Soderberg's upside and the B's future at center...

[David Krejci*]

I guess I need clarification on what separates Giroux from Tavares then....because there's very little. Very very little.

Your opinion is yours, im not here to late opinions, but this is one of those cases where I think an "opinion" is wrong. This is coming from a B's fan that watches wayyyyy too many flyers games and has a man crush on many Flyers.

Its great that Krejci made two finals, but in a 1 on 1 comparison, what does that really mean? If Giroux was backed by two historic goaltending runs, would that make a difference? I would bet yes over guys like Leighton, Bryz, Boucher, Mason. Flyers lack of success isnt because of Giroux's play, thats for sure. Hes been historically extremely good. Ive never seen a more dominant performance than the Pens series a couple years back by a single player.

I realize I am not going to change your opinion, nor am I calling you an idiot for it. I just think if we polled 100 people, the only way to get Krejci a vote would be sneaking you into the group haha.

Well there's only one playoff series to go off of in terms of production and how he converted his regular season play to playoffs, so that's not really something you can put a whole lot of stock into. He did at times, look flat out dominant in that series vs Pittsburgh though. And that was at what, 21? Or 22, I don't know. But I feel like his skill level is a notch higher than Krejci and Giroux, he's also so much younger. But you're right, I put so much into playoff consistency and being able to raise your game and come up big at the times when your team needs it most, maybe I shouldn't have put Tavares up there just yet? Krejci and Giroux have both proven themselves to be consistent playoff animals.

The thing about the goalies and the team surrounding the two players, yeah the Bruins have had better teams and goalies, but it's not like Krejci was a role player on any of those teams. He was the leading scorer, over everybody, not just everybody on the Bruins, but the rest of the league. In years when they went to the Finals and played against guys on offensive juggernauts of teams like the Sedins (who literally their only value is that they put up points and are useless losers otherwise), and Toews and Kane (who I would take over ANYONE), he outscored them all, and did it in the Bruins system where nobody outscores anyone.

And most importantly, it seemed like most of his goals or primary assists were game winners or game tiers or insurance goals late. I'm not going to say anybody is wrong for taking Giroux over Krejci, but personally, I wouldn't. Maybe on another team, but here, Krejci just works and is proven to work in every single facet of the game at a ridiculous level.

 

[member 96824]

Well there's only one playoff series to go off of in terms of production and how he converted his regular season play to playoffs, so that's not really something you can put a whole lot of stock into. He did at times, look flat out dominant in that series vs Pittsburgh though. And that was at what, 21? Or 22, I don't know. But I feel like his skill level is a notch higher than Krejci and Giroux, he's also so much younger. But you're right, I put so much into playoff consistency and being able to raise your game and come up big at the times when your team needs it most, maybe I shouldn't have put Tavares up there just yet? Krejci and Giroux have both proven themselves to be consistent playoff animals.

The thing about the goalies and the team surrounding the two players, yeah the Bruins have had better teams and goalies, but it's not like Krejci was a role player on any of those teams. He was the leading scorer, over everybody, not just everybody on the Bruins, but the rest of the league. In years when they went to the Finals and played against guys on offensive juggernauts of teams like the Sedins (who literally their only value is that they put up points and are useless losers otherwise), and Toews and Kane (who I would take over ANYONE), he outscored them all, and did it in the Bruins system where nobody outscores anyone.

And most importantly, it seemed like most of his goals or primary assists were game winners or game tiers or insurance goals late. I'm not going to say anybody is wrong for taking Giroux over Krejci, but personally, I wouldn't. Maybe on another team, but here, Krejci just works and is proven to work in every single facet of the game at a ridiculous level.

Now you've lost me, because youre talking about stats, primary assists and leading scorers....I thought those dont matter?

Ill say, Krejci lead in points in 11, but it was simply because he played more games, he didnt lead in PPG.

From there though, we will go our separate paths...I respect a good argument, but you've just ventured off being consistent, and for that...I'm out. You cant pick and choose when stats count.

I will always feel Giroux is better than Krejci, and anyone who's watched both consistently will feel the same way. That's not a knock on Krejci, just realism when you compare him to an MVP candidate

 

[BergyWho37]

Now you've lost me, because youre talking about stats, primary assists and leading scorers....I thought those dont matter?

Ill say, Krejci lead in points in 11, but it was simply because he played more games, he didnt lead in PPG.

From there though, we will go our separate paths...I respect a good argument, but you've just ventured off being consistent, and for that...I'm out. You cant pick and choose when stats count.

I will always feel Giroux is better than Krejci, and anyone who's watched both consistently will feel the same way. That's not a knock on Krejci, just realism when you compare him to an MVP candidate

I often think nobody realistically thinks of our system compared to others.. Pretty sure most players that left this team lately gets more points on other teams

This Krejci poster has made a list of 10 centres that are better then Krejci .. No one mentions that they get more ice time each game then Krech does ..then add if they have elite scorer to pass too.
pts can be overrated too

I'd put money on both Bergy and Krech IF they left this system and had ice time that a number 1 centre gets on most teams they'd surpass there season pt total that they've ever had on Boston not counting Bergys years that Claude wasn't here

Having 2 centres in the top 15 or darn close ..is better then having Bergy in top 15 and then drop a lot to compared others to Yeti say top 50 then .. maybe spooner hits top 100 cause not proven

Yeti will stay 3rd line centre or move to wing or be traded waaaay before Krejci gets moved

 

[wintersej]

I often think nobody realistically thinks of our system compared to others.. Pretty sure most players that left this team lately gets more points on other teams

This Krejci poster has made a list of 10 centres that are better then Krejci .. No one mentions that they get more ice time each game then Krech does ..then add if they have elite scorer to pass too.
pts can be overrated too

I'd put money on both Bergy and Krech IF they left this system and had ice time that a number 1 centre gets on most teams they'd surpass there season pt total that they've ever had on Boston not counting Bergys years that Claude wasn't here

Having 2 centres in the top 15 or darn close ..is better then having Bergy in top 15 and then drop a lot to compared others to Yeti say top 50 then .. maybe spooner hits top 100 cause not proven

Yeti will stay 3rd line centre or move to wing or be traded waaaay before Krejci gets moved

I think Krejci's minutes get over blown a little bit. He finished in the top 30 centers in TOI per game, only 13 seconds per game less than Seguin.

Bergeron, on the other hand, does get his minutes limited more. I wonder if he would be as effective defensively if he was playing Crosby minutes, though.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

I love DK, but I'm sorry, he is not better than Giroux, and he is not better than Backstrom. I would take either one of those guy 7 days a week and twice on Sunday if Krejci was the asking price.

And for those people suggesting Soderberg is definitely gone, maybe during the season...

Why on earth would any GM in the NHL trade a 3rd line C that is capable of playing Top 6 minutes if there are injuries AND makes only $1 mil, when his team is having Cap issues?

Those of you who think that Soderberg automatically tries to break the bank on his next deal haven't followed his career at all.

 

[David Krejci*]

I love DK, but I'm sorry, he is not better than Giroux, and he is not better than Backstrom. I would take either one of those guy 7 days a week and twice on Sunday if Krejci was the asking price.

And for those people suggesting Soderberg is definitely gone, maybe during the season...

Why on earth would any GM in the NHL trade a 3rd line C that is capable of playing Top 6 minutes if there are injuries AND makes only $1 mil, when his team is having Cap issues?

Those of you who think that Soderberg automatically tries to break the bank on his next deal haven't followed his career at all.

Giroux is better, fine. Krejci has had a much better career, but if you want to say Giroux is better, I can concede that and will not argue with anyone who says that because Giroux is an animal.

Backstrom is not better. Absolutely not. You'll bring up that he had a 100 point season. Don't care. He isn't even close to Krejci in the playoffs.

Agree with you about them not trading Soderberg.

However I do disagree with you about him taking the most money as a UFA. It's not automatic that he will, it's not automatic that any player will. But what he has done earlier in his career is irrelevant. The money he will be set to make, even if he has a decent season, will dwarf anything he has had the opportunity to make in the past.

This will likely be his biggest chance to cash in for his career, and give himself and his family security. He had a baby last year, he has other people to worry about providing for other than just himself. It would not surprise me one bit to see him go to the highest bidder, and there's nothing wrong with that. In fact I would be surprised if he didn't go to the highest bidder.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

Giroux is better, fine. Krejci has had a much better career, but if you want to say Giroux is better, I can concede that and will not argue with anyone who says that because Giroux is an animal.

Backstrom is not better. Absolutely not. You'll bring up that he had a 100 point season. Don't care. He isn't even close to Krejci in the playoffs.

Agree with you about them not trading Soderberg.

However I do disagree with you about him taking the most money as a UFA. It's not automatic that he will, it's not automatic that any player will. But what he has done earlier in his career is irrelevant. The money he will be set to make, even if he has a decent season, will dwarf anything he has had the opportunity to make in the past.

This will likely be his biggest chance to cash in for his career, and give himself and his family security. He had a baby last year, he has other people to worry about providing for other than just himself. It would not surprise me one bit to see him go to the highest bidder, and there's nothing wrong with that. In fact I would be surprised if he didn't go to the highest bidder.

I'm not basing my opinion strictly on the playoffs, that would be ridiculous. While Bax has had Ovechkin, he has not enjoyed the overall talent that Krejci has, nor the goaltending.

As far as Soderberg goes, what he has done throughout his career is definitely relevant, despite your opinion. It shows a pattern of a guy that walks to the beat of his own drummer. If he is happy and comfortable in Boston, I believe that will be the number one factor, not $$$. Doesn't mean he's going to get taken advantage of, but I also don't believe he's a mercenary based on his actions throughout his career.

 

[wintersej]

I'm not basing my opinion strictly on the playoffs, that would be ridiculous. While Bax has had Ovechkin, he has not enjoyed the overall talent that Krejci has, nor the goaltending.

As far as Soderberg goes, what he has done throughout his career is definitely relevant, despite your opinion. It shows a pattern of a guy that walks to the beat of his own drummer. If he is happy and comfortable in Boston, I believe that will be the number one factor, not $$$. Doesn't mean he's going to get taken advantage of, but I also don't believe he's a mercenary based on his actions throughout his career.

Very much agree on Soderberg not being about the money and liking situations. Really, this entire conversation is lacking information we need.

If Soderberg will take 4.25 and Krejci wants 8.5, I'm sure even the most ardent Krejci supporter would have to wonder what the Bruins could do with that extra 4.25 million.

If Krejci will take 7 and Soderberg want's 5.5, even the biggest Soderberg supporter will drive him to the airport.

 

[Mr. Make-Believe]

Backstrom is not better. Absolutely not. You'll bring up that he had a 100 point season. Don't care. He isn't even close to Krejci in the playoffs.

In P/G, he's actually just 5% lower than Krejci in the playoffs... On a team that hasn't made it out of the second round.

And in ten less regular season games, he's scored 17 more goals and compiled 100 more assists.

But I forgot... Stats, schmats. He isn't even close to David Krejci.

 

[bearcountry17]

In P/G, he's actually just 5% lower than Krejci in the playoffs... On a team that hasn't made it out of the second round.

And in ten less regular season games, he's scored 17 more goals and compiled 100 more assists.

But I forgot... Stats, schmats. He isn't even close to David Krejci.

What do you think Krejci's numbers would look like playing almost exclusively with the best goalscorer in the league?

 

[Mr. Make-Believe]

What do you think Krejci's numbers would look like playing almost exclusively with the best goalscorer in the league?

You can deal in hypothetical. I'm happy enough in reality.

Hey, it's not like I'm saying the guy sucks! Just don't want to stray into Leafs fans territory when it comes to valuing our players. It's silly.

 

[ODAAT]

You can deal in hypothetical. I'm happy enough in reality.

Hey, it's not like I'm saying the guy sucks! Just don't want to stray into Leafs fans territory when it comes to valuing our players. It's silly.

you insinuating that Clarkson won`t win the Rocket Richard trophy this year

 

[ODAAT]

What do you think Krejci's numbers would look like playing almost exclusively with the best goalscorer in the league?

on a one line team??? Hmm, slightly higher but who cares

 

[Spoked-B]

You can deal in hypothetical. I'm happy enough in reality.

Hey, it's not like I'm saying the guy sucks! Just don't want to stray into Leafs fans territory when it comes to valuing our players. It's silly.

It might be a hypothetical, but I don't think pointing out that Backstrom has the luxury of playing w/ arguably the best goalscorer in the world for multiple seasons improves his chances to up his point total (especially on the PP). It would be just as fair to point out that Krejci's +/- advantage probably has something to do with having a Chara and Rask/Thomas back there, as well. Saying that you don't deal with hypothetical can also go in the other way, noting that DK has 7 more GWG and led the playoffs in scoring twice. It isn't DK's fault that NB hasn't managed to contribute enough to getting his team past the second round, right?

I'm willing to "concede" that I'd take Giroux over Krejci. But Backstrom is, IMHO, not an upgrade if you care about a 200-ft game.

 

[ODAAT]

Question not statement, but if Sods was truly about the $$, could he not have just stayed home and made excellent money???

Asking as I have no clue about the pay scale in the SEL

I don`t know, while I`m sure he wants to be compensated fairly, I don`t see him as being the kind of guy who`ll cause headaches, and it`s Chia for goodness sakes, not many rumblings from anyone about him shortchanging players and offering them disrespectful deals

 

[DominicT]

What do you think Krejci's numbers would look like playing almost exclusively with the best goalscorer in the league?

Good question. I think he'd do pretty well with Stamkos

 

[ODAAT]

good question. I think he'd do pretty well with stamkos

snap

 

[member 96824]

What do you think Krejci's numbers would look like playing almost exclusively with the best goalscorer in the league?

Do we exclude Getzlaf too then? He plays with Perry.

Malkin's been lining up next to Neal.

Toews, do we need to even speak about the wings they have?

Krejci just spent a season (his best since before most hopped on the bandwagon) with one of the greatest goal scorers in the history of the game.

I bring all of that up because its very easy to judge a player, especially a center, by just watching him...regardless of his linemates.

 

[DominicT]

Question not statement, but if Sods was truly about the $$, could he not have just stayed home and made excellent money???

Asking as I have no clue about the pay scale in the SEL

I don`t know, while I`m sure he wants to be compensated fairly, I don`t see him as being the kind of guy who`ll cause headaches, and it`s Chia for goodness sakes, not many rumblings from anyone about him shortchanging players and offering them disrespectful deals

SHL has now dropped to fifth in highest playing leagues with Germany close behind. Could be sixth soon.

NHL, KHL, Finland, Czech Republic, SHL, Germany

Source: An agent who shall remain nameless

 

[ODAAT]

SHL has now dropped to fifth in highest playing leagues with Germany close behind. Could be sixth soon.

NHL, KHL, Finland, Czech Republic, SHL, Germany

Source: An agent who shall remain nameless

Thanks Dom, I know the KHL pays great money, was uncertain of the SEL

I`m still thinking he wants what will be fair but won`t be unrealistic

 

[DominicT]

Thanks Dom, I know the KHL pays great money, was uncertain of the SEL

I`m still thinking he wants what will be fair but won`t be unrealistic

Don't think he cares what other players do/make. He plays like Carl dontcha know

BTW Andrew, the SEL is now SHL

 

[ODAAT]

Don't think he cares what other players do/make. He plays like Carl dontcha know

BTW Andrew, the SEL is now SHL

No longer Elite you say??? I want NOTHING to do with drafting anyone from there any longer then

I type like Andrew

 

[DominicT]

No longer Elite you say??? I want NOTHING to do with drafting anyone from there any longer then

I type like Andrew

Just for reference bud, you can check this out for KHL salaries, It's a year old, but it pays peanuts compared to the NHL.

You'll need a translator for it

http://www.sports.ru/hockey/154502348.html

 

[ODAAT]

Just for reference bud, you can check this out for KHL salaries, It's a year old, but it pays peanuts compared to the NHL.

You'll need a translator for it

http://www.sports.ru/hockey/154502348.html

ouch, no early retirement for those players is there?

Thanks Dom

 

[GloryDaze4877]

It might be a hypothetical, but I don't think pointing out that Backstrom has the luxury of playing w/ arguably the best goalscorer in the world for multiple seasons improves his chances to up his point total (especially on the PP). It would be just as fair to point out that Krejci's +/- advantage probably has something to do with having a Chara and Rask/Thomas back there, as well. Saying that you don't deal with hypothetical can also go in the other way, noting that DK has 7 more GWG and led the playoffs in scoring twice. It isn't DK's fault that NB hasn't managed to contribute enough to getting his team past the second round, right?

I'm willing to "concede" that I'd take Giroux over Krejci. But Backstrom is, IMHO, not an upgrade if you care about a 200-ft game.

Have you watched Backstrom play regularly? He actually is a pretty good 3 zone player. Krejci is more physical, but Bax, while certainly not a PK specialist, spends more time on the ice SH than Krejci does.

Once again, like Krejci a lot, but some here are overrating him.

Not sure what any of this has to do with Soderberg and his upside?