Should the Red Wings buy out Niklas Kronwall

[aar000n]

Long term injury reserve seems better.

 

[InjuredChoker]

No. He will be that experienced lockerroom guy, which will mentor kids, until the end of his contract. On-ice level becomes a non-factor as longer we go.

Could be 7th D on his last season.

this.

buyouts savings aren't that big; the contracts ends in 2 seasons after this one; it's not like we need to buy him out to clear roster space; or we'd really need those extra 1-2M in cap space imo.

only if he takes an issue with being #6-7 guy going forward, would i consider buying him out. he can't play meaningful minutes at competent level anymore. with the injuries piling up, he might not be on the ice a lot anymore anyway.

 

[Ingvar]

I see no reason - let him play until he's done, offer him to retire in the last year of his contract (and face small recapture penalty) or LTIRetire him (and face small penalty from LTIR contracts eating too much cap).

 

[Reddwit]

this.

buyouts savings aren't that big; the contracts ends in 2 seasons after this one; it's not like we need to buy him out to clear roster space; or we'd really need those extra 1-2M in cap space imo.

only if he takes an issue with being #6-7 guy going forward, would i consider buying him out. he can't play meaningful minutes at competent level anymore. with the injuries piling up, he might not be on the ice a lot anymore anyway.

He was already petitioning for fewer minutes/easier assignments in the off-season. I think he'd be fine being a #6 option.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Was his -3 against New Jersey the beginning of the end? He's on pace to put up 0 goals and 10 points. He probably shouldn't be on the PP anymore so it's worth questioning what he brings to the team at this point besides the de facto "he'a a vet who can help the young guys adjust to the NHL".

 

[Wyzer Plan]

I think you give the guy the offseason to recover and feel it out. I think he hangs it up vs ltir any way but if he or the coaches feel he can't contribute then you look at those options.

 

[Flowah]

Buy him out? No.

Should leave him exposed and send a youtube highlight package to everyone involved with the Vegas team of vintage Kronwall and hope they don't watching anything recent.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

Absolutely brutal decline. Dude went up in flames faster than the Hindenburg.

Probably won't even crack ten points.

Will Sheahan or Kronwall score a single goal this year?

No point in buying him out though.

 

[Mount Suribachi]

Whats the cap recapture if he retires? If he's playing in pain, and just can't do it anymore, he may decide to call it quits.

Sad to see, but the guy is clearly done now, can't imagine how bad he'll be in 2 years time.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Whats the cap recapture if he retires? If he's playing in pain, and just can't do it anymore, he may decide to call it quits.

Sad to see, but the guy is clearly done now, can't imagine how bad he'll be in 2 years time.

2.125 for 2017-18 and 18-19 if retires after this season
3 for 18-19 if retires after next season.

Total cap hit - 4.25M if retires after this year
3M if retires after next year.

Basically, a buyout would be the stupidest move that the Wings could make.

https://www.capfriendly.com/buyout_calculator/niklas-kronwall

Cap hit if bought out now.
2.125 for 2017-18
3.875 for 2018-19
875k for 2019-20
875k for 2020-21

Total cap hit = 7.75M

So, no, the Red Wings should definitely NOT buy out Niklas Kronwall. Let him retire or put him on LTIR if you're not going to have him play. Buyouts in the regular course of business should be by far the last resort a team uses.

E: However, I guess if you're on the burn it down tank thread, taking away an extra $5M of Holland's money so he can't sign veterans would be good for you. And if he did it, you wouldn't be up in arms about wasting an asset, but if you lose waiver eligible D #521163, that's a grievous miscarriage of justice.

 

[SirloinUB]

If I understand Cap recapture correctly..

Cap Benefit = Salary - Cap Hit

Caprecapture = Net Cap Benefit/years remaining



Retiring summer 2017: 2,125,000 cap penalty for each of the next two season. Red Wings save 2,500,000 on the cap

Retiring summer 2018: 3,000,000 cap penalty for one season. Red Wings save 1,750,000 on the cap.

 

[Frk It]

This thread is pointless. It makes 0 sense to buy out Kronwall.

Yeah his body broke down, he's 36, **** happens.

 

[Mount Suribachi]

So retiring after this season looks like the best scenario for the Wings financially.

You never know, we might be able to use that money to sign Shattenkirk....

 

[Retire91]

I feel like its better to let the players contracts run out. Its not like we are competing for a cup anyway. We just need Holland to stop signing contracts that have negative value so the problem stops some day 6 or 7 years from now. The Weiss buyout was a mistake, should have just let that run out. Maybe it would have helped crowd out Abby or Helm off the roster.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I feel like its better to let the players contracts run out. Its not like we are competing for a cup anyway. We just need Holland to stop signing contracts that have negative value so the problem stops some day 6 or 7 years from now. The Weiss buyout was a mistake, should have just let that run out. Maybe it would have helped crowd out Abby or Helm off the roster.

Buyouts are a godawful idea in 99 out of 100 situations. Literally the only time it should be used is for a guy like Drew Miller where you just need the roster spot and the cap hit is like 600k for one year. Anyone with any term or any dollars, it's a terrible idea.

Should be a last resort if you're in a cap crunch and need the 2-3M you could possibly free up.

What they really should have is a medical compliance buyout. Something like Franzen where he will never ever skate again. Instead of holding a team's feet to the fire and continuing the facade of something like Pronger on the Coyotes and in the league offices, a team should be able to buy out a guy like a lockout compliance buyout if an unbiased NHL physician (read: not a team's physicians) gives them a physical and they can't play.

They wouldn't do it, because they really focused on recapture to punish the team's that tried backdiving contracts, but it just makes one hell of a lot more sense to do it that way than continue the dog and pony show of LTIRetirement.

 

[Run the Jewels]

This thread is pointless. It makes 0 sense to buy out Kronwall.

Yeah his body broke down, he's 36, **** happens.

The most popular poll response by far is to put him on LTIR. Regardless, it's going to be yet another awful use of cap space. Having more than $42 million tied up in Z, Neilsen, Abby, Helm, DeKeyser, Kronner, Ericsson, Howard and Franzen is just stunning.

 

[jolly roger]

We need another option: "Make him coach and file Blashill".

 

[Wingsfan 4 life]

Why? Just ride it out. Its only 2 more years after this. How much dead cap do we need to not contend?

 

[HIFE]

A few weeks ago Mickey and Ken were mentioning Blashill's intention of limiting Kronwall's IT but that despite his attempts Kronwall refused to be taken out of the lineup. WTF? Who's running this team? How do you let a player that debilitated call the shots?

“I’d like to think there’s a lot more (hockey), actually,” said Kronwall, 36, who talked with reporters Tuesday as the Red Wings cleaned out their lockers and went their separate ways for the 2016-17 season. “I feel better than I did 12 months ago, so that’s something positive.”

I'm dumbfounded. I thought it had to be his last season. Kronwall is delusional I can't help but lose some respect for a player so conceited to believe he should continue playing. LTIR you idiot! Toronto would never allow it, he'd "mysteriously" fail his physical like Lupul. No way he can pass a physical. Another example of the careless, country-club culture limiting the Wing's chances to move forward.

 

[Retire91]

I was looking for the option that said the team will be horrible for the remainder of his contract so why extend his cap hit. I felt the same way about Weiss who is still hitting our books like a fart that cleared the room 3 seasons ago but some people still smell it.

LTIR is not an endless solution there are limits to it and it eats up off-season cap space no matter what. People need to stop pretending LTIR is a place Holland can shelf players that don't work out. It doesn't work like that.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

A few weeks ago Mickey and Ken were mentioning Blashill's intention of limiting Kronwall's IT but that despite his attempts Kronwall refused to be taken out of the lineup. WTF? Who's running this team? How do you let a player that debilitated call the shots?



I'm dumbfounded. I thought it had to be his last season. Kronwall is delusional I can't help but lose some respect for a player so conceited to believe he should continue playing. LTIR you idiot! Toronto would never allow it, he'd "mysteriously" fail his physical like Lupul. No way he can pass a physical. Another example of the careless, country-club culture limiting the Wing's chances to move forward.

Okay, we need to stop referencing Toronto as a well managed team. A well managed team would not need to rebuild the way that Shanahan and Babcock had to do. They've got intelligent people running it now, but they were completely irrelevant because Nonis and Burke and crew were morons.

Amazingly, he's clearly passed a physical in the past year, unless you think the Red Wings don't perform tests to make sure that their players are capable of NHL hockey.

And people say stuff like country-club atmosphere like it means anything, in relation to anything. The negative with the atmosphere around the team is that they sign a guy like Abdelkader for more money and term than is justified. However, the Wings were so damn good for so damn long and kept all of their stars happy for the duration of that 25 year run because of the family atmosphere. They had exactly one really notable player who chafed at it (Sergei Fedorov) and that was simply because on any non-Yzerman roster, he'd have been the top guy with a bullet, but he never would be that here.

The "country club" culture is what all of the former Hall of Fame players they had called feeling like a family. The country club culture was why you won Cups because you had the Grind Line play an equal role to undisputed stars. It's why you had McCarty, Larionov, Shanny, etc. pound on the Avs during the Fight Night at the Joe.

The Wings do need an external thought process to shake it up a little bit, because they have made mistakes based on the family atmosphere (Abby, Helm, Cleary, etc.) But in and of itself, taking care of the players on your roster is a GOOD idea. It's what made the Red Wings the class of the league for the late 90s, early 00s. So, they don't need to scrap it, they just need to adjust the thinking to match 2017.

 

[Frk It]

The "country club" culture is what all of the former Hall of Fame players they had called feeling like a family. The country club culture was why you won Cups because you had the Grind Line play an equal role to undisputed stars. It's why you had McCarty, Larionov, Shanny, etc. pound on the Avs during the Fight Night at the Joe.

The Wings do need an external thought process to shake it up a little bit, because they have made mistakes based on the family atmosphere (Abby, Helm, Cleary, etc.) But in and of itself, taking care of the players on your roster is a GOOD idea. It's what made the Red Wings the class of the league for the late 90s, early 00s. So, they don't need to scrap it, they just need to adjust the thinking to match 2017.

The country club atmosphere makes a heck of a lot more sense in a pre-cap world.

You can't be that benevolent in a post-cap league without serious consequences. It's one of those things I look at that Holland does, that used to work, that he still does when the rest of the league has switched up.

 

[Retire91]

The family atmosphere the Illiches promote did lead to the cups but it was a family atmosphere combined with the ability to acquire hall of fame players on a shockingly regular basis. The league has changed to prevent franchises from dominating the league in that way but the Illiches are not changing with them. They struck lightning and drafted Zetterberg and Daytsuk to complement the second half of Lidstrom's career. Even that avenue has dried up with today's world wide scouting from all teams.

Zetterberg is the last player on this team that deserves country club treatment. You don't stock your country club with role players and expect to win a cup with no number 1 center and no number 1 D and no real clear strategy for acquiring those pieces. This organization needs to seriously clean the cupboeards and start a new strategy. Even if they acquire talent the roster is plugged up with horrendous contracts that aren't even tradeable.

Toronto is a well managed team. They brought in management that had the vision to execute the strategy that had the highest probability of bring in talent, and it worked.

 

[njx9]

Okay, we need to stop referencing Toronto as a well managed team. A well managed team would not need to rebuild the way that Shanahan and Babcock had to do. They've got intelligent people running it now, but they were completely irrelevant because Nonis and Burke and crew were morons.

Do you understand how the passage of time actually works?

 

[ShelbyZ]

I would say no. Especially considering the likelihood of Holland using the space to go out and retread Smith/Quincey or lock up Dennis Wideman...