OT: Sens Lounge LXXVI | The One Where the RedBlacks won and it was a good day.

[ChocolateLeclaire]

I thought Indonesian sun would prepare me for this... local weather forecast says it "feels like" 45 degrees C.

It's awesome, though. It's Low Season in Ko Lanta, we went to the beach this morning, we were the only ones swiming for about a Km on either side of us.

I will not weep for you when it is -40 here...

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

What's your definition of terrorists?

0 Israeli casualities. Israel has something called the "dome" or whatever where literally every missile by the guys who are firing it gets negated. Zero have penetrated and can't even reach the areas with people living in them.

On the other hand, there's 300 Palestinian casualties. 80% citizens. Many famous and non-famous Jews and even ex-Israeli militant officers have come out in waves against what Israel is doing recently and in the past. Like someone else has mentioned, it just doesn't get Media time.

Here's Noam Chomsky's(famous Jewish American Linguist) on Gaza's situation:

http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/1...it-to-gaza-the-worlds-largest-open-air-prison

Here's a quote by former Israeli Prime Minister in 1998 that really puts things out there on how disgusting the situation is for those people:

"If I were a Palestinian of the right age, I would join, at some point, one of the terrorist groups."

I actually became familiar with all this info cause of my jewish friends who attend protests and are very vocal against the occupation.

Hamas rockets from the latest offensive have hit Bethlehem and Hadera. There haven't been any deaths but there have been injuries within Israel.

And, for the record, you will always have civilian casualties when civilians make a point of sitting on top of rocket sites to deliberately act as human shields. Easy one-way trip to paradise.

 

[Benjamin]

What's your definition of terrorists?

0 Israeli casualities. Israel has something called the "dome" or whatever where literally every missile by the guys who are firing it gets negated. Zero have penetrated and can't even reach the areas with people living in them.

On the other hand, there's 300 Palestinian casualties. 80% citizens. Many famous and non-famous Jews and even ex-Israeli militant officers have come out in waves against what Israel is doing recently and in the past. Like someone else has mentioned, it just doesn't get Media time.

Here's Noam Chomsky's(famous Jewish American Linguist) on Gaza's situation:

http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/1...it-to-gaza-the-worlds-largest-open-air-prison

Here's a quote by former Israeli Prime Minister in 1998 that really puts things out there on how disgusting the situation is for those people:

"If I were a Palestinian of the right age, I would join, at some point, one of the terrorist groups."

I actually became familiar with all this info cause of my jewish friends who attend protests and are very vocal against the occupation.

Both sides are in the wrong. Obviously any war is wrong. I just see Israel as slightly less wrong.

They fight over myths.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Both sides are in the wrong. Obviously any war is wrong. I just see Israel as slightly less wrong.

They fight over myths.

Well said.

Over two millennia now they've been fighting over different versions of fairy tales. If they haven't figured it out by now, they never will. The fighting won't stop until the entire region is a lifeless wasteland.

Sad thing is, they'll probably take the rest of the planet with them.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Hamas rockets from the latest offensive have hit Bethlehem and Hadera. There haven't been any deaths but there have been injuries within Israel.

And, for the record, you will always have civilian casualties when civilians make a point of sitting on top of rocket sites to deliberately act as human shields. Easy one-way trip to paradise.

Ah, apologies I never knew that. Lol, but are you justifying 300 deaths as appropriate response? Even though the injuries, as u say, came after the deaths.

Your second statement is completely ignorant... yea those people who are treated like scums of this earth-as documented by everyone- sure are doing their best to get to paradise instead of doing something else meangingful with their lives... oh wait, they can't! You do realize that Jews and Arabs(ESPECIALLY Palestinians) lived in harmony for years before all this chaos right?

Btw, those 4 kids that were killed on the beach playing soccer yesterday sure where sitting on top of rocket sites as human shields.

http://globalnews.ca/news/1454641/j...beach-attack-that-killed-at-least-4-children/

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Both sides are in the wrong. Obviously any war is wrong. I just see Israel as slightly less wrong.

They fight over myths.

Broke 65 UN conventions/resolutions, killed thousands on thousands in comparison to the handful on the other end.

"Slightly less wrong."

Got it.

I do agree there are two wrong sides. One though, as famous late-night Jewish host John Stewart said earlier this week, "bombs better."

Gazans aren't fighting over religion, they're literally fighting for freedom and no oppression. Egypt has big role in this too.

I honestly don't know too much detail about what's going on over there, I just have heard enough to think, "god damn that's crazy, how's that going on."

 

[The Fuhr*]

Does anyone else feel that the Israel-Palestine conflict is not getting enough attention in the media?

It is a major world event, but is a second thought in the media.

**** the day after Israel invaded Palestine it was not even in the top news section of the Calgary Herald.

Ww3 is going to begin there I think one day

 

[bacon25]

Both sides are in the wrong. Obviously any war is wrong. I just see Israel as slightly less wrong.

They fight over myths.

This seems a bit disingenuous, there is more to the conflict than merely their religious beliefs.

 

[Benjamin]

Gazans aren't fighting over religion, they're literally fighting for freedom and no oppression. Egypt has big role in this too.

This seems a bit disingenuous, there is more to the conflict than merely their religious beliefs.

Religion is the base reason. They were born and taught to hate each other. Of course this is gonna happen.

 

[saskriders]

Religion is the base reason. They were born and taught to hate each other. Of course this is gonna happen.

Oppressed people will fight regardless of their religion

 

[McManked]

Hey, the REDBLACKS are in the lounge title.

Coooooooooooool.

 

[Benjamin]

Oppressed people will fight regardless of their religion

But Israel only treats them bad because they are muslim.

 

[Quo]

 

[Harbinger]

The world's a mess and it will continue to be a mess for a very long time.

 

[CanadianHockey]

Both sides are in the wrong. Obviously any war is wrong. I just see Israel as slightly less wrong.

They fight over myths.

Agreed.

Israel is proportionally way more powerful than Hamas and the government exaggerates the threat Hamas poses.

That said, Hamas does indiscriminately attack civilians and hide among civilians. Most debate about Israel-Palestinian conflicts tend to understate the role of Hamas in giving Israel an insecurity pretext. As long as Hamas is willing to fire rockets, Israel will be willing to occupy Gaza.

Granted, the problem is much deeper than a simple security crisis. The reconstruction of borders through Israeli neighbourhood development is pretty interesting, although it's highly systemic and difficult to lay the blame morally on specific individuals (just like it'd be difficult to blame specific individuals for gentrification in our cities).


And while it's fair to say there's more to the conflict than just religion, it's pretty hard to idealize either side. Hamas isn't fighting just because they want a state. Plenty of Quebecers want a state, but aside from a dozen of them in the 1970s, they haven't taken up arms. There's a lot of antisemitism in those extremist groups.

 

[Quo]

Well said CH. Re: the understatement of Hamas's intentions, one thing you rarely hear is that it's a matter of official policy to wipe Israel off the map all together. Right there in the preamble of their charter and in a smattering of other places. Makes the two state solution rather difficult to swing when one of the stated goals of one of the parties involves the complete annihilation of the other. Undermines basic good faith in a large way.

 

[BK201]

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Well said CH. Re: the understatement of Hamas's intentions, one thing you rarely hear is that it's a matter of official policy to wipe Israel off the map all together. Right there in the preamble of their charter and in a smattering of other places. Makes the two state solution rather difficult to swing when one of the stated goals of one of the parties involves the complete annihilation of the other. Undermines basic good faith in a large way.

Completely agreed but something people need to understand is that Hamas is a product of Israel. That's the key right there. We all can shake our heads from our 1st world countries at these so called terrorist groups but all they have been raised to and known has been life long segregation, depression, discrimination, torture, poverty.

CH says if Hamas stops firing then Israel will leave but that's not true nor is it enough. They need equal rights, equal protection, better water, electricity, food, ability to grow etc... they're not firing rockets because they hate each other, they are firing rockets because that's what they've been forced to in order to fight for a better life. Did you guys not read the Chomsky piece?

I'm not supporting Hamas in anyway, those guys go far and beyond, too extreme. But their agenda is the product of what Israel has created over the decades. No one is right but one side is instigating it over and over again with a bigger gun.

There needs to be a real intervention that dismantles Hamas and at the same time establishes better laws and help for the Palestinians without Israel's consent cause those guys won't allow it. A 3rd country literally needs to intervene and establish these premises because those 2 won't get it done now or in the future. The problem is, superpowers need to stop vetoing anytime someone rules in favor of the Palestinians.

All this killing needs to stop. Spread peace, my friends.

But Israel only treats them bad because they are muslim.

False. You need to check out how they treat African immigrants. Same thing. Yea Muslim factor is there but it's secondary and a farr second. They also fought with Christian Lebanese factions.

Lol, god damn that whole region is ****ed up. Smh, the world(primarily developed nations) needs to get together and make an agenda that suits the region and not anyone else's interest. Or else things will only get worse

Ww3 is going to begin there I think one day

God forbid.

 

[DrakeAndJosh]

The people who only know Kendrick for GKMC really need to check out this album.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

I think i've watched everything good on Netflix. Nothing new left to watch.

Have you watched True Blood? I unno if it's on Netflix. Tell me some of the shows you've watched, I can try to offer some recommendations. I freakin watched every major(and some minor) TV show I can think of.

Watch Downton Abbey too if that type of stuff interests you, ****ing LOVE IT.

 

[Benjamin]

Have you watched True Blood? I unno if it's on Netflix. Tell me some of the shows you've watched, I can try to offer some recommendations. I freakin watched every major(and some minor) TV show I can think of.

Watch Downton Abbey too if that type of stuff interests you, ****ing LOVE IT.

I hate anything with Zombies(unless its a comedy), werewolves or vampires.

Ive looked through everything on Netflix(Can, US, UK), so recommendation wont do much. Im just not a fan of any new TV.

My biggest problem is unwillingness to try something new.

 

[Quo]

...

All this killing needs to stop. Spread peace, my friends.

I won't pretend to know what a third party intervention might entail. I'd also rather not read Chomsky but it might be nice for a counterpoint. Link?

I don't think anyone likes what either side has done over the years.

However, from an Israeli perspective, any quarter given to a people who have solemnly sworn your destruction is just one step closer to said destruction. Little room for idealism or mercy under the current reality, sadly. The Palestinian people suffer the most and not a single **** is given by friend or enemy alike. They elected Hamas if I'm not mistaken though. (lack of options? )

Hamas is the product of a lot of things. One of them is Israel, sure. Another thing they're a product of is hardline Islamic fundamentalism. (Divergent views of the ideal Islamic government within the party notwithstanding.) They're essentially used as pawns in a proxy war between Israel and Iran, Iran being the party who is gracious enough to provide the rockets by which Hamas can continue provoking Israel. (Incidentally it was once again Hamas who broke the ceasefire as I was typing this. Why? If they are so outgunned?.) Agree with Baird, hard to believe that they have any genuine interest in peace. Meanwhile, Israel loses the war of public opinion in the West which threatens to alienate their strongest ally, the US. I think that's a potential end game if it's not already a tenuous reality.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Yea, Quo. It's just a complete cluster**** who knows when it ends but hopefully soon. Also, Hamas just another excuse, who remember 2006 when UN actually told Israel to back off but U.S vetoed it. U.S. has to get involved or let someone else who will put something fair for both sides and let each side sacrifice something in order to achieve better prosperity in the region. Yea, the whole proxy war thing is also crazy. The world has become depressing.

I provided the link above on Noam.

I hate anything with Zombies(unless its a comedy), werewolves or vampires.

Ive looked through everything on Netflix(Can, US, UK), so recommendation wont do much. Im just not a fan of any new TV.

My biggest problem is unwillingness to try something new.

I'm assuming you took a look at misfits? Hold on, you never watched supernatural?!?

 

[BK201]

The people who only know Kendrick for GKMC really need to check out this album.

very much so.

 

[MainDotC]

I've been out of my apartment for two weeks. I had a friend of mine hold onto the cat and take care of her. As much as I hate my cat now I see there are mice droppings all over the stove.