lol.
It was a decent series. Leia and Obi-Wan's progression was nice.

Not into reading books about what cartoons to watch in order to get "the full story," have at them!
Yep, Leia and Kenobi were cute, I'll give you that. Makes you wonder why she doesn't give a crap when he dies in A New Hope. Don't answer that. It's rhetorical. Bad writing is the reason.
 

Twisted Sinister

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I feel summoned.

(It was a great movie)
It subverted my expectations that someone posted in here that they liked the movie. Clearly your postmodernist deconstruction of my statement is a masterful triumph.

Your post must surely be written and directed by Rian Johnson

But seriously, glad you liked it :laugh: Personally, it's probably the worst thing I've ever seen.
 

Hivemind

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Speaking of Bail Organa, you have to wonder why Reva didn't simply visit Alderaan, herself, and interrogate his mind to learn the exact location of Kenobi. Instead, she paid and trusted mercenaries to go there to kidnap his daughter and banked on not only Bail turning to Kenobi for help, but also Kenobi accepting and then managing to find where she was taken. It seems like a needlessly complicated plan that Vader or any other Imperial wouldn't have employed.
Because Bail Organa is still a member of the Senate, and the de facto governor/executive for Alderaan who commands the loyalty of Alderaan’s military. You can’t just go around mindf***ing Senators, even as an Inquisitor. Reva needed plausible deniability to cover her ass, thus the mercenaries to kidnap his daughter rather than anything overt. And when she took Leia directly, she brought her to a secret facility that Organa can’t prove exists, and did so under the premise of finding Leia in a rebel escape route rather than just kidnapping her from Alderaan. This was still a period where the Senate existed and had power within the Empire, and as oppressive as the Empire could be it couldn’t risk alienating a core world like Alderaan by taking direct action. Had Reva done something so brazen, it would have drawn ire not just from Vader, but the Emperor as well.
 

Osprey

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Because Bail Organa is still a member of the Senate, and the de facto governor/executive for Alderaan who commands the loyalty of Alderaan’s military. You can’t just go around mindf***ing Senators, even as an Inquisitor. Reva needed plausible deniability to cover her ass, thus the mercenaries to kidnap his daughter rather than anything overt. And when she took Leia directly, she brought her to a secret facility that Organa can’t prove exists, and did so under the premise of finding Leia in a rebel escape route rather than just kidnapping her from Alderaan. This was still a period where the Senate existed and had power within the Empire, and as oppressive as the Empire could be it couldn’t risk alienating a core world like Alderaan by taking direct action. Had Reva done something so brazen, it would have drawn ire not just from Vader, but the Emperor as well.
It was the Imperial Senate at that point and held no real power. It was just for show to maintain order and didn't stop the Emperor from making political opponents disappear. The Inquisitors hunting down the Jedi is analogous to the SS hunting down the Jews, and no one who aided Jews was safe from them, regardless of position. If the Inquisitors suspected that Organa knew the location of a Jedi, especially a known enemy, they could've insisted that he tell them. If he refused, they could've arrested him and then interrogated him. Considering the popular approval of exterminating the Jedi, even within the Senate, it would've been easy to frame him as a traitor for harboring and aiding an enemy of the state.
 
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Arthur Morgan

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Hey, no one's arguing that 8 isn't one of the unholiest abominations in cinematic history and that it should die in a fire.

I'm just saying Kenobi is bad lol.

Yep, Leia and Kenobi were cute, I'll give you that. Makes you wonder why she doesn't give a crap when he dies in A New Hope. Don't answer that. It's rhetorical. Bad writing is the reason.
Oh I know Kenobi wasn't very good lol it was fun and all just in the end seemed kinda pointless
nothing more than a money grab.
Would they stop using Luke and Leia, I always assumed Leia and Obi Wan never knew each other
I went to theaters for 8 and mannnn it was horrible. didnt go for 9. although I ended up buying it on bluray which is prob worse. cant even finish it I just hate watching it
 

Twisted Sinister

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Oh I know Kenobi wasn't very good lol it was fun and all just in the end seemed kinda pointless
nothing more than a money grab.
Would they stop using Luke and Leia, I always assumed Leia and Obi Wan never knew each other
I went to theaters for 8 and mannnn it was horrible. didnt go for 9. although I ended up buying it on bluray which is prob worse. cant even finish it I just hate watching it
9 is probably a worse-made movie. But 8 just deserves a special place in Dante's Hell with the betrayers. Level 10 y'all.
 
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MadDevil

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Oh I know Kenobi wasn't very good lol it was fun and all just in the end seemed kinda pointless
nothing more than a money grab.
Would they stop using Luke and Leia, I always assumed Leia and Obi Wan never knew each other
I went to theaters for 8 and mannnn it was horrible. didnt go for 9. although I ended up buying it on bluray which is prob worse. cant even finish it I just hate watching it
TROS is the only Star Wars movie I've never watched again after seeing it in the theater.
 
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Richard

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I watched 8 once in theaters and literally sat through it thinking "it has to be a joke." I couldn't wait to see it because, you know, Star Wars, that I snuck out of work in my suit and saw it the first day (not the midnight showing obviously) and it was a packed house at like 3pm.

Now I have traditionally gone to see Star Wars with the same group of friends that lived on my street in the late 70's, early 80's. Star Wars is cool like that --- the originals covered childhood and early high school, the prequels grad school and early family life, and the Force Awakens middle age. But, after that horrendous screening I called my buddies and said I couldn't go see it again. They were like woo ----- they went and saw it. We were like wow, they literally killed the spirit of Star Wars.

I never went to see 9 in theaters and haven't watched it to this day --- I tried to start it on Disney Plus but turned it off at the opening crawl. My friends have not seen it either.

If another Star Wars movie ever comes out, we will wait for reviews before we see it just like any other movie.

Also, if ANDOR sucks (looks amazing BTW) then that is it for Disney Plus for me. Boba Fett and Kenobi absolutely sucked out loud and were terrible (besides the 2 mando 2.5 episodes and yet..... Why did someone leave someplace.... stupid).
 

Hivemind

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It was the Imperial Senate at that point and held no real power. It was just for show to maintain order and didn't stop the Emperor from making political opponents disappear. The Inquisitors hunting down the Jedi is analogous to the SS hunting down the Jews, and no one who aided Jews was safe from them, regardless of position. If the Inquisitors suspected that Organa knew the location of a Jedi, especially a known enemy, they could've insisted that he tell them. If he refused, they could've arrested him and then interrogated him. Considering the popular approval of exterminating the Jedi, even within the Senate, it would've been easy to frame him as a traitor for harboring and aiding an enemy of the state.
It was the Imperial Senate, but it was still an essential organ in the functioning of the Empire at that point and not something that could be ignored.



We had yet to reach the point where Tarkin could declare that “fear of this battle station” would keep systems in line. They were still relying on the Senate to help administrate the Empire and maintain functional control. Moreover, Alderaan wasn’t some Outer Rim backwater like Tatooine. It was a core planet with considerable influence that other systems looked to, and Bail Organa had similar influence within the Senate. This was still several years before even the likes of Mon Mothma could be declared a traitor and chased out of the Senate by the Empire. If they pissed off Alderaan enough to create direct rebellion, dozens of other systems would follow suit.

Moreover, ignoring the specifics in this case, this also steps upon a pet peeve of mine. Just because a character doesn’t follow through with some alternative “better” plan doesn’t mean it’s some sort of plot hole. Characters are rarely intended to be perfect, and are humans (or occasionally droids or aliens in the case of Star Wars) with all the flaws of humans. Sometimes they simply don’t think of all the alternative options out there, or have various illogical reasons not to pursue an alternative plan. That doesn’t mean the plot is lazy or has gaps, only that a character devised a suboptimal plan.
 
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Garo

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TROS is the only Star Wars movie I've never watched again after seeing it in the theater.
I did after on Disney+ and... Nope, still couldn't make any sense of it, except I found it funnier except of going this has to be a joke.

Which is even more of a shame since its harder to black out and ignore it happened when I re-watch 8 and I keep going WHY DIDN'T IT STAY LIKE THAT
 

Twisted Sinister

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It was the Imperial Senate, but it was still an essential organ in the functioning of the Empire at that point and not something that could be ignored.



We had yet to reach the point where Tarkin could declare that “fear of this battle station” would keep systems in line. They were still relying on the Senate to help administrate the Empire and maintain functional control. Moreover, Alderaan wasn’t some Outer Rim backwater like Tatooine. It was a core planet with considerable influence that other systems looked to, and Bail Organa had similar influence within the Senate. This was still several years before even the likes of Mon Mothma could be declared a traitor and chased out of the Senate by the Empire. If they pissed off Alderaan enough to create direct rebellion, dozens of other systems would follow suit.

Moreover, ignoring the specifics in this case, this also steps upon a pet peeve of mine. Just because a character doesn’t follow through with some alternative “better” plan doesn’t mean it’s some sort of plot hole. Characters are rarely intended to be perfect, and are humans (or occasionally droids or aliens in the case of Star Wars) with all the flaws of humans. Sometimes they simply don’t think of all the alternative options out there, or have various illogical reasons not to pursue an alternative plan. That doesn’t mean the plot is lazy or has gaps, only that a character devised a suboptimal plan.

This is not the only case where the show exhibits plotholes or lazy writing.

I respect your attempt to cite lore to fix up gaping plot holes. However, I'd say one major problem with this show that you've kind of maybe touched on is that it simply shouldn't exist. It's hamfistedly retconned into the canon and they have to try and bend over backwards numerous ways to try and explain it. And they still fail most of the time.

Even if what you're saying is true (and it is to a point, the senate still did involve itself in governance), the empire was never above removing obvious political opponents and installing sympathizers. As such, people like Bail and Mon Mothma had to engage in skullduggery and subterfuge to never show obvious rebel ties.

However, because of this show, the Inquisitors and therefore the empire know that Bail is in contact with anti-empire elements. Palpatine would have to move against him in this case unless he's an idiot.

The show also opens up other plotholes they have to try to explain away.
-Palpatine has to give Vader a therapy session to explain why he doesn't go after Kenobi for the next 10 years, but then why does Tarkin think Obi Wan might be dead in ANH?

-They try to explain away Obi Wan knowing Leia in their last scene together, but then why wouldn't Leia show some emotion when Obi Wan dies? She's suddenly kind of a jerk.

-Why does Obi Wan let a genocidal mass murderer with godlike powers live after seeing the damage he's caused in intervening years? This is especially true since he believes Vader is no longer Anakin, as per the ending.

-Want laziness? Why does Obi Wan let his powers slide when his only mission in life is to protect Luke from the Sith? Lazy writing, that's why. They need to create an artificial arc for him so that's how they do it.

And these are just overarching plotholes in canon. The show is perfectly adept at creating plotholes within itself as well, some of which I've mentioned in my previous posts.
 
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Arthur Morgan

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TROS is the only Star Wars movie I've never watched again after seeing it in the theater.
Because its garbage. I didnt go to the theater to see TROS after TLJ and Leia flying through space was enough of the new trilogy for me.
I finished TLJ in the theaters but thats the exact spot that lost my interest, after that I only noticed how bad it was
 

Hivemind

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However, because of this show, the Inquisitors and therefore the empire know that Bail is in contact with anti-empire elements. Palpatine would have to move against him in this case unless he's an idiot.
When they view the time as right, they do move against him. They blow up his f***ing planet with the Death Star :laugh:


This is not the only case where the show exhibits plotholes or lazy writing.
I wasn't making a broader argument about this show, only responding to that single post. But @NyQuil 's post at the top of this page sums up my thoughts better than I could. If people want to nitpick and dredge up perceived "plot holes," there's plenty to be found in the original trilogy itself, as well.
 

Twisted Sinister

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When they view the time as right, they do move against him. They blow up his f***ing planet with the Death Star :laugh:



I wasn't making a broader argument about this show, only responding to that single post. But @NyQuil 's post at the top of this page sums up my thoughts better than I could. If people want to nitpick and dredge up perceived "plot holes," there's plenty to be found in the original trilogy itself, as well.
By the time they blow up his planet with the Death Star, he and his adopted daughter have already had the time to contribute significantly to the faction that will take them down as well as find the means to blow up said Death Star.

As to your second point, the OT had simple enough plotting and everything followed somewhat logically. Conversely, Kenobi doesn't have plot holes, it has plot canyons. Many of which are easily resolvable if the scripts aren't written by hacks.

I realize lots of people want to shut off their brains and just be like "Obi Wan fight Vader and go Super Saiyan! Cool!"

I want just a little more effort put into my entertainment than that. I hate the "well it's a movie about space wizards and you're overanalyzing it lol" argument. Anything about any subject can be written well and non-lazily.
 
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