Salary Cap: Salary Cap: 2016-17 roster-building part VI | Contract chart, cap info in post #1

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Coastal Kev

There will be "I told you so's" Bet on it
Feb 16, 2013
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I guess we didn't just watch the Penguins win the Stanley Cup by playing a complete 200 foot game where our captain won the Conn Smythe despite scoring under a PPG.

This is how playoff hockey is played now. Do you need snipers? Absolutely, but you need Phil Kessel back checking and playing his balls off (which he did). Maybe they can bring in Yak and he can do that, but I wouldn't bet on it.

All of that aside, you are the one that compared Yak to Hagelin. As I said, they aren't remotely similar players.

What they share is breakneck speed that can open ice for their talented linemates.

Did you see how much better Phil looked with Hags?? Hags speed and forecheck provides Phil with time and space. Yak can do the same thing for either Sid or Geno. He is talented enough to carry the puck through the neutral zone and his speed will have defenders not fleet of foot to back down and away.
 

UnderratedBrooks44

Registered User
Sep 13, 2005
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I'm slowly getting on the Boedker train. Might as well go all in on the speed.

I also don't think he'll get a big contract. More along the lines of a Beleskey contract...which is more than reasonable for his talent.

I wasn't on board with it before but given that everyone is going to try and copy us and the pendulum generally swinging back to speed, if he's fast and has some hands I'd go for it.
 

Speaking Moistly

What a terrible image.
Feb 19, 2013
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I'm slowly getting on the Boedker train. Might as well go all in on the speed.

I also don't think he'll get a big contract. More along the lines of a Beleskey contract...which is more than reasonable for his talent.

tumblr_ntwtyfwsIe1uf3rxio1_500.gif
 

mpp9

Registered User
Dec 5, 2010
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I'd be asking Bonino what it'd take to get him to sign an extension this summer. That guy is a hell of a playoff player. Not sure we can replace him by next summer.
 

HandshakeLine

A real jerk thing
Nov 9, 2005
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Amazing what the sport of hockey is turning the sport in to, ie soccer on skates.

I'm sorry, but hockey isn't soccer. The object is to score. 200ft game?? Maybe this is a generational difference in opinion, but I don't give 2 craps about the 200ft game.

You are placing more importance to defensive zone coverage than scoring??? My gosh, the entire league has now become the New Jersey Devils....

So I don't get to see fighting or scoring, but I have to learn to love the beauty of a great back check.

NUTS

For someone that claims to like old time hockey, you sure aren't aware of the fact that that many of the old time hockey guys put huge stock in 2-way, 200 ft play. Clarke, Gainey, Carbonneau, Kurri, Francis, Trottier, and Howe were all EXCELLENT 2-way players, and their teammates have been very vocal about that component.

Maybe you prefer the watered-down expansion league where Bob Errey could be a scoring threat?
 

Paulie Gualtieri

R.I.P. Tony Sirico
May 18, 2016
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I'm slowly getting on the Boedker train. Might as well go all in on the speed.

I also don't think he'll get a big contract. More along the lines of a Beleskey contract...which is more than reasonable for his talent.

Boedker will not get closer to 4 mil$ x 5. Neither Coyote or Avalanche fans were high on him, and agreed that he would become overpayed. I expect him to get 5,25+ mil$ x 5 or something like that. And I would not sign a guy with a low ESP%, horrible possession stats and no work ethic to that money.
 

Riptide

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Dec 29, 2011
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I respectfully disagree with this line of thinking. I know a lot of people agree with you, I just think it's a half in, half out mentality. Murray helped them win a Cup and was usually fantastic. What more do we need to know? It's just weird to me to agree Murray is the guy but only so far as dumping MAF and overpaying a backup in case Murray isn't the guy. I don't get that philosophy.

I could see it if we got to round two or three, but I'm not sure what else there is to see at this point. Just get a regular ol' backup and save the money. If Murray falters a Reimer-esque guy isn't going to save us, and who's to say we couldn't trade for one during the season anyways?

Three things.
1) Murray played 21 games these playoffs - in which we generally made things extremely easy for him by limiting the shots he was facing. Not to take anything away from how well he played, but there's a big difference between playing 21 games while the team is rolling and playing 60 games over the course of 6 months.

2) It's called insurance. Murray is the future of this team. Yes we have Crosby, Malkin, Letang, Kessel and a great supporting cast. But one of the reasons things look so bright is because of how promising things are with Murray. But that doesn't mean we should just throw him to the wolves and let him sink or swim. What happens to him mentally and for his long term development if we sign a meh backup (someone who is good for 20 games, but won't push anyone to be a starter), and Murray falters/stumbles next season? The added pressure of having to be good/great every night, the expectations of fans for this team (largely intact) pushing to repeat? Look, I think he'll be fine. But for both his sake and the teams sake, getting an experienced backup and someone who could start 40+ games if needed should be an absolute must if (hopefully when) we trade Fleury. Reimer would be perfect (other than I think he'll get overpaid as a FA), but if he'd take a 2x3m deal I'd be all over that. I'm not looking for him to "save us" in the sense that he'll lead us to another cup. But I don't want to completely write off the season due to MM stumbling, and someone like Reimer is good enough that they can keep things going until MM hopefully finds his game.

3) Trading for a position of need mid season is expensive. Look around the league as of the TD last year. Other than Reimer or Ramo, who would have been available who you'd actually want? Howard, Lehtonen/Niemi? Maybe Lack. But it's a pretty short list. Add in salary/cap concerns, and making a deal like that can be tough. I'd much rather sort it out in June/July then hope that if something happens, we can magically fix it in January.
 

AquaticBirdman

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Sep 25, 2007
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What's everyone's thoughts on extended Lovejoy for another year or two? I was completely against the notion coming into the post-season, however seeing just how solid he was throughout the playoffs I wouldn't mind keeping him around as our 6th d-man at a very low cap it.
 

billybudd

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Feb 1, 2012
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:laugh: Yak is awful defensively. He has no idea where to go or what to do without the puck unless he's in the offensive zone. He's fast. That's the only comparison with Hagelin.

Yak has a better shot and goal scorer, but he's a much worse 200 foot hockey player.

He doesn't have any idea where to go or what to do with the puck in the offensive zone, either. Just a clueless player in all situations other than playing weak side right circle on the powerplay.


Why are people assuming Dumoulin gets Maatta money? I think he's closer to a $3M contract than $4M.

Dumoulin is obviously effective to the eye, but he's an odd case in where he really doesn't have the numbers to leverage any sort of large deal right now.


What's everyone's thoughts on extended Lovejoy for another year or two? I was completely against the notion coming into the post-season, however seeing just how solid he was throughout the playoffs I wouldn't mind keeping him around as our 6th d-man at a very low cap it.

I think we're going to be shocked at what some team offers him. Perception of leadership, perception of raising his game in the playoffs, good size, decent mobility, little bit of jam, right handed, Champion...

Someone out there's going to like the Reverend an awful lot.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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Washington will sign Ben. I'm almost positive of that. And if not, they'll try and poach Schultz.
 

Coastal Kev

There will be "I told you so's" Bet on it
Feb 16, 2013
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For someone that claims to like old time hockey, you sure aren't aware of the fact that that many of the old time hockey guys put huge stock in 2-way, 200 ft play. Clarke, Gainey, Carbonneau, Kurri, Francis, Trottier, and Howe were all EXCELLENT 2-way players, and their teammates have been very vocal about that component.

Maybe you prefer the watered-down expansion league where Bob Errey could be a scoring threat?

The reason they all stood out as 2-way players is that the league was an offense first mindset. Even Sully talked about how the goals are getting increasingly tough to score in a defense league.

I hope it changes before 2-1 games are considered high scoring.
 

AquaticBirdman

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Sep 25, 2007
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He doesn't have any idea where to go or what to do with the puck in the offensive zone, either. Just a clueless player in all situations other than playing weak side right circle on the powerplay.




Dumoulin is obviously effective to the eye, but he's an odd case in where he really doesn't have the numbers to leverage any sort of large deal right now.




I think we're going to be shocked at what some team offers him.

If that's the case, then lets just hope that JR is a hell of a lot smarter than those other GM's. Much rather see Pouliot finally given a full-time stint rather than overpaid an aging 6th/7th dman.
 

djt153

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Dec 26, 2003
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the blackhawks model involves getting too much out of players and tricking opposition into signing them at exaggerated prices. hopefully the pens adopt that with lovejoy.
 

billybudd

Registered User
Feb 1, 2012
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Washington will sign Ben. I'm almost positive of that. And if not, they'll try and poach Schultz.

:laugh:

Good call. He's always done a good job against OV, so, yeah, not only do they covet all our D always, but there's that they're always seeing him at his best. It's the Benning/Sutter factor again.
 

Asuna

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Apr 27, 2014
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I wasn't on board with it before but given that everyone is going to try and copy us and the pendulum generally swinging back to speed, if he's fast and has some hands I'd go for it.

Yep. While the rest of the league will try to get fast....we have to get even faster.

Boedker will not get closer to 4 mil$ x 5. Neither Coyote or Avalanche fans were high on him, and agreed that he would become overpayed. I expect him to get 5,25+ mil$ x 5 or something like that. And I would not sign a guy with a low ESP%, horrible possession stats and no work ethic to that money.

There were barely any 'bad' contracts given out last year, and I expect that trend to continue. GMs can't afford to have those bad contracts and it appears they're learning. Especially with the expansion draft coming.

So I don't see Boedker getting that....he may want 5-6m a year...doesn't mean he's going to get it.

But who knows. It just takes one desperate team.
 

Riptide

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Dec 29, 2011
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Yak is a bad idea. I assign no value to him and see no reason he deserves a roster spot over any current Penguin.

If the price was cheap, I'd take a flier on him. I mean if we traded Kunitz somewhere then flipped those assets for Yak, I wouldn't have any issues with that. Get younger, faster and save some cap space. If it works out, great. If not, no real loss. That said I question whether Kunitz will get traded this summer. I'm not holding my breath.
 

HandshakeLine

A real jerk thing
Nov 9, 2005
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The reason they all stood out as 2-way players is that the league was an offense first mindset. Even Sully talked about how the goals are getting increasingly tough to score in a defense league.

I hope it changes before 2-1 games are considered high scoring.

That's not true at all. Those players are the epitome of what YOU claim to want, and they were all known and praised for defensive play and defensive mindset. I get wanting to see more offense, but really, what you want is the sort of inept defensive play that dominated in the 1980s and 1990s because the Euros weren't scouted and brought in and the league expanded too quickly. Which is fine, I love firewagon hockey, but that's the product of very specific conditions during the 1980s. Hell, those 70s Habs teams were the blueprint for defensive dynamos who could score, fight/play physical, and played an intensely sound defensive game.

Personally, I'd just tweak the net and ice size, and you'd be a good chunk of the way there.

I mean, are you seriously trying to argue that Bobby Clarke isn't Old Time Hockey? :laugh:
 

Riptide

Registered User
Dec 29, 2011
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How can JR screw this offseason up?

I'm not saying it's impossible, but they don't have enough cap room to sign bad deals.

I'm also very against re-signing
Lovejoy and Schultz. Maatta isn't fleet of foot. Nor Cole. They need mobility. Tampa was killing the D when they attacked.

Why? Schultz has been very good for us, and I see little reason why we shouldn't want to sign him if he'd sign something reasonable that we can afford (say 2x2.5m).
 

Le Magnifique 66

Let's Go Pens
Jun 9, 2006
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Why? Schultz has been very good for us, and I see little reason why we shouldn't want to sign him if he'd sign something reasonable that we can afford (say 2x2.5m).

Agreed, Schultz is a great fit here, playing a #5-6 role with no pressure unlike Edmonton. But if he wants to stay, he can't be greedy!!!
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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How much do you think Schultz can realistically demand? He only got to play due to Daley's injury, and even at that he was logging the fewest minutes of our d-men.

I'm not real sure. Because we can't sign him at his QO (3.9), it's going to have to be a case where Schultz works with us before he gets to free agency. If he does, I could see a Niskanen deal around 2 for 2-3 years.
 

AquaticBirdman

Registered User
Sep 25, 2007
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Agreed, Schultz is a great fit here, playing a #5-6 role with no pressure unlike Edmonton. But if he wants to stay, he can't be greedy!!!

Schultz is currently trying to rebuild his reputation as a potential top-4 guy in this league. This cup win will look good on his resume, however he'll still need a bit more time to shake off hte damage that his stint in Edmonton did to his rep.
 

Riptide

Registered User
Dec 29, 2011
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What's everyone's thoughts on extended Lovejoy for another year or two? I was completely against the notion coming into the post-season, however seeing just how solid he was throughout the playoffs I wouldn't mind keeping him around as our 6th d-man at a very low cap it.

He's going to get 3m+ over 3 or 4 years.
 

mpp9

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Dec 5, 2010
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:laugh:

Good call. He's always done a good job against OV, so, yeah, not only do they covet all our D always, but there's that they're always seeing him at his best. It's the Benning/Sutter factor again.

Exactly. If anything, that team needs bottom six forwards that can score. Said it after the Caps series, if you replace Richards with Cullen, they beat us.
 
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