Should we be worried about Attendence (Trolls Stay Away)

[Panthersfan1989]

I'm not writing this post to start some sort of troll fest.I am really concerned about my favorite hokey team. After hearing last nights announced attendance at 7917 and seeing how FULL our stadium gets from playing a team like Detroit and still only drawing like 12,000 people should us fans start to worry? I understand measures were taken so SSH didn't feel like they were getting cheated by the guy getting 10$ club level seats. I know the CORE fan base of this team really loves it but I'm afraid that no one outside of CORAL SPRINGS, Parkland, Boca, coconut creek really cares about this team. I feel like no one south of Hollywood goes to these games. Anyways I'm not trying to start an argument just see how everyone else feels. Please keep it clean and friendly.

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[Catsfan7]

At this point, no, if Vinnie and Doug are willing to bite the bulllet (which they say they are for the short term) then it shouldn't be our main concern. Obviously if this continues, we should start to worry.

 

[ShootIt]

Kind of thought we would be at 10-11k minimum on weekdays.

I love going to games, just tough timewise and location wise for the weekdays.

If they move, should be to Palm Beach

I hope when the playoffs come, this year , the place will be sold out. Would not be cool if we make the playoffs but have 2-3k in empty seats.

I'm not worried at all this year, maybe if by next year, with a squad firmly in the playoff race, has the same attendance issues...then I'll start to "worry".

I stated this in the BOH thread, and sprinkled in some threads here, but, I do not see any advertisement for the Panthers, except for on FSN during the game. Haven't been in Fort Lauderdale in the past 2-3 months, but last time I saw nothing on billboards/radio that mentioned there was a NHL team down there.
Hard to get people to buy tickets when only word of mouth is the only method of attracting new fans.

 

[Papa044]

I've been a die hard fan since 96 and live in Miami.. I wish I could attend every home game but the drive up to sunrise is just really inconvenient. I go to about 5 games a season and if we make the playoffs I will go to every home game. we have a very fickle sports market in south Florida. look at the dolphins they can't even sell out. Marlins games are always empty. even the heat games aren't selling out now. everyone knows in south Florida the only way people will show up is for a winning product. the panthers need to make the playoffs by next season, if not than I will start worrying.

 

[PanthersHockey1]

I understand they want everyone to pay full price, but there is no reason why the upper level should be open on a week night vs columbus.

I see no shame in filling the entire lower bowl similar to how the marlins have the upper deck closed off.

I think Arizona does this also.

 

[IM Clutcm]

I agree with Catsfan7. Viola and Cifu have admitted they're a bit disappointed by the attendance but they also knew what they were getting into and knew attendance would be bad this year. Columbus isn't a marquee opponent, it was a weekday game, and the team was on a pretty bad losing streak. I'll admit that I feel as deflated as most of you do when I see how bad it looks most games, but the team has been bad for so long I can't really blame people for not coming.

 

[PanthersHockey1]

I've been a die hard fan since 96 and live in Miami.. I wish I could attend every home game but the drive up to sunrise is just really inconvenient. I go to about 5 games a season and if we make the playoffs I will go to every home game. we have a very fickle sports market in south Florida. look at the dolphins they can't even sell out. Marlins games are always empty. even the heat games aren't selling out now. everyone knows in south Florida the only way people will show up is for a winning product. the panthers need to make the playoffs by next season, if not than I will start worrying.

You bring up a good point. South Florida is a 100 miles long and roughly 15 miles wide. Even at its geographic "center" its always going to isolate some fans.

It takes me 45-1hr to get home on game nights and on many nights where the team doesnt show up its hard for me to, but I do anyways because Im glutton for punishment. PSLGuy is even more than I am (Dont know how you do it man).

 

[angry_treefrog]

This thread has a very poor prognosis for long term survival.

Having said that...

The attendance is a really non-issue to me as it comes to no surprise to team ownership. It is merely the inevitable outcome of years of terrible, terrible management dating back to the dismantling of the '96 squad.

There are only a handful of markets that would continue to support a sports franchise through such an extended period of terrible performance... and for those who say "it's still pro hockey so real fans should want to watch", I would argue that beer league hockey would be more entertaining than much of the slop that SSE vomited onto the ice between 2000-2011.

Bad management and ownership combined to nearly kill hockey in South Florida... but it's not too late.

It will just take some time for people to place their faith in this product again after years of blatant lies and disappointment.

As for those who feel that they should go back to the give-away model to artificially inflate attendance ... that is exactly the kind of move that chased many loyal PAYING fans away. Promise the season ticket holders something when they want your money - then turn around and completely disregard those promises - time and time again.

If two, three seasons from now the Panthers are a repeat playoff team and you are still seeing this kind of attendance - you should be worried. Based on my experience, I don't think that will be the case.

There are lots of hockey fans in south florida (especially from January - May), but they know good hockey when they see it and can smell bull-crap when it's shoveled to them.

 

[ucanthanzalthetruth]

Short term no, long term yes. Haven't been able to defend this team's fanbase since it was revealed just how many tickets were given away. It's one thing expect Toronto like attendance, but to be trounced by Arizona is honestly just sad.

 

[ShootIt]

You bring up a good point. South Florida is a 100 miles long and roughly 15 miles wide. Even at the its geographic "center" its always going to isolate some fans.

It takes me 45-1hr to get home on game nights and on many nights where the team doesnt show up its hard for me to, but I do anyways because Im glutton for punishment. PSLGuy is even more than I am (Dont know how you do it man).

Hell, I'm up in PSL too now.

Going to be fun trips on the weekend.

IIRC 200 miles round trips.

 

[Gentle Man]

When I lived in Florida (having lived off of Miami gardens drive off the I-75) I would go to maybe half the home games maybe, but I wanted to go to more. As a college student I couldn't afford that luxury of going to all the games.

I now live in SoCal and it kills me seeing the attendance. I have never equated the Panthers as part of Miami sports (save the couple of years in Miami Arena) but the Panthers are a victim of the fickle fans for sure.

I wish I could support the team somehow but Gamecenter live is all I got unless they come to my proximity.

Playoff time I will make the effort to take vacation time. If this team ever makes the finals, I'm emptying my wallet.

 

[angry_treefrog]

Short term no, long term yes. Haven't been able to defend this team's fanbase since it was revealed just how many tickets were given away. It's one thing expect Toronto like attendance, but to be trounced by Arizona is honestly just sad.

Of course it's sad - what can you expect after the tremendous damage to the brand that has been done?

As I said in the BOH thread, the league needs to be more selective in who it allows in it's ownership group.

The previous group of owners had no business owning a sports franchise and ran the organization into the ground. The Yorkman era in particular was an absolute disgrace.

A great organization starts with a great leader - and a great leader is someone who surrounds himself with great people and gives them all the tools they need to succeed.

 

[I am not exposed]

It does worry me, but not a lot I can do about it. I live thousands of miles away. When I visit Florida I do go to games, but that is only once every two years.

I'm just trying to enjoy the hockey as best I can, although it is a little difficult when I see the attendance in a game like yesterday.

Consistent playoffs and/or a superstar forward will hopefully increase attendance. If we start consistently making the playoffs, and the attendance remains the same, then I will be worried. Really worried, and assume the team will be moved.

 

[Panthersfan1989]

I live in North Broward on the Boca boarder and it still takes me 30 mins to get down there to see a game. i just thought this team should be averaging 12-14k a NIGHT even if the teams aren't marquee. I do believe the team needs to earn the fan base trust back. As far as sports advertising goes I know for a fact 790 the ticket never talks hockey or Florida panthers.. I know 560 does the games but it wouldn't hurt to advertise on the flagship sports radio network.

 

[Android 16]

I think some of the fanbase is still not trusting this team and I don't blame them. Also, our main attraction is Luongo/Ekblad/opposition. I have a feeling that it will be like that for the next 3-4 years, but it wouldn't hurt to have a stud on offense in that mix. Hopefully one of these years we can start developing win streaks. Also winning in decisive fashion and not always nail-bitters will help bring in more Panther fans.

 

[NewEraPanther]

This thread has a very poor prognosis for long term survival.

Having said that...

The attendance is a really non-issue to me as it comes to no surprise to team ownership. It is merely the inevitable outcome of years of terrible, terrible management dating back to the dismantling of the '96 squad.

There are only a handful of markets that would continue to support a sports franchise through such an extended period of terrible performance... and for those who say "it's still pro hockey so real fans should want to watch", I would argue that beer league hockey would be more entertaining than much of the slop that SSE vomited onto the ice between 2000-2011.

Bad management and ownership combined to nearly kill hockey in South Florida... but it's not too late.

It will just take some time for people to place their faith in this product again after years of blatant lies and disappointment.

As for those who feel that they should go back to the give-away model to artificially inflate attendance ... that is exactly the kind of move that chased many loyal PAYING fans away. Promise the season ticket holders something when they want your money - then turn around and completely disregard those promises - time and time again.

If two, three seasons from now the Panthers are a repeat playoff team and you are still seeing this kind of attendance - you should be worried. Based on my experience, I don't think that will be the case.

There are lots of hockey fans in south florida (especially from January - May), but they know good hockey when they see it and can smell bull-crap when it's shoveled to them.

couldnt have said it better myself

 

[Android 16]

I live in North Broward on the Boca boarder and it still takes me 30 mins to get down there to see a game. i just thought this team should be averaging 12-14k a NIGHT even if the teams aren't marquee. I do believe the team needs to earn the fan base trust back. As far as sports advertising goes I know for a fact 790 the ticket never talks hockey or Florida panthers.. I know 560 does the games but it wouldn't hurt to advertise on the flagship sports radio network.

I agree. I'm not a huge fan of sports talk radio to begin with, but it's sad how little the exposure is down here. They get as much talk time as the Marlins. That means next to nothing. For example, you are more likely to hear about how Ryan Tannehill spent his weekend than a 5-4 regular season shootout victory for the Panthers. Here's a few I can think of right off the back.

Defo and Goldie on 940 WINZ: Rare (which is sad because Goldie is the play-by-play man for heaven's sake)

640 Sports - The Sid Rosenberg Show: Rare (I've heard him speak fondly about the Panthers, but it was on a rare day. It's mostly just NY this or NY that)

Jonathan Zaslow & Joy Taylor - FM 104.3 The Ticket: Never (It's always Lebron this or Lebron that and that Jonathan guy always proclaims he attends Panther games, but never talks about it, not one word about the content of the game)

 

[barkovcanfinnish]

Losing big to Winnipeg then losing the next 4 games probably didn't help matters. It also doesn't help that we played pretty bad all of those games.

 

[Juggernaut27]

Short answer? No worries.

With the current ownership and the support of the Commish I don't see any concerns related to cash-flow in the next 2-3 years.

If some disaster occurs with the rebuild and the team can't make the playoffs in the next season or two and attendance is still abysmal then maybe I'd be looking for some reassurance that everything is still on-track financially.

From a pure investment point-of-view they bought a hard asset at a low price and it has appreciated in value already, according to Forbes. It's a safe place to stash some cash in an economic environment that has few of those and due to the DT rebuild being well underway it could provide a very significant ROI in relatively short order. Additionally the league is chasing two expansion teams out West and the lucrative fee's that entails. That not only limits the potential of any team relocating it also will likely mean a substantial cash infusion at some point.

On a personal level they are certainly making it look like this is more than just business. Doug and Vinny seem very genuine and treat this like a passion project and family business. They don't fool around and have fed the Canadian media frenzy a time or two but I wouldn't confuse good operating with serious issues.

Unless something changes drastically with the league or the financial markets I'd rest easy for a couple of years.

 

[FlaPnthrsPunk]

For now, I don't think attendance will be much of an issue for our survival, but if it continues long-term, yeah probably.

There's many factors on why our crowds are low. For one, we all know how the casual fanbase works. They don't care about any of our local teams unless they're a contender.

It's been mentioned, but South Florida is huge. Luckily, I work ten minutes from the arena, but it takes at most of the population during the week after a long workday quite some time to get to the western suburbs from say Miami, Boca, or West Palm. We also have no transportation system, which is another factor on it's own. PSLguy, again I have no idea how you do this every game haha.

Going back to casual fans, how many of them want to pay the $20 parking fee to see a mediocre product and many don't realize that they can park across the street at the mall.

I understand that Viola & Cifu want a hockey environment at games rather than Yormark's circus, but I don't understand why they aren't advertising the team on billboards and such like we used to. The local media for the most part sees the empty seats and throws us to the back of the sports report in a two second highlight after each game because they don't think many viewers would care.

Opposing fans and popular opponents this season are a big factor into our attendance. Not many casual fans want to rush to the arena during the week to see the Blue Jackets.

It's just going to take consistent winning seasons to get most fans in. There's no better way out there in this market.

 

[I am not exposed]

For now, I don't think attendance will be much of an issue for our survival, but if it continues long-term, yeah probably.

There's many factors on why our crowds are low. For one, we all know how the casual fanbase works. They don't care about any of our local teams unless they're a contender.

It's been mentioned, but South Florida is huge. Luckily, I work ten minutes from the arena, but it takes at most of the population during the week after a long workday quite some time to get to the western suburbs from say Miami, Boca, or West Palm. We also have no transportation system, which is another factor on it's own. PSLguy, again I have no idea how you do this every game haha.

Going back to casual fans, how many of them want to pay the $20 parking fee to see a mediocre product and many don't realize that they can park across the street at the mall.

I understand that Viola & Cifu want a hockey environment at games rather than Yormark's circus, but I don't understand why they aren't advertising the team on billboards and such like we used to. The local media for the most part sees the empty seats and throws us to the back of the sports report in a two second highlight after each game because they don't think many viewers would care.

Opposing fans and popular opponents this season are a big factor into our attendance. Not many casual fans want to rush to the arena during the week to see the Blue Jackets.

It's just going to take consistent winning seasons to get most fans in. There's no better way out there in this market.

I believe that was a mistake. Didn't that happen after our recent playoff run?

 

[FlaPantherSwe*]

Allways woried but with the new owners and a core of young talent the Panthers still roars and can turn it around.

 

[NewEraPanther]

For now, I don't think attendance will be much of an issue for our survival, but if it continues long-term, yeah probably.

There's many factors on why our crowds are low. For one, we all know how the casual fanbase works. They don't care about any of our local teams unless they're a contender.

It's been mentioned, but South Florida is huge. Luckily, I work ten minutes from the arena, but it takes at most of the population during the week after a long workday quite some time to get to the western suburbs from say Miami, Boca, or West Palm. We also have no transportation system, which is another factor on it's own. PSLguy, again I have no idea how you do this every game haha.

Going back to casual fans, how many of them want to pay the $20 parking fee to see a mediocre product and many don't realize that they can park across the street at the mall.

I understand that Viola & Cifu want a hockey environment at games rather than Yormark's circus, but I don't understand why they aren't advertising the team on billboards and such like we used to. The local media for the most part sees the empty seats and throws us to the back of the sports report in a two second highlight after each game because they don't think many viewers would care.

Opposing fans and popular opponents this season are a big factor into our attendance. Not many casual fans want to rush to the arena during the week to see the Blue Jackets.

It's just going to take consistent winning seasons to get most fans in. There's no better way out there in this market.

http://panthers.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=750041&navid=DL|FLA|home

Loved this podcast. Talks alot about the team and questions from our fans. I know he mentions the parking (at around 12 mins). Mentions seats (attendance at around 15.30 mins) Reaffirms the team staying in South Florida (at around 18 mins).

I thought you all would enjoy a listen

 

[IM Clutcm]

http://panthers.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=750041&navid=DL|FLA|home

Loved this podcast. Talks alot about the team and questions from our fans. I know he mentions the parking (at around 12 mins).

I thought you all would enjoy a listen

I've seen most of those guys that they selected posting on Facebook, a lot of them are morons. But I really like listening to Cifu, and you can tell how passionate he is about this team and keeping it in the area. Nice to have an ownership group that's so committed to the area.

 

[NewEraPanther]

I've seen most of those guys that they selected posting on Facebook, a lot of them are morons. But I really like listening to Cifu, and you can tell how passionate he is about this team and keeping it in the area. Nice to have an ownership group that's so committed to the area.

I agree. I think it reveals a lot about the character of ownership. That he would make himself available to questions and be so open about it. I love everything these owners have said and stood by. I am hopeful that things will get better, just will take time.