Boston Bruins Seeking some perspective from B's fans on the Sens situation

[senseimike]

Hi Guys,

As a lifelong Senators fan (for better or worse...haha) was wondering if you could provide some perspective on something I was wondering about:
When the B's traded Joe Thorton and immediately following, weren't great for a few years before becoming amazing (and winning a cup), were you generally still peeved about how the team traded Thornton away even though the team was amazing now?

I ask because it seems like the Sens are turning a corner here and honestly, even if the Sens win a cup, I'm still pretty upset about the Karlsson trade...Or if the Sens get great and the Sharks tank (no pun intended), should I just get over it?

What are your thoughts?

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[rfournier103]

Hi Guys,

As a lifelong Senators fan (for better or worse...haha) was wondering if you could provide some perspective on something I was wondering about:
When the B's traded Joe Thorton and immediately following, weren't great for a few years before becoming amazing (and winning a cup), were you generally still peeved about how the team traded Thornton away even though the team was amazing now?

I ask because it seems like the Sens are turning a corner here and honestly, even if the Sens win a cup, I'm still pretty upset about the Karlsson trade...Or if the Sens get great and the Sharks tank (no pun intended), should I just get over it?

What are your thoughts?

I certainly can’t speak for anyone else here, but by the time the Bruins traded Joe Thornton, I was pretty sour on him. What made me angry was the lousy return. Thornton’s playoff line was 6-12-18 in 35 games, and I had expected MUCH more from a number 1 overall pick.

My advice to you, brother, is to move on, look forward, and enjoy an improving team. I’ve always been a Senators well-wisher, so I wish you luck in your journey.

 

[Gator Mike]

Agreed. I didn't have an issue dealing Joe Thornton in the abstract.

The issue was with the return, even though I think they did better than most people give them credit for.

 

[RoccoF14]

It was the worst trade the Bruins ever made in my lifetime, but it’s not worth dwelling on.

 

[JOKER 192]

Hi Guys,

As a lifelong Senators fan (for better or worse...haha) was wondering if you could provide some perspective on something I was wondering about:
When the B's traded Joe Thorton and immediately following, weren't great for a few years before becoming amazing (and winning a cup), were you generally still peeved about how the team traded Thornton away even though the team was amazing now?

I ask because it seems like the Sens are turning a corner here and honestly, even if the Sens win a cup, I'm still pretty upset about the Karlsson trade...Or if the Sens get great and the Sharks tank (no pun intended), should I just get over it?

What are your thoughts?

The problem with trading away star players is that you have to get the right return. The Bruins failed with Thorton. Quantity for quality rarely works. With that said .........................

Count your blessings, Karlsson is only going downward from here. This from a guy who was a Karlsson worshiper. He's done now, Sens traded him just in time.

Not only should you get over it, it's not even a question.

 

[CharasLazyWrister]

Hi Guys,

As a lifelong Senators fan (for better or worse...haha) was wondering if you could provide some perspective on something I was wondering about:
When the B's traded Joe Thorton and immediately following, weren't great for a few years before becoming amazing (and winning a cup), were you generally still peeved about how the team traded Thornton away even though the team was amazing now?

I ask because it seems like the Sens are turning a corner here and honestly, even if the Sens win a cup, I'm still pretty upset about the Karlsson trade...Or if the Sens get great and the Sharks tank (no pun intended), should I just get over it?

What are your thoughts?

I was only 16 years old when Thornton got traded but I do remember having a general sense of apathy and what I think was an independently created belief that he just did not feel like a big game player. A lot of disappointment given the original expectation.

That being said, the return was not up to par at all given his value. It seemed like the FO wanted to put the blame for perpetual “underachieving” square on him and thus undervalued him in a trade they were too eager to make. That’s the part of the trade that is honestly most irksome in hindsight. I love me some Marco Sturm, but the best player in that type of deal should have been a higher caliber player with a higher ceiling.

In sticking with that “too eager to trade and undervalue” theme, the Seguin trade was nearly a carbon copy of the Thornton trade. Young player with lots of talent underperforms in numerous instances and gets undervalued in a trade out of town for unarguably lesser pieces.

I guess the most important thing is that all of this stuff doesn’t matter if you get a team competing in the upper echelons of the league with any regularity or are lucky enough to grab a championship or two. Any story that leads to that ending is automatically a good one.

 

[Fenway]

If they keep Thornton they most likely never sign Chara or Savard

The key for the Bruins was it was the end of Sinden

 

[McGarnagle]

The Sens have unstable ownership that messes up everything it touches. The Bruins have the most stable ownership in the league. That's the difference.

I do think the Sens have been doing a bang-up job drafting the last few years and have a lot of young talent. I just don't trust the organization to be able to attract the free agents or coaches to put them over the top when the core reaches maturity.

As for Thornton, yeah, I remember reading on here and people wouldn't get off the "tHeY tRaDeD jOe" shit until June of 2011. In the end, we found a way out and people shut up about it. Karlsson hasn't had the effect in SJ that Thornton did where we had to see them rubbing our faces with the Hart and Art Ross for a few years there.

 

[PlayMakers]

People are still upset about the Thornton trade.

 

[rfournier103]

People are still upset about the Thornton trade.

I have no idea why.

Ancient history, and he was never going to raise the Cup here anyway.

 

[VanIsle]

Do not ever dwell on things that you can not control.

In the words of Jurassic Park, life finds a way!

Relax, live a full and fun life, sports are secondary.

 

[Mr. Make-Believe]

The Sens got Tim Stutzle out of that deal. Whatever else happened and whatever else you get from that (Josh Norris too right?) Stutzle's gonna make you forget all about the pain you're feeling now. That kid is something special.

The Bruins never got anything close to that for Thornton. But that deal speared the end of an awful regime in Boston and allowed for Chara, Savard and a total turnaround in culture that wouldn't have happened otherwise. I was salty for a long while, but however bad that deal was, it ended up for the best in the long run.

 

[ON3M4N]

I mean Karlsson continues to decline, signed for 7 more years at $11.5 million and you got a massive haul for him. You can be upset that he was traded, but he wasn't bringing you a cup.... but these pieces you got for him just might

 

[Wiggleboom]

One day the Karlsson trade will be seen as one of the best in Sens' team history (can never beat Yashin for Chara and Spezza though!).

 

[b in vancouver]

Hi Guys,

As a lifelong Senators fan (for better or worse...haha) was wondering if you could provide some perspective on something I was wondering about:
When the B's traded Joe Thorton and immediately following, weren't great for a few years before becoming amazing (and winning a cup), were you generally still peeved about how the team traded Thornton away even though the team was amazing now?

I ask because it seems like the Sens are turning a corner here and honestly, even if the Sens win a cup, I'm still pretty upset about the Karlsson trade...Or if the Sens get great and the Sharks tank (no pun intended), should I just get over it?

What are your thoughts?

For me it was actually strange times as a Bruins fan. The Bruins screwed up the lock-out worse than any team in the league. Went from a disappointing all-star team to a handful of disgruntled employees. The mess with Modano didn't help.
They mostly made the mistake of thinking Brad Stuart was McAvoy in that trade. It sucked.

They were lucky enough to have one of the best off-seasons ever by any team that year, drafting Kessel, Lucic and Marchand. Trading for Rask. And signing M. Savard and Chara. So that took the sting away.

 

[CDJ]

I wouldn’t be upset about that trade at all

 

[b in vancouver]

The Sens got Tim Stutzle out of that deal. Whatever else happened and whatever else you get from that (Josh Norris too right?) Stutzle's gonna make you forget all about the pain you're feeling now. That kid is something special.

The Bruins never got anything close to that for Thornton. But that deal speared the end of an awful regime in Boston and allowed for Chara, Savard and a total turnaround in culture that wouldn't have happened otherwise. I was salty for a long while, but however bad that deal was, it ended up for the best in the long run.

That team pre-lockout was stellar. They imploded in the playoffs but that team was impressive. One of the most talented rosters the NHL has seen in the past 30 years. That team was insanely stacked.
You had guys like W. Nylander, Samsonov, Rolston, Bergeron, Lapointe, Axelsson, Stumpel, in your middle six. They brought in Gonchar on the back-end.
Say what you want about the trade but they gave Thornton a dream team. - it's reminiscent of The Pens bringing in Iggy and Morrow and then getting stomped.

 

[bbfan419]

I was super mad when they traded Thornton, fine they wanted to move on from him, but he was just coming into his prime and they traded him for 50 cents on the dollar, not even a 1st round pick came back. As for Karlsson, the Sens did the right thing, I could tell he was starting to decline and thought the Sharks will regret this one and they will, Stutzle alone will be a star. There were some on here willing to trade a lot from the Bruins for Karlsson, I was hoping that would never happen, I knew he was starting to decline already with injuries and all. Be happy, the Sens have a great load of young talent lead by Tkachuck and Stutzle.

 

[senseimike]

Thanks for the comments guys! Really good stuff

 

[b in vancouver]

Thanks for the comments guys! Really good stuff

Also wanted to mention that I'm of the mind-set that individual trades, draft years, don't really ruin franchises. The biggest thing is creating the proper culture.
The Bruins suffered some pretty big set-backs that were out of their control and still managed to be one of the best teams since the Thornton trade.
They lost M. Savard, Bergeron, Nash, Eriksson to concussions. Samsonov to a slash on the wrist. Thomas walking away. The Cap forcing them to make some tough decisions and watching guys like Boychuk, Soderberg, Iginla, etc. cash in elsewhere. Hamilton asking out. And a lot more.

The biggest thing for teams to be successful is a solid core that brings a professional winning culture to the team. The Bruins have been lucky in that regards during The Cap years.
Pittsburgh, Chicago and Boston - and San Jose I guess have all had that. Teams like Colorado, Tampa and St. Louis (depending on Tarasenko) have all figured that out. We'll see this season but Philly and NY both seem to have it dialed in.
Then you see teams like Toronto, Montreal, Edmonton, Buffalo, etc. whom have had some of the best players in the league donning their sweaters but can't put together a proper team because the culture seems all screwed up. Finding guys like ROR, Landeskog, Hedman, Bergeron, Crosby is tough but when you have your top guys working as hard as they do then your team is going to be good.

The exception that proves the rule is Minnesota as they have some of the hardest working guys in hockey and are still so mediocre.

 

[TCB]

Hi Guys,

As a lifelong Senators fan (for better or worse...haha) was wondering if you could provide some perspective on something I was wondering about:
When the B's traded Joe Thorton and immediately following, weren't great for a few years before becoming amazing (and winning a cup), were you generally still peeved about how the team traded Thornton away even though the team was amazing now?

I ask because it seems like the Sens are turning a corner here and honestly, even if the Sens win a cup, I'm still pretty upset about the Karlsson trade...Or if the Sens get great and the Sharks tank (no pun intended), should I just get over it?

What are your thoughts?

You should be ecstatic the direction the Sens are headed in. The return you guys got for Karlsson was way better than what the Bruins got for Big Joe.

I mean come on your Killing me. Tim Stuetzle and Josh Norris alone gives Ottawa the win. O'Connell didn't do any shopping and shortly there after became unemployed. Huge difference between the two. Ottawa won the Karlsson trade, Boston not so-much.

 

[EvilDead]

It was a terrible deal but I'm over the Thornton trade.

 

[Saxon Eric]

Had no problem trading Joe,had a problem with the return
However, they used 2 out of the 3 pieces to acquire Ference and Kobasew
So in the end yes San Jose had the best player but Sturm,Ference and Kobs helped the climb back to respectability and relevancy

 

[McGarnagle]

Had no problem trading Joe,had a problem with the return
However, they used 2 out of the 3 pieces to acquire Ference and Kobasew
So in the end yes San Jose had the best player but Sturm,Ference and Kobs helped the climb back to respectability and relevancy

I'm still sad that Marco Sturm wasn't a part of the cup team in 2011. Got sent to LA as a cap dump in December that year.

They never make the leap to respectability without his presence and some of his huge goals. Too bad he couldn't be there for the culmination of it.

 

[DominicT]

I'm still sad that Marco Sturm wasn't a part of the cup team in 2011. Got sent to LA as a cap dump in December that year.

They never make the leap to respectability without his presence and some of his huge goals. Too bad he couldn't be there for the culmination of it.

In a sense, it was kind of a cap dump. Future considerations.

There was more to come from that, but unfortunately, Marc Savard suffered a concussion on on January 23, 2011 and the Bruins couldn't pull the trigger.