Salary Cap: Salary Cap + Roster Building | Cap Details + Links in First Post | Trade Deadline 2.25

[DegenX]

From CapFriendly
AHL thread is here. Links to 2018 draft pick threads and QO information are in the first post.
Hagelin - Pearson trade thread is here.
Hagelin appreciation thread is here.
Sprong trade thread is here.
Guentzel signing thread is here.
DeSmith signing thread is here.
Grant for Blandisi trade thread is here
Oleksiak trade thread is here
Brassard/Sheahan+ for Bjugstad/McCann trade thread is here

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[Ogrezilla]

downplaying what Kessel has done for this team in the two cup runs is baffling to me. The guy was really f***ing good. In contention for best player in the playoffs for one of them, and still really freaking good in the other.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Malkin was great in every series. Kessel if I remember disappeared in the Caps series and Ottawa aside from that huge goal in Game 2 or 3.

It's because he did that. He started out the playoffs great, but his production fell off once May started. He did have a nice run against Ottawa, with 5 points in 4 straight games, but he was mostly way below his normal after about game 2 in the 2nd round. Kessel scored 3 points in a 6-0 blowout in game 5 in the finals, after only putting up 9 points in the previous 16 games.

downplaying what Kessel has done for this team in the two cup runs is baffling to me. The guy was really ****ing good. In contention for best player in the playoffs for one of them, and still really freaking good in the other.

I'm not positive on this, but I don't feel like it was controversial at the time to say Kessel was struggling in the 2017 run. Kessel put up good numbers on the 2017 run, but he wasn't that good on that run IIRC. I don't think it's any more controversial to say that Kessel struggled in 2018 than it is to say that he struggled in 2017.

 

[Ogrezilla]

To clarify. If you trade Kessel now is the best time to do it. And you would get two first round picks

that's a huge downgrade for us in any sort of near term.

 

[KIRK]

It's because he did that. He started out the playoffs great, but his production fell off once May started. He did have a nice run against Ottawa, with 5 points in 4 straight games, but he was mostly way below his normal after about game 2 in the 2nd round. Kessel scored 3 points in a 6-0 blowout in game 5 in the finals, after only putting up 9 points in the previous 16 games.



I'm not positive on this, but I don't feel like it was controversial at the time to say Kessel was struggling in the 2017 run. Kessel put up good numbers on the 2017 run, but he wasn't that good on that run IIRC.

Kessel only had 1 ES goal against Ottawa. Of course, Crosby only had 2 ES assists against Ottawa.

Geno, by the way, had 2 goals and 1 assist at ES against Ottawa.

That said, comparing what Kessel did after the CBJ series to what Geno did was just plain silly.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The best scoring wingers have dry spells. Phil's in a dry spell. Trading Phil for picks blows up our window, and makes us better in five years, when we want to be worse. And once again, his deal is pretty much perfect for our window.

A bunch of replacement level players or a couple of picks isn't worth Kessel, and that's what we'd get coming back due to the restrictions on trading him.

Who said trade Kessel for picks?

This is a REALLY awful post.

A quiet remainder of playoffs AFTER the Columbus series . . .

Crosby: 20 points (6g, 14a)
Malkin: 17 points (8g, 9a)
Kessel: 15 points (6g, 9a)

All 3 players had the same amount of PP points in those three series. And, actually Geno had the same number of points as Sid in the Caps and Sens series (the finals, Sid was 1g, 6a and Geno was 3g, 1a . . . but Sid had 1 more PP point in that series than Geno and 2 more than Phil, who also had 4 points in the finals).

cc: @Solzhenitsyn, @pixiesfanyo

Are you referring to me including Malkin? My point with including Malkin is saying that he roasted the Jackets and was quieter after roasting the Jackets. It was the same thing I said in 2017 to the people complaining that Malkin deserved the Smythe, he put up a ton of points in the first round that year.

Kessel only had 1 ES goal against Ottawa. Of course, Crosby only had 2 ES assists against Ottawa.

Geno, by the way, had 2 goals and 1 assist at ES against Ottawa.

That said, comparing what Kessel did after the CBJ series to what Geno did was just plain silly.

I didn't? My point was that both killed the Jackets and were quieter after the Jackets series. Malkin was more consistent than Kessel was and didn't put up points in bunches like Kessel did.

 

[Gurglesons]

downplaying what Kessel has done for this team in the two cup runs is baffling to me. The guy was really ****ing good. In contention for best player in the playoffs for one of them, and still really freaking good in the other.

I think the majority of this board was actually pretty rough on Kessel throughout the Caps and Ottawa series and then Nashville game 1 and 2 happened so we couldn’t be upset because they were so ridiculous.

Board / Pittsburgh went back to saying we were done going into Game 5 and I took advantage of that and got two tickets for less than 500 to Game 5 of a Stanley Cup Final game.

Kessel was good in 2017. He just isn’t worth not moving due to it. Especially given his performance the following year in the playoffs (when he was our worst player) as well as this regular season when despite random flashes with Geno and Sid he’s been a total nonfactor.

And isn’t that the thing everyone says about Kessel is he needs to produce outside of those two to be effective here. If that doesn’t happen is it worth putting 6 mil on the third line.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Kessel only had 1 ES goal against Ottawa. Of course, Crosby only had 2 ES assists against Ottawa.

Geno, by the way, had 2 goals and 1 assist at ES against Ottawa.

That said, comparing what Kessel did after the CBJ series to what Geno did was just plain silly.

right. Not as good as Sid and Geno isn't really a slight on a player.

 

[Jacob]

The best scoring wingers have dry spells. Phil's in a dry spell. Trading Phil for picks blows up our window, and makes us better in five years, when we want to be worse. And once again, his deal is pretty much perfect for our window.

A bunch of replacement level players or a couple of picks isn't worth Kessel, and that's what we'd get coming back due to the restrictions on trading him.

I don’t think it necessarily blows up the window. If you use the trade to open cap space and spend that on, say, Skinner, that extends the window and you’re even better off short-term if one of those picks can play soon.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I think the majority of this board was actually pretty rough on Kessel throughout the Caps and Ottawa series and then Nashville game 1 and 2 happened so we couldn’t be upset because they were so ridiculous.

Board / Pittsburgh went back to saying we were done going into Game 5 and I took advantage of that and got two tickets for less than 500 to Game 5 of a Stanley Cup Final game.

The majority of this board thought Rust sucked because of a bad month.

 

[KIRK]

Who said trade Kessel for picks? No one has advocated for that, at least no one not on my ignore list.



Are you referring to me including Malkin? My point with including Malkin is saying that he roasted the Jackets and was quieter after roasting the Jackets. It was the same thing I said in 2017 to the people complaining that Malkin deserved the Smythe, he put up a ton of points in the first round that year.



I didn't? My point was that both killed the Jackets and were quieter after the Jackets series.

Quieter than the CBJ series? Yes. BUT, you suggested he was QUIET, like Phil. That's where I called BS. And it is.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Quieter than the CBJ series? Yes. BUT, you suggested he was QUIET, like Phil. That's where I called BS. And it is.

I thought I included the word "relatively" there, I guess I deleted it and forgot to add it back in.

 

[Gurglesons]

The majority of this board thought Rust sucked because of a bad month.

Oh, I mean 100%.

I just think the legend of Kessel is perpetuated by a run not easily replicated by him individually especially as he gets older.

I also think he’s value to this team with the emergence of Jake is far overrated. He’s a PP specialist on a team that has Letang, Sid and Malkin. So was Neal. Moving him while he has value is the smart move. Same thing as it is with Letang.

Doesn’t mean I would get mad if we kept both.

 

[KIRK]

I thought I included the word "relatively" there, I guess I deleted it and forgot to add it back in.

You did.

 

[Ogrezilla]

delete

 

[Empoleon8771]

You did.

Yeah, I just forgot to include a word there. The point of that wasn't to take a shot at Malkin, the point was to say that Kessel followed the same pattern as Malkin did in the playoffs. Kessel was worse than Malkin, but both had the "kill the Jackets and be quieter on the rest of the run" playoff runs. Malkin just killed the Jackets worse and was way closer to his normal on the rest of the run than Kessel was.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Oh, I mean 100%.

I just think the legend of Kessel is perpetuated by a run not easily replicated by him individually especially as he gets older.

I also think he’s value to this team with the emergence of Jake is far overrated. He’s a PP specialist on a team that has Letang, Sid and Malkin. So was Neal. Moving him while he has value is the smart move. Same thing as it is with Letang.

Doesn’t mean I would get mad if we kept both.

I can understanding trading Kessel because of our other wing logjams and as you said Jake makes him less of a necessity.

Trading Letang would most likely mark the end of the Sid/Geno era's window imo. And either way, I think Letang has earned the right to retire a Penguin if he wants to.

 

[KIRK]

I can understanding trading Kessel because of our other wing logjams and as you said Jake makes him less of a necessity.

Trading Letang would most likely mark the end of the Sid/Geno era's window imo. And either way, I think Letang has earned the right to retire a Penguin if he wants to.

The only ones who have earned it are Sid and Geno, but I agree with what you say trading THIS Letang would mean.

 

[Ogrezilla]

The only ones who have earned it are Sid and Geno, but I agree with what you say trading THIS Letang would mean.

eh, I disagree. Letang has been an incredibly important part of this team. It helps that he's still good enough for me to use that to defend me thinking it would be dumb to trade him

 

[Gurglesons]

I can understanding trading Kessel because of our other wing logjams and as you said Jake makes him less of a necessity.

Trading Letang would most likely mark the end of the Sid/Geno era's window imo. And either way, I think Letang has earned the right to retire a Penguin if he wants to.

I think they both have to be honest.

I just don’t get the idea that moving Kessel kills our window. He’s only going downhill from here. The only player I can think has had an impressive run being a perimeter player like him post 30 is Carter and he’s way more skilled and defensively aware.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I think they both have to be honest.

I just don’t get the idea that moving Kessel kills our window. He’s only going downhill from here. The only player I can think has had an impressive run being a perimeter player like him post 30 is Carter and he’s way more skilled and defensively aware.

Carter is more defensively aware, not sure I buy that he's more skilled. Certainly not way more.

I don't think trading Kessel kills the window, but doing it for a fairly typical trade of picks and prospects takes us backwards in the short term. I'd be all for trading him for a high end D.

 

[Andy P]

I am calling it now, in the off-season....

Rutherford and Sullivan both keep their jobs but assistant coaching will be changed

Kessel will be traded to Anaheim for rickell but with other pieces involved

Johnson will remain on the team because of Crosby

Maatta will be traded for picks in the draft

Do I like it not really but Rutherford is a hard guy to figure out

 

[Zirakzigil]

Trading Kessel is stupid. You will not replace his offense if you trade him, not at the cap hit he’s currently costing.

 

[Nakawick]

opps

 

[Ugene Magic]