Post-Game Talk: STANLEY CUP FINAL Tampa Bay is THE WINNER.

[admiralcadillac]

Did you read the post?

I pointed out clearly the first 5 years of drafting as an example that drafting NHL talent wasn't nearly the issue you suggested it was.

9 nhl-ers in 5 years, drafting 25th or later in 3 of those 5 years, is not a bad result.

The last 3 years only further highlights that our drafting department itself is not the issue.

Yes I read your perfect demonstration of how piss poor the drafting has been. Two top ten picks, one bottom pairing d man we're hoping gets pushed out of the lineup and one third liner.

 

[BLONG7]

You’re over thinking it. Tampa will be fine.

Yes they will, but they will also suffer losses getting creative. They have 5.3M cap left, and 7-8 guys to sign...one of them is Sergachev who will eat all of that 5.3M himself. No cakewalk for them ahead.......but they do have a good GM, unlike the clown in Montreal.

 

[Adam Michaels]

 

[admiralcadillac]

Yes they will, but they will also suffer losses getting creative. They have 5.3M cap left, and 7-8 guys to sign...one of them is Sergachev who will eat all of that 5.3M himself. No cakewalk for them ahead.......but they do have a good GM, unlike the clown in Montreal.

You'd be criticizing Bergevin for signing Palat, Gourde etc. to 5m + contracts. Those are their mid tier players. They're going to have to gut the team completely. At least they have a cup, thanks to the drafting.

 

[Andy]

You'd be criticizing Bergevin for signing Palat, Gourde etc. to 5m + contracts. Those are their mid tier players. They're going to have to gut the team completely. At least they have a cup, thanks to the drafting.

It’s funny because those mid tier players you mentioned have had better seasons in recent years than most habs forwards.makes you think

 

[CrAzYNiNe]

The salary cap will do to Tampa Bay's Cup winning roster the same aa it did to Chicago's, only faster.

what if only Stamkos and Mcdonagh?

 

[Wats]

You'd be criticizing Bergevin for signing Palat, Gourde etc. to 5m + contracts. Those are their mid tier players. They're going to have to gut the team completely. At least they have a cup, thanks to the drafting.

Difference is they sign young guys and move them for good assets later when necessary.

 

[admiralcadillac]

It’s funny because those mid tier players you mentioned have had better seasons in recent years than most habs forwards.makes you think

Makes me think what? That the team is good?

No kidding.

Difference is they sign young guys and move them for good assets later when necessary.

Care to give me an example? He hasn’t traded anyone from the team yet.

You could say Drouin I guess

 

[DAChampion]

what if only Stamkos and Mcdonagh?

It night be hard to move Stamkos. He is an aging and declining player.

Wouldn't McDonagh be hard to replace?

 

[CrAzYNiNe]

It night be hard to move Stamkos. He is an aging and declining player.

Wouldn't McDonagh be hard to replace?

I would think so, but not impossible. Also it could be done by committee. Two players gone and it frees up over 15M sounds better than gutting the team.

 

[DAChampion]

I would think so, but not impossible. Also it could be done by committee. Two players gone and it frees up over 15M sounds better than gutting the team.

That's a reasonable plan, they would also get a lot of assets by shifting those two.

 

[The Real Timo]

It’s funny because those mid tier players you mentioned have had better seasons in recent years than most habs forwards.makes you think

They are TB's mid tier players. While Hab's mid tier players are Lekhonen, Armia and Weise... et Co.

 

[Wats]

Makes me think what? That the team is good?

No kidding.



Care to give me an example? He hasn’t traded anyone from the team yet.

You could say Drouin I guess

They have moved out players who are making/will ask for too much money for their liking all the time. Last 3 years:
Bishop, Filppula, JT Miller, Gusev, and Drouin. They don't let cap stop them from re-signing guys they want to keep and they move guys they don't want/deem expendable.

They have Point under contract for 2 more years at 6.75M. They overpaid for good/cheap 3rd liners in Coleman/Goodrow at the deadline just for this reason, their depth is going to be fine. Johnson/Gourde/Killorn aren't what makes Tampa Bay good, it's how they manage to continually develop these guys. The next batch is waiting in their minors. Personally don't think they move Palat and think they keep Gourde since he is very versatile.

Take out Johnson/Killorn, leaves about 10M + 5M they already have. Sign Cirelli/Sergachev/Cernak to bridge deals.

Palat - Point - Kucherov
Gourde - Cirelli - Stamkos
Coleman - Paquette - Goodrow
Volkov - Stephens - Joseph
+whatever UFA decides to sign for minimum like Maroon/Shattenkirk last season
+whatever prospects they develop

 

[admiralcadillac]

They have moved out players who are making/will ask for too much money for their liking all the time. Last 3 years:
Bishop, Filppula, JT Miller, Gusev, and Drouin. They don't let cap stop them from re-signing guys they want to keep and they move guys they don't want/deem expendable.

They have Point under contract for 2 more years at 6.75M. They overpaid for good/cheap 3rd liners in Coleman/Goodrow at the deadline just for this reason, their depth is going to be fine. Johnson/Gourde/Killorn aren't what makes Tampa Bay good, it's how they manage to continually develop these guys. The next batch is waiting in their minors. Personally don't think they move Palat and think they keep Gourde since he is very versatile.

Take out Johnson/Killorn, leaves about 10M + 5M they already have. Sign Cirelli/Sergachev/Cernak to bridge deals.

Palat - Point - Kucherov
Gourde - Cirelli - Stamkos
Coleman - Paquette - Goodrow
Volkov - Stephens - Joseph
+whatever UFA decides to sign for minimum like Maroon/Shattenkirk last season
+whatever prospects they develop

You don't know that they'll find replacements for any 2 of Gourde, Johnson and Palat (I think two of those guys kind of need to go) but you're absolutely right in saying they found a replacement for JT Miller. Forgot about him.

 

[Rapala]

Meh seeing another US team win the cup has gotten so damn boring. I know Bettman is trying to grow the game in America but throw Canada a damn bone once and awhile and get more teams in Canada. 1993 is the last time a Canadian team has won the cup and its been all America since then which I find quite BS. American teams out number Canadian teams by almost triple the amount and they have teams that have been failing since the beginning of there expansion into the league and haven't filled the arena ever and they are taking Canadian revenue to keep shit teams like Arizona afloat. What is worse is next expansion its ANOTHER damn American team.

Anyways congrats to Tampa I guess?

Until we see a tax equalization plan put in place hence a truly level playing field. Canadian teams will continue to take the deep shaft up the arse.

 

[Wats]

You don't know that they'll find replacements for any 2 of Gourde, Johnson and Palat (I think two of those guys kind of need to go) but you're absolutely right in saying they found a replacement for JT Miller. Forgot about him.

They already found guys at the deadline: Coleman/Goodrow. These weren't rentals, they were acquired specifically to fill out their bottom 6 this and next season, their minutes are just going to increase (especially Goodrow). Cirelli's role will get expanded as he progresses. Personally, can't see them moving Palat, he has historically been really good for them in playoffs and his contract expires just as Point's contract expires. He was on first line on the cup run.

Killorn IMO for sure traded. He probably has the highest value and is the oldest of the bunch. Personally would move him, collect the picks and fill his role with Coleman/Gourde.
Johnson has least value (maybe even negative value). Wouldn't be surprised if they have to add something for a team to take him. Goodrow easily replaces him IMO.

I know for sure they will have prospects ready too. They already have a bunch of kids that they rotated in last couple seasons who did well in AHL. There's no evidence to suggest that they will suddenly become bad at developing. People already calling their next Q steal: Alex Barre-Boulet.

 

[Rapala]

Julien Brisebois GM of Bulldogs during Montreal's best development years in AHL from 2006-2010, wins a Calder Cup. The moment he left they have yet to have any success. Becomes assistant GM and wins another Calder Cup with Lightning AHL team (lost twice in finals too). Becomes GM Sept 2018, wins franchises first president trophy and now a Stanley Cup.

This is the killer. Talent lost with no gain. Both on and off the ice.

 

[BJCOLLINS]

Congrats “Bolts”!
Absolute beast of a D core.
Honorary tip of the cap to Steve Y.

 

[cphabs]

Sergachev just won the f***ing Stanley Cup as a barely 22 year old defenseman that played around 20 minutes a game... LMFAO! He was key in Tampa’s run and regular season. Another former Hab’s Defenseman also won the cup with Tampa... I don’t see this trend ending.

 

[Whitesnake]

You'd be criticizing Bergevin for signing Palat, Gourde etc. to 5m + contracts. Those are their mid tier players. They're going to have to gut the team completely. At least they have a cup, thanks to the drafting.

At least they have a cup? Isn't that the goal? Do you think the criticism for Bergevin only comes with his moves EVEN though we have great results? Really? See, Brisebois and Co WERE bashed last year. They lost badly. Were ridiculized and were bashed. But not anymore. The bashing isn't about the moves. It's about the end result.

Just like the praising shouldn't be about WINNING TRADES....but should be about BUILDING A PLAYOFF TEAM.

 

[admiralcadillac]

At least they have a cup? Isn't that the goal? Do you think the criticism for Bergevin only comes with his moves EVEN though we have great results? Really? See, Brisebois and Co WERE bashed last year. They lost badly. Were ridiculized and were bashed. But not anymore. The bashing isn't about the moves. It's about the end result.

Just like the praising shouldn't be about WINNING TRADES....but should be about BUILDING A PLAYOFF TEAM.

Your first paragraph doesn’t make any sense with regards to mine.

If it’s about building a playoff team then he’s done that this year.

If it’s about building that involves the concept of time. Posters here criticize the 8 year tenure but remain inconsistent when it comes to what they actually want. The team’s been in the playoffs and now it’s in the middling phases of a rebuild.

You can either rebuild and get progressively better or stay in the throes of a playoff race with horses that won’t compete.

 

[Doc McKenna]

Soon people will forget about that Halak run

Nah I still talk about Kirk McLean as the best damn standup goalie I ever watched in the finals that I remember very well. Brodeur was a hybrid, so he doesn't count.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

Your first paragraph doesn’t make any sense with regards to mine.

If it’s about building a playoff team then he’s done that this year.

If it’s about building that involves the concept of time. Posters here criticize the 8 year tenure but remain inconsistent when it comes to what they actually want. The team’s been in the playoffs and now it’s in the middling phases of a rebuild.

You can either rebuild and get progressively better or stay in the throes of a playoff race with horses that won’t compete.

No, he did not and you know it. Claiming that he did is disingeneous to the extreme. I don't even think Habs management will go that far and claim that.

 

[Doc McKenna]

Problem has been a GM who doesn't understand how to build through the draft... Nor the importance of hiring quality personnel to run hockey ops & player development, preferring instead to stick with friends & relatives.

8 years without adding 1 first round pick...
Trades away a great lottery drafted prospect for a downgrade in impact & need (thanks to terrible pro scouting)...
Worst AHL program in the league for 6+ years...

The draft itself is way down the list in terms of management fail during his tenure.

Sergachev, Galch, Lekhonen, Mete, Andrighetto, Evans, DLR, Hudon, Juulsen...

That's not a bad result from 5 years of drafting with only twice picking in the top - 20. (Ignoring the last 3 drafts BC of recency, but JKO, Poehling, Romanov, Caufield et only highlight further that our drafting isn't the problem).

Developing the picks we have, not rushing them, not telling 1st rounders to be 3rd line goons, more worried about playing da system instead of getting these guys to fix some small liabilities and accelerate the tools they have. We do the opposite, if its a weakness we will hammer it out no matter if it diminishes their other skills considerably. Sometimes you play to their strengths and help them develop as much as you can their not so strong facets. And when you can't do that, do like TB and trade Drouin....I mean a player for something you can work with to improve your team.

 

[CHfan1]

Conn Smythe voting was close

TOTALS:
Victor Hedman 70 points (9-8-1)
Brayden Point 66 points (8-8-2)
Nikita Kucherov 25 points (1-2-14)
Andrei Vasilevskiy 1 point (0-0-1)

PHWA’s 2020 Conn Smythe Ballots: Hedman’s razor thin win – Professional Hockey Writers Association