Seattle VII: SoDon't? To Kwila or not To Kwila (RayB to apply for expansion)

[gstommylee]

With NHL giving all kind of hints to Seattle and guys from Seattle sketch out a proposed arena with a basketball court in the middle.

Hopefully they changed the revised sketch to replace the basketball court with a hockey one.

It was just a preliminary sketch that is no longer used. The arena will host both NHL and NBA. That's all that really matters.

Ray B isn't going to build the arena if he's not getting a NHL team.

 

[Fugu]

It was just a preliminary sketch that is no longer used. The arena will host both NHL and NBA. That's all that really matters.

Ray B isn't going to build the arena if he's not getting a NHL team.

I really like the Bellevue site far better than this second Tukwila option. This seems too industrial with few redeeming qualities in terms of location or accessibility, and it doesn't have the entertainment development potential, at least from what we know right now.

 

[superdeluxe]

I really like the Bellevue site far better than this second Tukwila option. This seems too industrial with few redeeming qualities in terms of location or accessibility, and it doesn't have the entertainment development potential, at least from what we know right now.

Hrmm? At least you have Light rail 15 minutes away + right next to Commuter Station. You want accessibility/location nightmare? That is the Bellevue site.

If you pull back off that immediate area, its pretty much all restaurants/hotels/entertainment/shopping, with some office spaces/light industrial mixed in

 

[gstommylee]

I really like the Bellevue site far better than this second Tukwila option. This seems too industrial with few redeeming qualities in terms of location or accessibility, and it doesn't have the entertainment development potential, at least from what we know right now.

We don't know what the Bellevue idea at least at that location is not any better.

Boeing has a site east of the Tukwila site. Question could Boeing sell that site. Tukwila site has development potential east of there in city of renton limits. There are hotels already in the area of where Tukwila group wants to built it.

 

[Fugu]

We don't know what the Bellevue idea at least at that location is not any better.

Boeing has a site east of the Tukwila site. Question could Boeing sell that site. Tukwila site has development potential east of there in city of renton limits. There are hotels already in the area of where Tukwila group wants to built it.

We knew the location, and that it was very accessible to downtown Bellevue, so restaurants and hotels already built up. There was also the potential of a local train stop, iirc.

Hrmm? At least you have Light rail 15 minutes away + right next to Commuter Station. You want accessibility/location nightmare? That is the Bellevue site.

If you pull back off that immediate area, its pretty much all restaurants/hotels/entertainment/shopping, with some office spaces/light industrial mixed in

Explain please? Traffic might be an issue, but where isn't traffic an issue in the core of Seattle-Bellevue-SeaTac corridors?

 

[superdeluxe]

Explain please? Traffic might be an issue, but where isn't traffic an issue in the core of Seattle-Bellevue-SeaTac corridors?

Traffic would be worse at the Bellevue Location due to lack of mass transit options, that was one of the reasons why Sodo is superior because of its access to rails/light rail

 

[Fugu]

Traffic would be worse at the Bellevue Location due to lack of mass transit options, that was one of the reasons why Sodo is superior because of its access to rails/light rail

Yes, but we aren't comparing to SODO but to the second Tukwila site right now.

Iirc, the Bellevue location could get a mass transit stop, and/or had something in the works regardless?

 

[superdeluxe]

Yes, but we aren't comparing to SODO but to the second Tukwila site right now.

Iirc, the Bellevue location could get a mass transit stop, and/or had something in the works regardless?

Scheduled to be completed in 2023 that I've read.

 

[superdeluxe]

Tim Booth found this transit options document for Tukwila:

 

[Fugu]

Scheduled to be completed in 2023 that I've read.

How does this second Tukwila site compare to SODO, Bellevue, and the first Tukwila site?

 

[superdeluxe]

How does this second Tukwila site compare to SODO, Bellevue, and the first Tukwila site?

I would say worse transit options than SODO, But Better than Boeing Field Site & Bellevue.

primarily due to the access to the Light Rail/Commuter Rail.

 

[Killion]

Tim Booth found this transit options document for Tukwila:

Well, looking at that aerial map, your still going to have a hike to get from the station to the arena no? You dont wanna be taking shuttle buses around huh?.... Im thinking like Toronto, Vancouver & elsewhere, stations right there. 5 minute walk.

 

[gstommylee]

Rapid transit F line stops at the train station and the Light rail station.

The Sounder station is directly to the south east of where the arena is going to. South of where parking is going built. Link light rail is basically a rapid transit bus away from the sounder station.

 

[Nuclear SUV]

I really like the Bellevue site far better than this second Tukwila option. This seems too industrial with few redeeming qualities in terms of location or accessibility, and it doesn't have the entertainment development potential, at least from what we know right now.

- Not an industrial area. Directly west is the #4 commercial retail center in the core Seattle metro area. Downtown, Bellevue, and Lynnwood are the only ones larger. To the north is the Starfire athletic complex where the Sounders are based out of and play some of their open cup games at. To the east is the former Longacres (horse track) site, that is now home to Boeing offices. The Southcenter area and Renton Landing are both trying to develop into 24 hour urban districts.

- The area has tons of accessibility. One of the more accessible sites in the metro area in fact. It is right along the old Interurban; a no hill straight shot into downtown Seattle which the Sounder follows. The site has I-5 to the west, the Valley Freeway to the east, and I-405 to the north. A straight shot north on Interburban links to I-5 and SR-599. Sea-Tac Airport is 4 miles to the west. Boeing's Commercial Aviation division and its financial division are both based nearby. As is REI's world HQs, Wizards of the Coast, Blue Origin, Oberto, FLOW, the Seattle Seahawks, and many others.

 

[superdeluxe]

Well, looking at that aerial map, your still going to have a hike to get from the station to the arena no? You dont wanna be taking shuttle buses around huh?.... Im thinking like Toronto, Vancouver & elsewhere, stations right there. 5 minute walk.

It would be a 2 minute walk from Commuter Station, 5 minute walk from Transit Station.

Its detailed under the map

 

[Fugu]

Rapid transit F line stops at the train station and the Light rail station.

The Sounder station is directly to the south east of where the arena is going to. South of where parking is going built. Link light rail is basically a rapid transit bus away from the sounder station.

That's not good enough. We're talking about 18K people coming into this place, and with a direct stop, you might get a reasonable portion opting for the train. A bus system is simply too inefficient and the buses have to sit in the same traffic as the individual cars.

 

[superdeluxe]

That's not good enough. We're talking about 18K people coming into this place, and with a direct stop, you might get a reasonable portion opting for the train. A bus system is simply too inefficient and the buses have to sit in the same traffic as the individual cars.

Its not going to be perfect, but at least the options are there. You still have the commuter rail, which would be one direct stop. Busses being stuck in traffic would be an issue where ever you put the arena.

 

[Killion]

It would be a 2 minute walk from Commuter Station, 5 minute walk from Transit Station.

Its detailed under the map

Ah ok, thats better. Didnt read the fine print.

 

[Fugu]

- Not an industrial area. Directly west is the #4 commercial retail center in the core Seattle metro area. Downtown, Bellevue, and Lynnwood are the only ones larger. To the north is the Starfire athletic complex where the Sounders are based out of and play some of their open cup games at. To the east is the former Longacres (horse track) site, that is now home to Boeing offices. The Southcenter area and Renton Landing are both trying to develop into 24 hour urban districts.

- The area has tons of accessibility. One of the more accessible sites in the metro area in fact. It is right along the old Interurban; a no hill straight shot into downtown Seattle which the Sounder follows. The site has I-5 to the west, the Valley Freeway to the east, and I-405 to the north. A straight shot north on Interburban links to I-5 and SR-599. Sea-Tac Airport is 4 miles to the west. Boeing's Commercial Aviation division and its financial division are both based nearby. As is REI's world HQs, Wizards of the Coast, Blue Origin, Oberto, FLOW, the Seattle Seahawks, and many others.

Ah, okay. I went to Google maps to get a better idea of the location.

Personally, since I'm north of Seattle, I'm not really enthralled with with a drive that's the equivalent of getting to SeaTac for me. I'd be better off becoming a Canucks fan.


I hope these guys are taking a good look at NHL demographics and where their core fan base resides in metro Seattle. I still think most will be in Seattle and to the north, and then out along 1-90. (Seattle, Bellevue, Issaquah, Redmond, Everett)

 

[Fugu]

Its not going to be perfect, but at least the options are there. You still have the commuter rail, which would be one direct stop. Busses being stuck in traffic would be an issue where ever you put the arena.

Which is why no one would bother taking the buses. If I have to wait in traffic with a bus, why wouldn't I just drive my own car? If I have direct rail options that get me out of the congested zone, THEN I'd take the rail.

 

[superdeluxe]

Which is why no one would bother taking the buses. If I have to wait in traffic with a bus, why wouldn't I just drive my own car? If I have direct rail options that get me out of the congested zone, THEN I'd take the rail.

I'd take bus, not having to deal with the hassle of trying to find parking/driving in that Traffic/Paying for that parking.

Its always nice to leave the driving to someone else. I enjoyed my 50 minute train commute to Seattle because I get to catch up on reading or netflix.

 

[gstommylee]

Ideally the better location is always going to be Sodo arena. The problem is what happens if Sodo arena is a no go, where do you put it?

Tukwila is the second best option for the arena.

Bellevue thought other than light rail in 2023, is a traffic nightmare. A Chick fil la was just opened in Bellevue and its causing traffic mess to where off duty police officers has to be hired to provide help with traffic flow.

 

[Nuclear SUV]

That's not good enough. We're talking about 18K people coming into this place, and with a direct stop, you might get a reasonable portion opting for the train.

The Sounder/AMTRAK station is kitty-corner from arena site. If Sounder service were expanded for games, it could serve stations in downtown Seattle, Kent, Auburn, Sumner, Puyallup, Tacoma, South Tacoma, and Lakewood. That's a significantly larger reach than the current lightrail system that pretty much goes from the airport through the hood to downtown. The Tukwila station is also the first station south of downtown Seattle making it a fast transit option. The light rail is slow. The travel time from Seattle to Tukwila is currently 30 minutes on light rail. The lightrail system won't do much until it links to Seattle's north side in a few years.

 

[superdeluxe]

Another Big thing about that area is there are a TON of family entertainment within a 5-15 minute walk.

There are also 9-10 hotels/motels in a 5-10 minute walk of the arena.

You have Bullwinkles just north of the Arena, putt putt, gokart, laser tag, batting cages, arcades etc

To the west you have ACME Bowling, which has billiards, bowling, bar/lounge

Opening soon is Round1 entertainment, which will have bowling, arcade, billiards, ping pong, karaoke rooms

You also have a indoor flight simulator/building just north of Acme, and a professional gokart to the SE.

Go a mile on interurban you have 4-5 casinos, 2 miles from there you have a 18 hole golf course.

 

[superdeluxe]

The Sounder/AMTRAK station is kitty-corner from arena site. If Sounder service were expanded for games, it could serve stations in downtown Seattle, Kent, Auburn, Sumner, Puyallup, Tacoma, South Tacoma, and Lakewood. That's a significantly larger reach than the current lightrail system that pretty much goes from the airport through the hood to downtown. The Tukwila station is also the first station south of downtown Seattle making it a fast transit option. The light rail is slow. The travel time from Seattle to Tukwila is currently 30 minutes on light rail. The lightrail system won't do much until it links to Seattle's north side in a few years.

Commuter rail could also be an option heading from Everett South. Also I believe Dupont is going to be added to the Southend..so if your from the South end (Portland etc) that might even be an option.