The proper way to do it would be to let team USA and Canada choose their players first and let the young "leftovers" form the NA U23 team. I mean, denying team USA Gaudreau is just insane.
So, Lets Discuss this "World Cup" Nonsense for a Second...
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The proper way to do it would be to let team USA and Canada choose their players first and let the young "leftovers" form the NA U23 team. I mean, denying team USA Gaudreau is just insane.
I would have been ok with that but team young guns quickly becomes team leftovers (and it would be largely team canada young guns)
UnrefinedCrude
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- Jun 7, 2011
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Not only that, but this is the only opportunity to see an international tournament played with North American rules. It seems odd to me that on the international stage every single tournament is played under different rules than those used by the country of origin. This will offer one top level talent tourney with a different flavour than the existing ones.
This should be a fun tourney.
Not only that, but this is the only opportunity to see an international tournament played with North American rules. It seems odd to me that on the international stage every single tournament is played under different rules than those used by the country of origin. This will offer one top level talent tourney with a different flavour than the existing ones.
This should be a fun tourney.
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Rants Mulliniks
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Why would they? The timing still seems stupid. If you changed the timing people would probably be all over it.
Rants Mulliniks
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SirClintonPortis
ProudCapitalsTraitor
The Patrick Kane one was real good. Spot on parody of journalists and players. And the jab at Kane at the end. Priceless and funny all around.
The rest are indeed painful to even listen to.
Spade
Resident Tool
I remember when 3 on 3 All-Star games were gimmicky....good times.
Thing is if the hockey turns out to be fantastic, nobody cares.
That all depends, however, on whether or not players are motivated to play hard. I think they will, because as much as players play for their nation, they also care tremendously about their own sense of pride. If you can't motivate yourself to play against the best players in the world, and for once it actually IS the best players in the world, then that's really an indictment of your own competitive fire.
The NHL was hesitant on going to the Olympics even when the IOC paid for insurance costs. Now that it's off the table entirely, then it's understandable that the NHL would say no. Maybe this changes with a new head in 2022, but the NHL more than any other major North American league stands to lose the most. The MLB didn't send players to the Olympics while baseball was an Olympic sport because the Summer Games coincide with the season, and quite frankly the IOC had no need to bring in baseball players because the Summer Olympics are the biggest celebration in the world and have enough marquee events and stars that paying insurance costs would bring very little benefit to them (and make no mistake, the IOC is just as much about the business as any major league). On the other hand, the Winter Olympics have far less events and marquee names, thus for a number of years it made good business sense for the IOC to bring NHLers along, because hockey was and still is arguably the biggest marquee event for the Winter games.
The NHL took a gamble when they chose to send players over and while Olympic hockey had its moments, from a pure business perspective it didn't bring the kind of return that the NHL needed to justify the risk of having a star player injured outside of league play (like John Tavares).
The World Cup makes the most sense for the NHL. This notion of nationalistic pride is great, and if the NHL has its way the World Cup will return to the regular "international" teams after this one, which theoretically solves a lot of the problems fans have with the tournament. I don't necessarily like everything about it (thanks crappy commercials) but I am okay with best on best and this is as close to it as we'll get in hockey.
Thing is if the hockey turns out to be fantastic, nobody cares.
That all depends, however, on whether or not players are motivated to play hard. I think they will, because as much as players play for their nation, they also care tremendously about their own sense of pride. If you can't motivate yourself to play against the best players in the world, and for once it actually IS the best players in the world, then that's really an indictment of your own competitive fire.
The NHL was hesitant on going to the Olympics even when the IOC paid for insurance costs. Now that it's off the table entirely, then it's understandable that the NHL would say no. Maybe this changes with a new head in 2022, but the NHL more than any other major North American league stands to lose the most. The MLB didn't send players to the Olympics while baseball was an Olympic sport because the Summer Games coincide with the season, and quite frankly the IOC had no need to bring in baseball players because the Summer Olympics are the biggest celebration in the world and have enough marquee events and stars that paying insurance costs would bring very little benefit to them (and make no mistake, the IOC is just as much about the business as any major league). On the other hand, the Winter Olympics have far less events and marquee names, thus for a number of years it made good business sense for the IOC to bring NHLers along, because hockey was and still is arguably the biggest marquee event for the Winter games.
The NHL took a gamble when they chose to send players over and while Olympic hockey had its moments, from a pure business perspective it didn't bring the kind of return that the NHL needed to justify the risk of having a star player injured outside of league play (like John Tavares).
The World Cup makes the most sense for the NHL. This notion of nationalistic pride is great, and if the NHL has its way the World Cup will return to the regular "international" teams after this one, which theoretically solves a lot of the problems fans have with the tournament. I don't necessarily like everything about it (thanks crappy commercials) but I am okay with best on best and this is as close to it as we'll get in hockey.
talkinaway
Registered User
As far as why NHL teams could see this as a good thing:
1) Their star players get warmed up. In training camp playing preseason games, or playing this tournament. From a Bruins fan's perspective, one of the reasons it was hypothesized that Rask was damn awful during the first three games was that he wasn't warmed up because there were a total of five goalies splitting time in net. I'm not sure if that's a lot of goalies league-wide, but Rask didn't get as much time in net as he had.
I'm not worried about Chara or other veterans playing in September with their country (or continent or age bracket) instead of getting back into their individual team's "system".
2) Money, obviously.
3) It's a good way to herald in the hockey season. Casual fans don't have the first full week of October highlighted; they just know that hockey is played when it's cold out. Since it's on ESPN, people might get "tricked" into watching it when they're surfing for football games/highlights. (cf: Tony X.) It might encourage people to check out preseason games, or at the very least tune into the home opener the next week.
1) Their star players get warmed up. In training camp playing preseason games, or playing this tournament. From a Bruins fan's perspective, one of the reasons it was hypothesized that Rask was damn awful during the first three games was that he wasn't warmed up because there were a total of five goalies splitting time in net. I'm not sure if that's a lot of goalies league-wide, but Rask didn't get as much time in net as he had.
I'm not worried about Chara or other veterans playing in September with their country (or continent or age bracket) instead of getting back into their individual team's "system".
2) Money, obviously.
3) It's a good way to herald in the hockey season. Casual fans don't have the first full week of October highlighted; they just know that hockey is played when it's cold out. Since it's on ESPN, people might get "tricked" into watching it when they're surfing for football games/highlights. (cf: Tony X.) It might encourage people to check out preseason games, or at the very least tune into the home opener the next week.
Cursed Lemon
Registered Bruiser
Is the World Cup even elective for the players? Are they forced to participate like the All-Star game?
If they are, that's an even bigger farce.
If they are, that's an even bigger farce.
BruinLVGA
CZ Shadow 2 Compact: finally here!!!
If the OG won't be best on best, it is due only to the sheer greed of the NHL. Pure and simple. Furthermore, the amount of talent has no bearing whatsoever on the importance of the event: when the USA had a boycott of the 1980 OG and the USSR + a bunch of satellite nations of the Soviet block did the same in retaliation for the 1984 OG in Los Angeles, they were still Olympic Games. Everyone was invited to participate, but if they didn't want to come, the only prestige that suffers is of those who decided to snob the event, not of the event in itself.
It's totally irrelevant who plays in the World Cup, it will still remain a glorified all star game and nothing else.
By the way, even if frankly it is not pertinent and irrelevant to the discussion why the World Cup is nothing but a money grab and a meaningless tournament, you keep on running your mouth about the WC. Are you aware that pretty much all top players in the NHL have competed in it at a time or another?
BruinLVGA
CZ Shadow 2 Compact: finally here!!!
Yeah, if that's what we should look forward to, let's also change the NHL while we are at it: from 30 teams to 2 teams... West Coast Superstars vs East Coast Superstars... Only the top talent/skills, say 5 lines, 5 defensive pairs, 4 goalies per team... Have them play 82 games + a playoffs series best of 21... Discard the trophy and its name, let's call it the Bombastic Hockey Megatrophy 3000! That would be the max! Yay!
Again the NHL isnt a hockey federation, they are a private league. Making money is their freaking job.
And comparatively, the NHL will pay the talent ( and pay them well) wheras the IOC will sell broadcast rights for Billions of dollars and will pocket every freaking dime for doing essentially mothing. The IOC also will not allow their partners to use olympic footage and its the NHL that is money grubbing? Really?
Outside of the NCAA name me one othet business that rakes in billions off the backs of the supremely talentef wjo have exactly zeros for salaries in their spread sheets?
The nhl tried it repeatedly, it failed. the nhl is moving on and noting that there is a demand for best on best have come to the conclusion (a business decision) that whatever the hell the IOC does, the Nhl can do it themselves and cut out the partner who pulls the least weight but demands ALL the profits.
If the NHL willingly continued as a submissive in this exploitive relationship they would be idiotic.
You want best on best at the olympics? Tell the IOC to act like ANY other business and open their wallets. But noooooooo the 5 rings and the 5 rings exclusively are entitled to getting the draw for free so some fat ass in lausanne can buy nice suits.
This. I dont get why people are against the World Cup, I promise it will be a ton of fun.
Most funny about the whole "World Cup" idea is the idea that "best on best, nation vs nation" = "the best players we could reasonably pick from one specific league along arbitrarily chosen lines that don't actually represent nations"
I don't think I'd have nearly the same issues with it if the NHL had actually invited players from other leagues and skipped the whole "leftovers" nonsense.
Feels like the NHL had never actually seen an international tournament and decided to take their best guess at what one would look like.
I don't think I'd have nearly the same issues with it if the NHL had actually invited players from other leagues and skipped the whole "leftovers" nonsense.
Feels like the NHL had never actually seen an international tournament and decided to take their best guess at what one would look like.
So fill the other spots with LESSER quality players makes the tournament magically better?
How about no? If you want a tournament driven by NHL talent and warm bodies to fill out the rosters I give you exhibit A: the world shampionships of hockey.
Pass
BruinLVGA
CZ Shadow 2 Compact: finally here!!!
What part of this don't you understand: every pro hockey league in the planet is in it to make money, not only the NHL. Name me another league besides the NHL that refuses to allow their players to go to the OG. Just one...
Who said lesser quality players? If you're trying to imply that "non-NHL" = "LESSER quality," didn't Finland smoke the US last Olympics with a team largely consisting of non-NHL players?
Besides, it's not like sheer player talent is the #1 thing that drives a tournament's enjoyment. There's also how engaged and passionate the fans are, and how entertaining the hockey is. Look at the FIFA World Cup or the Rugby World Cup for examples of what I mean. So-called "minnows" and their fans often become very invested in each game, especially against "better" teams. The World Juniors is another example specific to hockey. No one would claim that it's the absolute topmost-quality hockey, but it's entertaining because the fans and teams really bring it.
And then why not have the teams go through a qualification process where they have to prove they are better than other teams? It seems like if Sweden, using nothing but NHL players, were objectively better than Slovakia or Latvia, it should prove that by beating those teams in qualifying for a spot. Instead of having those teams be hand-picked by the NHL and forced to use only players from one league.
Mlb isnt in thr olympics anymore and they didnt let roster players go when they were.
And your argument is " because everyone else does it"? Welk those 3rd and 4th rate hockey leagues you list dont have the overwhelming amount of high end talent either. You want the best hockey league on the planet to emulate lesser leagues? Again how about no?
As far as hockey is concerned the IOC needs the NHL WAY more than the other way around. Let them showcase team has beens vs team never were's and see how well that draws.
BruinLVGA
CZ Shadow 2 Compact: finally here!!!
What makes a tournament "magically better" is... actually winning something that is worth the effort (and therefore, as a fan, worth watching it).
Do you understand why? If you don't (or most likely can't), ask yourself if the All Star Game is the most important game/moment of the NHL season. By your logic, seeing that it sports the BEST players in the league, it should be. Do you get it now?
BruinLVGA
CZ Shadow 2 Compact: finally here!!!
I already mentioned this before... It is a "great" (North) American "tradition" not to let players participate in international competitions. No surprise about the MLB then.
Let me make it clear for you one more time: the whole planet minus the US of A (and Canada) can take one for the sport and allow their players to participate. So hell yeah it's because everyone else can do at the same time whatever is best for their business AND for the sport.
Wash your mouth and show a bit of respect for other leagues while you are at it.
The all star game is a one game exhibition. By your argument a player would play harder for his country than he would with a bunch a strangers with different passports for the cup which is nonsense.
You can stop kissing the iihf ring and arguing that their cobsent and legitinacy are interchangeable.
Best on best trumps whats on the crest. And the IIHF and the IOC dont cobtrol anything other than securing the venue and hiring a guy to drive the zamboni.
They are irrelevant. The talent doesnt change under the ribgs. The talent is defined by the players. And all the mustache wax for fassel wont change this dynamic.
I want best on best. If the ioc wont pay the owners WONT release their players as is their right. Screw what third rate keagues like the SEL do. If the ioc wont pay the nhl will say " we can do it ourselves" and to that I say yipeee!
And let me make THIS clear, the worlds best hockey league is run in the US and Canada and will take the best talent on the planet but are under no obligation to be run like the khl or the SEL.
No one is crying if the SEL refuses to release players. Im sure that the NBA should follow the same rules as the european leagues because they are all equivalent. Right?
I'm pretty sure that is in fact the case. Ask Lidstrom whether it was a bigger deal winning the cup with the Wings or the gold with Sweden, and the latter will win every time. Playing for your country is generally seen as the top honor for an athlete.
My sense from reading your posts in here is that you don't really get into international tournaments in the same way that 99% of the sporting world does. It's not just about "absolute highest level talent, no questions asked" (as someone mentioned, there's arguably the ASG for that) but about teams playing their heart out for their country and fans along for the ride.
Putting Crosby, Keith, Doughty and McDavid all on the same team generates 0 excitement unless they actually care about the tournament they are playing in. And playing in a money-grab tournament with nations playing against bizarrely-assembled non-nations without the ability to select players outside the NHL isn't going to represent anything people (nor fans) will care about.
You're walking into a steak house and asking why people like steak, when they could just eat pasta instead.
Horvath Broncos
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- Aug 21, 2013
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I had nothing against the tournament at first. But then those gimmicky youngster team and team europe were added. Hard to take that tournament too seriously after that. I would much rather had Swiss and Slovakia. The whole tournament now gives me same kinda wipes as all star games. I will watch the tournament though.
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