Prospect Info: Sharks Prospect Info & Discussion Thread XX

[LilLeeroy]

I definitely get your argument. It's possible, but I don't think Smith holds the cards. The gauthier thing is not good for either team or player. Smith is not so cut and dry, and I dont know if he would want to rush into the lineup if the team isnt going to really compete again.

I suppose, if they lose the lottery, there is a chance the sharks may draft Levshunov and give him a look in camp to make the team. He has NHL size already and will be 19 at the start of the year so if he and smith both go pro, then maybe.

I just dont really see a big reason to burn an ELC year on Smith if the sharks arent going to be any good. I see Mack as the key determinant in whether 2024-25 or 25-26 is the first "go for it" year.

Either way, Grier's tenure is make or break this summer. He has a projected nearly 40M in space this summer and 65M next year. How that money gets deployed coupled with how he handles the transition to pro from all the top prospects, along with his choice of coach will shape the next generation of sharks hockey. If he F's it up with another army of Lindbom, Sturm, Knyshov, Benning, Kunin, G. Smith, Burroughs, etc, then he will crush the kids' development. If he adds smartly and gets a good coach, they should be WAAAY better as soon as this coming year.

I mean you have to burn the year of the ELC whether you sign him now or sign him after BC's season is over, just like every other NCAA prospect.

You're crazy if you think this team is going to be way better soon. A team this bad won't be able to get desirable free agents without massively overpaying, which is something they shouldn't be doing.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

I mean you have to burn the year of the ELC whether you sign him now or sign him after BC's season is over, just like every other NCAA prospect.

You're crazy if you think this team is going to be way better soon. A team this bad won't be able to get desirable free agents without massively overpaying, which is something they shouldn't be doing.

Massively overpaying should be considered an option if you can keep the term to four or five years.

 

[Juxtaposer]

I definitely get your argument. It's possible, but I don't think Smith holds the cards. The gauthier thing is not good for either team or player. Smith is not so cut and dry, and I dont know if he would want to rush into the lineup if the team isnt going to really compete again.

I suppose, if they lose the lottery, there is a chance the sharks may draft Levshunov and give him a look in camp to make the team. He has NHL size already and will be 19 at the start of the year so if he and smith both go pro, then maybe.

I just dont really see a big reason to burn an ELC year on Smith if the sharks arent going to be any good. I see Mack as the key determinant in whether 2024-25 or 25-26 is the first "go for it" year.

Either way, Grier's tenure is make or break this summer. He has a projected nearly 40M in space this summer and 65M next year. How that money gets deployed coupled with how he handles the transition to pro from all the top prospects, along with his choice of coach will shape the next generation of sharks hockey. If he F's it up with another army of Lindbom, Sturm, Knyshov, Benning, Kunin, G. Smith, Burroughs, etc, then he will crush the kids' development. If he adds smartly and gets a good coach, they should be WAAAY better as soon as this coming year.

If Smith signs at the end of his NCAA season next year, he burns a year. So whether or not he signs this summer or next April, his contract remains the same.

Again, the point is that if Smith wants to sign, you don’t turn him down and risk hurting your relationship with him. These NCAA guys hold power in contract negotiations because they could easily refuse to sign and choose their team at age 21.

Smith is, so far, the crown jewel of the rebuild. Don’t risk pissing him off because of contract status.

 

[LilLeeroy]

Massively overpaying should be considered an option if you can keep the term to four or five years.

It's something that should be done after the core is in place, not now.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

It's something that should be done after the core is in place, not now.

In like 99% of cases, I would agree with you. There are certain players potentially getting to free agency that I would make an exception for. I think Stamkos is one of them. Dakota Joshua might be another.

 

[wishman]

If Smith signs at the end of his NCAA season next year, he burns a year. So whether or not he signs this summer or next April, his contract remains the same.

Again, the point is that if Smith wants to sign, you don’t turn him down and risk hurting your relationship with him. These NCAA guys hold power in contract negotiations because they could easily refuse to sign and choose their team at age 21.

Smith is, so far, the crown jewel of the rebuild. Don’t risk pissing him off because of contract status.

I realize either way he burns a year of ELC. But I thought if he signs at beginning of year, he has better chance of reaching UFA quicker. Probably not that large of an issue, but I thought there is some difference. Although I could very likely be wrong.

 

[Juxtaposer]

I realize either way he burns a year of ELC. But I thought if he signs at beginning of year, he has better chance of reaching UFA quicker. Probably not that large of an issue, but I thought there is some difference. Although I could very likely be wrong.

You could be right. I guess my point is that Smith is not a player to nickel-and-dime. You don’t not sign him because of money.

 

[themelkman]

If smith wants to sign you sign him, really as simple as that

 

[landshark]

I wonder why I hate the name Dakota Joshua soooooo very much. He's a good player, I'd be happy to have him on the Sharks. But, for some reason I can't quite nail down, I can't help but repeat the name in a very whiney, childlike-teasing type voice while rolling my eyes everytime I hear or read it. I'm annoying myself with it.

I guess I need to see a hypnotist or something. It's such a weird reaction to a name.

 

[Cas]

I wonder why I hate the name Dakota Joshua soooooo very much. He's a good player, I'd be happy to have him on the Sharks. But, for some reason I can't quite nail down, I can't help but repeat the name in a very whiney, childlike-teasing type voice while rolling my eyes everytime I hear or read it. I'm annoying myself with it.

I guess I need to see a hypnotist or something. It's such a weird reaction to a name.

It sounds like the name of a character from a parody of a nineties teen show.

 

[landshark]

It sounds like the name of a character from a parody of a nineties teen show.

should have been Hannah Montana's best friend's name...

 

[sampler]

I didnt know that smith's ELC begins even if he stays in college. Hmmm.... In that case, little downside to signing him and letting him take a year in the A if he turns out not ready for the NHL.

I also dont think it's pure fantasy to expect a PO run this year, particularly if today goes well.

This past year, cooch didnt play and the team was full of salary dumps like Hoffman as well as leftovers like Lebanc. A ton of cap space came off the books. Furthermore, the kids that came up this year were not top prospects. Gushkin, bordy and co are nothing to get excited about. On the other hand, Smith and Mack (hopefully) are real NHL players-to-be (or they better be). Musty also looks legit and Bystedt should be good too and even a few of the secondary prospects like Cagnoni and haltunnen are intriguing.

Lastly, David quinn is a horrific coach. Coaching definitely matters and if grier signs a coach that can teach defensive structure and team play, then it could be a very quick turnaround. The sharks should be able to functionally flip Hertl, Hoffman, Labanc, and barabonov (combined approx 19M plus other space) for 2 top 4 Dmen (at 5-7M per Skjei, Roy, Demelo, Montour type) and 1-2 Top 9 forwards (5-6M March, Amadio, Joshua...). Thats enough to make a material difference if the kids step up.

On the other hand, Forget it if Grier blows the space on an army of guys like Kunin, Lindbom, Borroughs, Benning, Sturm, G Smith, and the like, none of whom was playing a real top 9 or top 6 regular NHL shift before Grier got them.

I am cautiously optimistic, especially if they win the lottery, that the sharks could compete for a PO spot next year. A new coach along with Smith, Mack, and 4+ solid free agents is a pretty significant roster overhaul capable of surprising us.

 

[Jargon]

I didnt know that smith's ELC begins even if he stays in college. Hmmm.... In that case, little downside to signing him and letting him take a year in the A if he turns out not ready for the NHL.

I also dont think it's pure fantasy to expect a PO run this year, particularly if today goes well.

This past year, cooch didnt play and the team was full of salary dumps like Hoffman as well as leftovers like Lebanc. A ton of cap space came off the books. Furthermore, the kids that came up this year were not top prospects. Gushkin, bordy and co are nothing to get excited about. On the other hand, Smith and Mack (hopefully) are real NHL players-to-be (or they better be). Musty also looks legit and Bystedt should be good too and even a few of the secondary prospects like Cagnoni and haltunnen are intriguing.

Lastly, David quinn is a horrific coach. Coaching definitely matters and if grier signs a coach that can teach defensive structure and team play, then it could be a very quick turnaround. The sharks should be able to functionally flip Hertl, Hoffman, Labanc, and barabonov (combined approx 19M plus other space) for 2 top 4 Dmen (at 5-7M per Skjei, Roy, Demelo, Montour type) and 1-2 Top 9 forwards (5-6M March, Amadio, Joshua...). Thats enough to make a material difference if the kids step up.

On the other hand, Forget it if Grier blows the space on an army of guys like Kunin, Lindbom, Borroughs, Benning, Sturm, G Smith, and the like, none of whom was playing a real top 9 or top 6 regular NHL shift before Grier got them.

I am cautiously optimistic, especially if they win the lottery, that the sharks could compete for a PO spot next year. A new coach along with Smith, Mack, and 4+ solid free agents is a pretty significant roster overhaul capable of surprising us.

I just can’t imagine a world where our D is good enough to get anywhere close to the playoffs next season, with Celebrini or not. Not to mention the fact that even if Celebrini, Musty and Smith all make the team, they’re going to be varying degrees of okay — they’ll need time to learn how to play in the NHL, they’re babies.

It’ll be a fun team if they all make it but I can’t imagine us being nearly as good as you think.

 

[mogambomoroo]

I didnt know that smith's ELC begins even if he stays in college. Hmmm.... In that case, little downside to signing him and letting him take a year in the A if he turns out not ready for the NHL.

I also dont think it's pure fantasy to expect a PO run this year, particularly if today goes well.

This past year, cooch didnt play and the team was full of salary dumps like Hoffman as well as leftovers like Lebanc. A ton of cap space came off the books. Furthermore, the kids that came up this year were not top prospects. Gushkin, bordy and co are nothing to get excited about. On the other hand, Smith and Mack (hopefully) are real NHL players-to-be (or they better be). Musty also looks legit and Bystedt should be good too and even a few of the secondary prospects like Cagnoni and haltunnen are intriguing.

Lastly, David quinn is a horrific coach. Coaching definitely matters and if grier signs a coach that can teach defensive structure and team play, then it could be a very quick turnaround. The sharks should be able to functionally flip Hertl, Hoffman, Labanc, and barabonov (combined approx 19M plus other space) for 2 top 4 Dmen (at 5-7M per Skjei, Roy, Demelo, Montour type) and 1-2 Top 9 forwards (5-6M March, Amadio, Joshua...). Thats enough to make a material difference if the kids step up.

On the other hand, Forget it if Grier blows the space on an army of guys like Kunin, Lindbom, Borroughs, Benning, Sturm, G Smith, and the like, none of whom was playing a real top 9 or top 6 regular NHL shift before Grier got them.

I am cautiously optimistic, especially if they win the lottery, that the sharks could compete for a PO spot next year. A new coach along with Smith, Mack, and 4+ solid free agents is a pretty significant roster overhaul capable of surprising us.

If you win the draft lottery, you could argue there is a world where Celebrini, Smith, Eklund and Musty take the charge instantly with having three rookies competing for the Calder.
It's very unlikely but if they have a chemistry from the start and balance each other out, anything is possible with the okay to good supporting cast and the right coaching.
To me if there is 3 new faces on the next year Sharks roster, I just want to see chemistry growing without putting any pressure for playoff success. If it's effortless winning, we are luckiest team in the world. Let them cook wherever they need to cook, just keep them developing and hope for the best.

 

[Jargon]

If you win the draft lottery, you could argue there is a world where Celebrini, Smith, Eklund and Musty take the charge instantly with having three rookies competing for the Calder.
It's very unlikely but if they have a chemistry from the start and balance each other out, anything is possible with the okay to good supporting cast and the right coaching.
To me if there is 3 new faces on the next year Sharks roster, I just want to see chemistry growing without putting any pressure for playoff success. If it's effortless winning, we are luckiest team in the world. Let them cook wherever they need to cook, just keep them developing and hope for the best.

I think the unfortunate fact of the matter is our defense is so, so bad that I just can't imagine us winning enough games with them manning the blue line. I guess if Muhk really takes off in the NHL and we trade for a true top 4 guy, then maybe suddenly we have at least a half-competent defense, but... so many things have to go right (including our winning in 30 mins..)

 

[mogambomoroo]

I think the unfortunate fact of the matter is our defense is so, so bad that I just can't imagine us winning enough games with them manning the blue line. I guess if Muhk really takes off in the NHL and we trade for a true top 4 guy, then maybe suddenly we have at least a half-competent defense, but... so many things have to go right (including our winning in 30 mins..)

I would agree. Everything has to go right, like winning a jackpot right through the season.
But I would love to see them in teal asap.

 

[one2gamble]

I think the unfortunate fact of the matter is our defense is so, so bad that I just can't imagine us winning enough games with them manning the blue line. I guess if Muhk really takes off in the NHL and we trade for a true top 4 guy, then maybe suddenly we have at least a half-competent defense, but... so many things have to go right (including our winning in 30 mins..)

losing every game 6-5 should be the goal next year anyway

 

[coooldude]

I didnt know that smith's ELC begins even if he stays in college. Hmmm.... In that case, little downside to signing him and letting him take a year in the A if he turns out not ready for the NHL.

I also dont think it's pure fantasy to expect a PO run this year, particularly if today goes well.

This past year, cooch didnt play and the team was full of salary dumps like Hoffman as well as leftovers like Lebanc. A ton of cap space came off the books. Furthermore, the kids that came up this year were not top prospects. Gushkin, bordy and co are nothing to get excited about. On the other hand, Smith and Mack (hopefully) are real NHL players-to-be (or they better be). Musty also looks legit and Bystedt should be good too and even a few of the secondary prospects like Cagnoni and haltunnen are intriguing.

Lastly, David quinn is a horrific coach. Coaching definitely matters and if grier signs a coach that can teach defensive structure and team play, then it could be a very quick turnaround. The sharks should be able to functionally flip Hertl, Hoffman, Labanc, and barabonov (combined approx 19M plus other space) for 2 top 4 Dmen (at 5-7M per Skjei, Roy, Demelo, Montour type) and 1-2 Top 9 forwards (5-6M March, Amadio, Joshua...). Thats enough to make a material difference if the kids step up.

On the other hand, Forget it if Grier blows the space on an army of guys like Kunin, Lindbom, Borroughs, Benning, Sturm, G Smith, and the like, none of whom was playing a real top 9 or top 6 regular NHL shift before Grier got them.

I am cautiously optimistic, especially if they win the lottery, that the sharks could compete for a PO spot next year. A new coach along with Smith, Mack, and 4+ solid free agents is a pretty significant roster overhaul capable of surprising us.

I mean, the Calder winner is a so-called generational talent and scored under a PPG at a -44 and was the top scorer on a team that was 4 wins better than our team.

Patty Kane won the Calder with 72 points in 81 games, Toews was behind him at 54 in 64. That team finished 10th in the West, 3 points out of a playoff spot. That team also featured... Seabrook, Keith, Sharp, Ladd, Byfuglien, Havlat.

Eklund at 21yrs old scored just over 0.5ppg as a 7OA pick that was highly touted (a lot like Catton, "could be 2OA" but a bit small and took some time to be ready for the league).

Smith, Musty, and Celebrini in the NHL, we'd be lucky if one of them hit 60 points (Calder-esque) and the other two sniffed 40 points at age 19.

The amount of good fortune and insane development we'd need to make the playoffs next year is essentially impossible, and I'd happily eat a lot of crow if I'm wrong. the Sharks' turnaround 93 to 94 was a completely different day and age, and we added two legendary talents from a recently collapsed Russia (Larionov, Makarov) and barely snuck into the playoffs.

tl;dr there is basically no freakin' way we make the playoffs next year.

 

[Cas]

I mean, the Calder winner is a so-called generational talent and scored under a PPG at a -44 and was the top scorer on a team that was 4 wins better than our team.

Patty Kane won the Calder with 72 points in 81 games, Toews was behind him at 54 in 64. That team finished 10th in the West, 3 points out of a playoff spot. That team also featured... Seabrook, Keith, Sharp, Ladd, Byfuglien, Havlat.

Eklund at 21yrs old scored just over 0.5ppg as a 7OA pick that was highly touted (a lot like Catton, "could be 2OA" but a bit small and took some time to be ready for the league).

Smith, Musty, and Celebrini in the NHL, we'd be lucky if one of them hit 60 points (Calder-esque) and the other two sniffed 40 points at age 19.

The amount of good fortune and insane development we'd need to make the playoffs next year is essentially impossible, and I'd happily eat a lot of crow if I'm wrong. the Sharks' turnaround 93 to 94 was a completely different day and age, and we added two legendary talents from a recently collapsed Russia (Larionov, Makarov) and barely snuck into the playoffs.

tl;dr there is basically no freakin' way we make the playoffs next year.

I suspect we're a 65-70 point team next year, finishing last in the Pacific and the most likely to finish 32nd overall.

 

[coooldude]

I suspect we're a 65-70 point team next year, finishing last in the Pacific and the most likely to finish 32nd overall.

And that is a "big step forward" and just fine with me. Leaving 2025 with one of Hagens, Hensler, Martone, McQueen, Frondell, or whoever else becomes top 3... and the next year, hopefully we're able to push into the 70-80s point totals and still pick top 10.

Plan hasn't changed.

 

[Hodge]

Eiserman - Celebrini - Smith
Musty - Eklund - Zetterlund

Top six sorted, spend all other assets on building the defense.

 

[coooldude]

Eiserman - Celebrini - Smith
Musty - Eklund - Zetterlund

Top six sorted, spend all other assets on building the defense.

I am definitely not an Eiserman believer. I think we'll still have to add a top end winger at some point unless Musty becomes that, in which case we need more depth. But this lottery win gives us a shot at a legit core. Holy shit, how bonkers.

All hopes and prayers for me are on Yak, Iggy, or Sennecke dropping to 14OA or somehow trading up for Yak, specifically.

 

[LilLeeroy]

I am definitely not an Eiserman believer. I think we'll still have to add a top end winger at some point unless Musty becomes that, in which case we need more depth. But this lottery win gives us a shot at a legit core. Holy shit, how bonkers.

All hopes and prayers for me are on Yak, Iggy, or Sennecke dropping to 14OA or somehow trading up for Yak, specifically.

Eiserman isn't my favorite, but we might need him to settle the beef between Celebrini and Smith.

 

[coooldude]

Eiserman isn't my favorite, but we might need him to settle the beef between Celebrini and Smith.

Eiserman's thicc, maybe he can keep Grier and Rick from killing each other.

 

[sampler]

This is the biggest summer in sharks history:

40M in cap space is a ton. That should be 6 very good players.

It's not fair to expect Mack/Smith/Anyone else (musty?) to be top liners. It is fair to expect middle six though.

The top 9 forwards is Granlund, Zetterlund, Eklund, Graf, Mack, Smith, Machassault (3yrx 7M per) Amadio (2 yr, 3M per), Joshua (2 4x4), with possibly Couture. Bystedt and Musty, as well as edstrom might get a look in camp too. That not necessarily a cup contending crew, but it should be able to put in more than this year.

On D (Skjei and montour are the top two targets but if they are unavailable)
Roy (4x4M)- Thrun
Demelo (2x5M per)- Mukhamadullin
Ferraro-Ruuta
Vlasic

Again, not a cup caliber D, but a whole lot better than this year. Cap space used up: 23M (so there would still be 10M+ for even more, and if cooch is on LTIR, then 18+M more. So add in yet another good vet D and another top forward, and I dont see why they cannot compete.