Solving the Mediocre Minnesota Wild

[Just Linda]

I have a serious question about this discussion. Not about the Wild in general, but about the construction of a Cup-quality NHL team.

Many people here talk about a 1C as if that is the Holy Grail of hockey players. I think everyone would agree in Gretzky and Lemieux's case. For sure. Top center playmaker, etc.....

But, my question is: Who was the Blues 1C? What were his stats for the regular season? Who was the Kings' 1C in their Cup years and what were his stats?

I'm really trying to work this out in my mind, because hockey is such a team game. On another thread here there is an ongoing argument about the Habs 93 Cup. Many say is was Roy who won them the Cup, and his skaters were 'meh'.

So, I'm trying to understand this 'need a 1C' idea. Not that I'm against it. I am just trying to understand exactly what level of a player qualifies, and how definite the need is.

Thanks.

One thing about the cup winning centres is that they are fantastic defensively while still being able to put up points. Crosby, Backstrom, Toews, Kopitar, and now RoR could shut down the elite scorers while tilting the offence the right way. Even the Habs you mentioned had good two-way centres in '93, Roy was great but the Habs team at least kept him from facing 50 shots a game.

The Blues had RoR, the Kings had Kopitar. Both put up P/PG or close to it while having Selke level seasons.

I'd say a contender needs at least a 65+ pt good defensive centre, at least one high end sniper/scorer, a good 2C, a true high end 1D, and quality depth to win the cup.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Lets just compare 3 prospects within Minnesota's pool. Boldy, Khovanov, and Menell. Boldy probably had the least impressive numbers (even though they were still good for a college rookie).

Those aren't the top 3? Kaprizov, Boldy and possibly Kahkonen or Addison.

I don't think its a Minnesota bias at all, some of it likely is draft bias where Minnesota doesn;t have a ton of top 10 picks (though there is a reason why they are top 10 picks), I feel its more because their higher profile picks amongst their fanbase aren't close to the NHL (Kaprisov and Addison not included).

Do you need a ton of top 10 picks? Boldy appears to be ready for the NHL. There is some question if Khovanov may sneak in, just because of depth issues at center, but he's talented enough. Most people don't even know Minnesota's prospects, much less care. Menell and Belpedio are held back because there isn't enough room to carry 10 defensemen.

 

[Just Linda]

Those aren't the top 3? Kaprizov, Boldy and possibly Kahkonen or Addison.



Do you need a ton of top 10 picks? Boldy appears to be ready for the NHL. There is some question if Khovanov may sneak in, just because of depth issues at center, but he's talented enough. Most people don't even know Minnesota's prospects, much less care. Menell and Belpedio are held back because there isn't enough room to carry 10 defensemen.

I didn't say those were top 3, just compared 3. It was easier to compare Boldy to those 2 for the sake of the specific post I was responding to (numbers vs potential).

I also don't think Boldy and Khovanov are NHL ready. I think Boldy needs another year for sure, he'd struggle more than you'd like right now but in another year (or two) he'll be able to be a middle 6er. Khovanov definitely isn't ready to skip the AHL.

 

[Frobbo]

Those aren't the top 3? Kaprizov, Boldy and possibly Kahkonen or Addison.



Do you need a ton of top 10 picks? Boldy appears to be ready for the NHL. There is some question if Khovanov may sneak in, just because of depth issues at center, but he's talented enough. Most people don't even know Minnesota's prospects, much less care. Menell and Belpedio are held back because there isn't enough room to carry 10 defensemen.

Boldy appears ready for the NHL? He was the 5th highest scorer ON HIS OWN TEAM. It is no sin to not be ready in your D+1 year but he isn't close. THN had him as the 47th best prospect in March. He needs another year. Yes he finished strong but he had Newhook on his line too.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Our "mediocrity" is so damn overblown, like we're some outlier in the league. We're not.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

MN tied for the most prospects on Wheelers list yesterday. It was interesting to see after I was assured time and time again that they didn’t have a top 10 prospect pool and that Ian Mitchell, who didn’t make the list, was better than any wild prospect.

 

[tsujimoto74]

What's baffling about it? They don't have a true 1C, and it's darn near impossible to be much good without one.

 

[absolute garbage]

I think Kaprizov is the best prospect Wild have. The tier after that is Boldy and Beckman. Tier after that is Addison, Menell, Khovanov and Kahkonen.

At least that's the way I see it. My assessment comes from the promise they've shown coupled with their upside.

Don't know if that's top 10 or not, but I don't consider that a particularly strong group.

 

[GOilers88]

What's baffling about it? They don't have a true 1C, and it's darn near impossible to be much good without one.

Near impossible to be very good or near impossible to win the cup?

It's not near impossible at all to be a good team and not have an HF "true 1C".

Whatever that is.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I think Kaprizov is the best prospect Wild have. The tier after that is Boldy and Beckman. Tier after that is Addison, Menell, Khovanov and Kahkonen.

At least that's the way I see it. My assessment comes from the promise they've shown coupled with their upside.

Don't know if that's top 10 or not, but I don't consider that a particularly strong group.

Not sure the tiers are right, but that's basically the top 7. A top 7 that I would put up against quite a few teams in the league.

 

[Big Empty]

Laf/Kap/Fiala/Boldy is pretty solid

unfortunate that the Habs are going to be getting Laf tho

 

[Frobbo]

Wheeler in his comments section said that the MN pool currently would rank in the 5-10 range, closer to 5. Add 2 more 1st round picks this year and... It means there is a good likelihood that the Wild are trending up, how much TBD.
BTW in today's top 10 goalies prospects KK is mentioned among the "others".

 

[thestonedkoala]

BTW in today's top 10 goalies prospects KK is mentioned among the "others".

KK was the top goaltender in the AHL this year and has had 13 SO in two years. He had two more than second place (Max Legace) who has a total of 8 in his career. He was 4th in GAA and in SV%. He is extremely underrated as a goalie.

 

[gwh]

KK was the top goaltender in the AHL this year and has had 13 SO in two years. He had two more than second place (Max Legace) who has a total of 8 in his career. He was 4th in GAA and in SV%. He is extremely underrated as a goalie.

Partly because the guys in front of him are terrible. Why we didn't bring KK up this season is the real mystery.

 

[Healthy DiPietro]

You can't play in muted green as your main color and be anything but mediocre.

 

[mattihp]

You can't play in muted green as your main color and be anything but mediocre.

The jerseys could look amazing if the green was "spruced" up!

 

[Bruce Granville]

You can't play in muted green as your main color and be anything but mediocre.

This is true.
The only team in green that stood out is Celtic Glasgow.

 

[57special]

They should change to Black and White stripes like Newcastle.

 

[MNRube]

Wheeler in his comments section said that the MN pool currently would rank in the 5-10 range, closer to 5. Add 2 more 1st round picks this year and... It means there is a good likelihood that the Wild are trending up, how much TBD.
BTW in today's top 10 goalies prospects KK is mentioned among the "others".

exactly. It’s already a Top 5-10 prospect group before this draft where they likely have 2 1sts.

 

[TheUnusedCrayon]

Also keep in mind that Minny would be in a way better spot had they not sabotaged the team with terrible trades the past couple years.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

They've been a bit unlucky to never really get that lucky "lightening in a bottle" situation over the years.

I look at a prime Koviu and don't think he's far off ROR; same with Suter and someone like Pietrangelo. Even Staal's been good as a go-to offensive weapon. However they've never really had that guy, star or depth piece, who goes supernova in the playoffs and takes a series over.

Think Halak carrying the Habs past the Caps and Pens, or Karlsson bringing the Sens to the brink of the SCF.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

They've been a bit unlucky to never really get that lucky "lightening in a bottle" situation over the years.

I look at a prime Koviu and don't think he's far off ROR; same with Suter and someone like Pietrangelo. Even Staal's been good as a go-to offensive weapon. However they've never really had that guy, star or depth piece, who goes supernova in the playoffs and takes a series over.

Think Halak carrying the Habs past the Caps and Pens, or Karlsson bringing the Sens to the brink of the SCF.

The team was built for a conference finals run or two. They were never going to win a cup, but they had good enough teams to make a run. They just happened to run into Chicago during their dynasty a few too many times. 16-17, they were arguably the best team in the league until the Hanzal trade at the trade deadline. The whole team dynamic was thrown off and they ran into a hot goalie in the playoffs and lost in the 1st round. 17-18 I think they could’ve skated with Winnipeg, but Suter, Parise and Spurgeon were injured so there was never really a chance. The strength of the team is our back-end, and it’s top 2 defenders were out.

 

[Odie Cleghorn]

Boldy appears ready for the NHL? He was the 5th highest scorer ON HIS OWN TEAM. It is no sin to not be ready in your D+1 year but he isn't close. THN had him as the 47th best prospect in March. He needs another year. Yes he finished strong but he had Newhook on his line too.

He finished strong because they gave up trying to make him into a centre. Just playing wing all year at wing would have resulted in even higher totals. He probably needs another year but he should be a scoring line forward in the NHL.

 

[Nharris31]

Look more people who know nothing about the Wild.

 

[Peat]

I have a serious question about this discussion. Not about the Wild in general, but about the construction of a Cup-quality NHL team.

Many people here talk about a 1C as if that is the Holy Grail of hockey players. I think everyone would agree in Gretzky and Lemieux's case. For sure. Top center playmaker, etc.....

But, my question is: Who was the Blues 1C? What were his stats for the regular season? Who was the Kings' 1C in their Cup years and what were his stats?

I'm really trying to work this out in my mind, because hockey is such a team game. On another thread here there is an ongoing argument about the Habs 93 Cup. Many say is was Roy who won them the Cup, and his skaters were 'meh'.

So, I'm trying to understand this 'need a 1C' idea. Not that I'm against it. I am just trying to understand exactly what level of a player qualifies, and how definite the need is.

Thanks.

Ryan O'Reilly was the Blues 1C and had 77 points, 19th in the league for Cs (well, Cs and Ws that are still counted as Cs).

Anze Kopitar was the Kings 1C and had 76 points in 2012, 9th in the league for Cs, and 70 points in 2014, 10th in the league for Cs.

They don't have to be an elite top 5 scorer or ought but they do need to be productive and capable of centering a line that can go against opposition best.

Maybe you could get away with, I dunno, Danault and William Karlsson as your top 6 Cs if you were loaded everywhere else, but nobody's made it happen recently. And tbh, I'd imagine if they were that bolstered, one of them would put up 1C numbers, sorta like how Bergeron started posting much higher numbers when with Pasta and Marchand. I guess Boston would be the closest to that now I mention it, but Krejci got 23rd in scoring that year and 29th, so... kinda low end 1Cs.