Player Discussion Ryan Nugent-Hopkins '16-17 and Beyond

[Bryanbryoil]

Since the Hall-Larsson thread is being derailed with this topic I decided to open a new thread to discuss RNH, his role and production this season and beyond.

Click to read more...

 

[Bryanbryoil]

From the derailed thread:

Nuge has only scored 77 thus far. 77 to go. Wonder how long it takes?

Especially considering his time with primo players like Hall and Eberle on this team is DONE.

About half the time or less than you said that it'd take him.

Both of which are shoot first players, IMO RNH has the best wrist shot on this team, Yak has more zip on his and Eberle has more accuracy but RNH can beat a goalie clean with his shot. Give him some time with a playmaker like Puljujarvi or Draisaitl and a net front presence like Maroon and he could flirt with 30 as early as this season.

We're likely about to see how little Nuge gets done offensively on his own.

If he gets top unit PP time and he isn't used in a shutdown role with say Pouliot and Maroon he should be around the same point total that Hall had last season if he plays 80ish games. The funny thing IMO is that RNH had a piss poor year last season yet it sounds like he was still on pace for 50ish points. Granted a good chunk of that production came when he was on a line with Drai and Hall but I saw him having better chemistry with Drai than he does Hall.

IMO RNH is at his best in transition when he has the puck in his hands and he has linemates that can think the game at a high level and who play within a system. Same with Nuge on the cycle, IMO this fits Draisaitl to a T, Hall not so much. Guys like Maroon, Draisaitl, Pouliot (when on his game), RNH and Lucic play this way, hopefully Puljujarvi does as well but I haven't seen nearly enough of him to say one way or another. RNH is among the best on our team at getting the puck in deep, has been for years but he hasn't had the horses that are willing to get to the puck and get to the front of the net. RNH has been the net front presence on his line FAR too often. Why? Because Hall and Eberle would not play that role so someone on the line had to. Give him Maroon (since Looch probably starts with McDavid) and watch him flourish because Maroon fills that role so that RNH can work with the puck on his stick more. If he plays with Maroon and Drai, that will be one hell of a 2nd line.

Amusingly his 34 pts prorate to 56 pts in a full season

That's amazing considering IMO that was his worst season since the lockout one.

Prorates to 50. Playing much of the year with Eberle, typically the best goal scorer on the club.

Eberle started very slowly coming back from injury and all 3 of Pouliot, RNH and Eberle played like dog crap for good chunks of last season. The only player that IMO RNH did well with was Draisaitl.

McDavid with Lucic and Eberle is the most likely scenario to occur. Not saying that's what I would do but the team is likely looking that way.

Drai and Nuge get whats left over.

I get your point with Draisaitl, and I've said similar, but that feeds my argument on Hall being so beneficial to team mates, as he has been with Nuge much of his career.

It is interesting that Drai paired with Hall and fill did as well as Nuge ever has paired with the two top players on the team.

IMO outside of RNH's rookie year his best play was with Pouliot and Eberle offensively at least. Sometimes it's better to have 2 good players and fill than having 3 really good players on a line depending on their skillsets.

If I were making the lines:

Lucic-McDavid-Eberle (should be a great line)
Maroon-RNH-Draisaitl (size, skill, solid 2nd line)
Pouliot-Letestu-Puljujarvi (a couple of solid 2 way wingers to boost Letestu)
Hendricks-Khaira/Lander-Kassian (rough and tumble 4th line)
Khaira/Lander, Pakarinen

The problem is that now that I typed that out I realized that Yak is nowhere to be found which tells me that we will either be moving out another winger (Pouliot or Yak probably) or rolling with 3 offensive centers in which case:

Lucic-McDavid-Eberle (remains unchanged)
Maroon-RNH-Puljujarvi (RNH gets a couple of big wingers, basically a lesser version of the top line but still a solid line if Puljujarvi comes in ready to play)
Pouliot-Draisaitl-Yakupov (defensive awareness on the left side, Yak finally gets a push with a playmaker from day 1)
Hendricks-Letestu-Kassian (Letestu in a better suited role for him)
Lander/Khaira, Pakarinen

 

[belair]

For the record, RNH has never been 'on the block'. He was however available in the right deal for a high end RHD.

 

[Replacement*]

May as well insert this here. Was going to be a new thread but now you made this one.

The Survivor Guilt of Ryan Nugent Hopkins?;

Survivor guilt (or survivor's guilt; also called survivor syndrome or survivor's syndrome) is a mental condition that occurs when a person perceives themselves to have done wrong by surviving a traumatic event when others did not.

Now I'm speaking of this figuratively, of course, and being cast out of the Oilers could hardly be considered a traumatic concept for most, but for Hall he, by his own statements felt badly about the trade, felt slighted, and that there was no other way for him to take this. Hall wanted to win here, of that there is no doubt.


Hopkins as we know was drafted by the Oilers instead of Larsson who was drafted 4th in same draft year.

FF to this year and Nuge, through his own on ice regression, and not matching contractual worth of his 6M contract, is not even in the ballpark in trade value for Larsson. Shero won't even consider any less than Hall in trade.

So that Nuge see's Hall, who he full well knows has been the leader of this team the entire time Nuge has been playing here, traded instead due to Nuge not progressing commensurately with Larsson.

Not only was Hall a leader on the ice, the whole rat pack here Centered around him. Following him around like brothers. Benefitting from his talent, presence, confidence, and verve.

So Nuge, due to his own relative futility (as compared to Hall) stands by and watches Hall take the trade bullet instead and have his dream of winning with the Oilers ended while Nuge, through lesser development, gets to stay and again knowing full well that his mere presence here is due to how little his contract and trade value is.

Now these are professional players but I can't help but think the Hall trade, and Nuge knowing why he avoided the bullet(ordinary season), that it won't exactly help his self confidence, feeling of integration here, and what his value is.

McLellans proclamations notwithstanding there wasn't much to recommend of Nuges play in this season. I wonder how long before he's either 3rd lined or his contract is seen as negligible value here.

I don't see the Hall trade much helping Nuge. I wonder if Nuge even continues to relate to the team the same way and that if pro hockey wonderland is over for him. Really I think he's been a kid with a 6M contract that has been content to bask in that.

 

[Vanqu1sh]

May as well insert this here. Was going to be a new thread but now you made this one.

The Survivor Guilt of Ryan Nugent Hopkins?;




Now I'm speaking of this figuratively, of course, and being cast out of the Oilers could hardly be considered a traumatic concept for most, but for Hall he, by his own statements felt badly about the trade, felt slighted, and that there was no other way for him to take this. Hall wanted to win here, of that there is no doubt.


Hopkins as we know was drafted by the Oilers instead of Larsson who was drafted 4th in same draft year.

FF to this year and Nuge, through his own on ice regression, and not matching contractual worth of his 6M contract, is not even in the ballpark in trade value for Larsson. Shero won't even consider any less than Hall in trade.

So that Nuge see's Hall, who he full well knows has been the leader of this team the entire time Nuge has been playing here, traded instead due to Nuge not progressing commensurately with Larsson.

Not only was Hall a leader on the ice, the whole rat pack here Centered around him. Following him around like brothers. Benefitting from his talent, presence, confidence, and verve.

So Nuge, due to his own relative futility (as compared to Hall) stands by and watches Hall take the trade bullet instead and have his dream of winning with the Oilers ended while Nuge, through lesser development, gets to stay and again knowing full well that his mere presence here is due to how little his contract and trade value is.

Now these are professional players but I can't help but think the Hall trade, and Nuge knowing why he avoided the bullet(ordinary season), that it won't exactly help his self confidence, feeling of integration here, and what his value is.

McLellans proclamations notwithstanding there wasn't much to recommend of Nuges play in this season. I wonder how long before he's either 3rd lined or his contract is seen as negligible value here.

I don't see the Hall trade much helping Nuge. I wonder if Nuge even continues to relate to the team the same way and that if pro hockey wonderland is over for him. Really I think he's been a kid with a 6M contract that has been content to bask in that.

Is there really 0 chance that PC wasn't looking to move Hall > RNH ?

 

[Replacement*]

Is there really 0 chance that PC wasn't looking to move Hall > RNH ?

Moot question because according to Chiarelli Shero would not consider anybody less than Hall in trade. No other Oilers, except McDavid who obviously wasn't on the block, would do.

If you looked in the other thread Larsson/Hall trade where this was being discussed I provided the link from six months ago where Chia was saying any of Hall, Eberle, RNH, were ALL on the potential block. That was around February 2016.

 

[belair]

May as well insert this here. Was going to be a new thread but now you made this one.

The Survivor Guilt of Ryan Nugent Hopkins?;




Now I'm speaking of this figuratively, of course, and being cast out of the Oilers could hardly be considered a traumatic concept for most, but for Hall he, by his own statements felt badly about the trade, felt slighted, and that there was no other way for him to take this. Hall wanted to win here, of that there is no doubt.


Hopkins as we know was drafted by the Oilers instead of Larsson who was drafted 4th in same draft year.

FF to this year and Nuge, through his own on ice regression, and not matching contractual worth of his 6M contract, is not even in the ballpark in trade value for Larsson. Shero won't even consider any less than Hall in trade.

So that Nuge see's Hall, who he full well knows has been the leader of this team the entire time Nuge has been playing here, traded instead due to Nuge not progressing commensurately with Larsson.

Not only was Hall a leader on the ice, the whole rat pack here Centered around him. Following him around like brothers. Benefitting from his talent, presence, confidence, and verve.

So Nuge, due to his own relative futility (as compared to Hall) stands by and watches Hall take the trade bullet instead and have his dream of winning with the Oilers ended while Nuge, through lesser development, gets to stay and again knowing full well that his mere presence here is due to how little his contract and trade value is.

Now these are professional players but I can't help but think the Hall trade, and Nuge knowing why he avoided the bullet(ordinary season), that it won't exactly help his self confidence, feeling of integration here, and what his value is.

McLellans proclamations notwithstanding there wasn't much to recommend of Nuges play in this season. I wonder how long before he's either 3rd lined or his contract is seen as negligible value here.

I don't see the Hall trade much helping Nuge. I wonder if Nuge even continues to relate to the team the same way and that if pro hockey wonderland is over for him. Really I think he's been a kid with a 6M contract that has been content to bask in that.

This is what I don't get. Who cares if Hall's the alpha of 'the group'? The team didn't benefit with that setup so why continue to nurse it? And the only player who I can say statistically benefited from playing with Taylor was Leon. The others (RNH/Ebs) are fully capable of creating their own offense on other lines.

The players who likely do need offensive piggybacks are likely other LW (Pouliot/Lucic/Maroon) so having the depth at center probably helps the team out more as a whole.

 

[Replacement*]

This is what I don't get. Who cares if Hall's the alpha of 'the group'? The team didn't benefit with that setup so why continue to nurse it? And the only player who I can say statistically benefited from playing with Taylor was Leon. The others (RNH/Ebs) are fully capable of creating their own offense on other lines.

The players who likely do need offensive piggybacks are likely other LW (Pouliot/Lucic/Maroon) so having the depth at center probably helps the team out more as a whole.

Theres no substantiation of this whatsoever. Of the 3, Hall was always the most likely to be put on a different line to kickstart it and why for instance he got the Draisaitl assignment this season. Ironically for a period Hall was even pulled from Draisaitl briefly as Eberle/Nuge were struggling to produce.

Nuge has rarely had to play with neither of Eberle or Hall. Nuge clearly needs players that can finish better than he can to produce. Somebody has to score the goals. Nuge has 77 in his whole career. That's not a huge basis for pts and individual production resilience. Nuge is seen now as a pass first peripheral player that decreasingly gets into good scoring positions himself.

One of the things I key on regarding producers is how comfortable they are challenging the D and testing it. Most games Nuge isn't doing that.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Moot question because according to Chiarelli Shero would not consider anybody less than Hall in trade. No other Oilers, except McDavid who obviously wasn't on the block, would do.

If you looked in the other thread Larsson/Hall trade where this is being discussed I provided the link from six months ago where Chia was saying any of Hall, Eberle, RNH, were ALL on the potential block. That was around February 2016.

So don't do the trade and continue status quo.

Problem solved.

.....Right?

 

[CupofOil]

May as well insert this here. Was going to be a new thread but now you made this one.

The Survivor Guilt of Ryan Nugent Hopkins?;

Not only was Hall a leader on the ice, the whole rat pack here Centered around him. Following him around like brothers. Benefitting from his talent, presence, confidence, and verve.

Perhaps that was the problem. A group of kids alienating themselves from the rest of the team because of this "rat pack" mentality with Hall being the leader of that group. I think it will actually benefit RNH to branch of on his own and not have to differ to Hall on the ice or in any leadership aspect. To be quite frank, I think he looked better away from Hall the last couple of seasons than with although a very small sample size last season with Hall.

 

[A91]

I've said it numerous times on these boards. I still believe RNH has a a lot of untapped offensive potential.
I could see him as a 70 point 2-way stud in the current NHL. If the scoring goes up who knows.

 

[Young Lions*]

May as well insert this here. Was going to be a new thread but now you made this one.

The Survivor Guilt of Ryan Nugent Hopkins?;

Now I'm speaking of this figuratively, of course, and being cast out of the Oilers could hardly be considered a traumatic concept for most, but for Hall he, by his own statements felt badly about the trade, felt slighted, and that there was no other way for him to take this. Hall wanted to win here, of that there is no doubt.

Hopkins as we know was drafted by the Oilers instead of Larsson who was drafted 4th in same draft year.

FF to this year and Nuge, through his own on ice regression, and not matching contractual worth of his 6M contract, is not even in the ballpark in trade value for Larsson. Shero won't even consider any less than Hall in trade.

So that Nuge see's Hall, who he full well knows has been the leader of this team the entire time Nuge has been playing here, traded instead due to Nuge not progressing commensurately with Larsson.

Not only was Hall a leader on the ice, the whole rat pack here Centered around him. Following him around like brothers. Benefitting from his talent, presence, confidence, and verve.

So Nuge, due to his own relative futility (as compared to Hall) stands by and watches Hall take the trade bullet instead and have his dream of winning with the Oilers ended while Nuge, through lesser development, gets to stay and again knowing full well that his mere presence here is due to how little his contract and trade value is.

Now these are professional players but I can't help but think the Hall trade, and Nuge knowing why he avoided the bullet(ordinary season), that it won't exactly help his self confidence, feeling of integration here, and what his value is.

McLellans proclamations notwithstanding there wasn't much to recommend of Nuges play in this season. I wonder how long before he's either 3rd lined or his contract is seen as negligible value here.

I don't see the Hall trade much helping Nuge. I wonder if Nuge even continues to relate to the team the same way and that if pro hockey wonderland is over for him. Really I think he's been a kid with a 6M contract that has been content to bask in that.

Honestly, this keyboard psychologist stuff is embarrassing as hell. You don't know these guys, what they think, or how they react.

 

[TFHockey]

According to some people I've talked to (take that for what it's worth) it's Eberle who was the pack leader, not Hall. If Eberle wanted to do something Hall and RNH were immediately on board.

I have to respectfully disagree with the RNH detractors. There has been a fair bit of analysis done comparing the Oilers with RNH in the line up vs. without. The underlying numbers are pretty clear they're a much better team with Nuge handling the heavy minutes.

If RNH "only" gets 60 points but faces the toughest competition and shelters McDavid I can only see this benefiting the team in the standings.

Just my two cents.

 

[McDraekke]

May as well insert this here. Was going to be a new thread but now you made this one.

The Survivor Guilt of Ryan Nugent Hopkins?;




Now I'm speaking of this figuratively, of course, and being cast out of the Oilers could hardly be considered a traumatic concept for most, but for Hall he, by his own statements felt badly about the trade, felt slighted, and that there was no other way for him to take this. Hall wanted to win here, of that there is no doubt.


Hopkins as we know was drafted by the Oilers instead of Larsson who was drafted 4th in same draft year.

FF to this year and Nuge, through his own on ice regression, and not matching contractual worth of his 6M contract, is not even in the ballpark in trade value for Larsson. Shero won't even consider any less than Hall in trade.

So that Nuge see's Hall, who he full well knows has been the leader of this team the entire time Nuge has been playing here, traded instead due to Nuge not progressing commensurately with Larsson.

Not only was Hall a leader on the ice, the whole rat pack here Centered around him. Following him around like brothers. Benefitting from his talent, presence, confidence, and verve.

So Nuge, due to his own relative futility (as compared to Hall) stands by and watches Hall take the trade bullet instead and have his dream of winning with the Oilers ended while Nuge, through lesser development, gets to stay and again knowing full well that his mere presence here is due to how little his contract and trade value is.

Now these are professional players but I can't help but think the Hall trade, and Nuge knowing why he avoided the bullet(ordinary season), that it won't exactly help his self confidence, feeling of integration here, and what his value is.

McLellans proclamations notwithstanding there wasn't much to recommend of Nuges play in this season. I wonder how long before he's either 3rd lined or his contract is seen as negligible value here.

I don't see the Hall trade much helping Nuge. I wonder if Nuge even continues to relate to the team the same way and that if pro hockey wonderland is over for him. Really I think he's been a kid with a 6M contract that has been content to bask in that.

The problem with your theory, is that this has likely happened a lot (as in every team, ever) in pro sports, where the person who is ultimately not keeping up with his contract or role is not moved due to low value as compared to other teammates who could bring in more of a return. Unless you believe this relates to all other players in the same scenario, it's just a story made up by you to suggest RNH has low self-confidence. And if you do think this applies to every player who has been in the same scenario, then did they all continually spiral into nothing because their self-esteem took a hit?

 

[Replacement*]

Perhaps that was the problem. A group of kids alienating themselves from the rest of the team because of this "rat pack" mentality with Hall being the leader of that group. I think it will actually benefit RNH to branch of on his own and not have to differ to Hall on the ice or in any leadership aspect. To be quite frank, I think he looked better away from Hall the last couple of seasons than with although a very small sample size last season with Hall.

I don't discount the ratpack group being that I referenced it. But I have less issue, and hold more worth, for leaders than the followers.

That we've extricated the leader, and best player, and kept the two followers is the strangest thing. I'm content with Eberle because he scores goals. I'm still caught wondering what Nuge does well. Certainly not preventing GA.

 

[Ol' Jase]

Honestly, this keyboard psychologist stuff is embarrassing as hell. You don't know these guys, what they think, or how they react.

Embarrassing doesn't really quite cover it.

 

[Young Lions*]

I think Nuge is overrated as hell by some (70 points? lol), but I'll stick up for him for the same reasons I'll stick up for Hall. Here's a kid who was thrown to the wolves from the get go on a terrible team, who had to deal with some injuries early on and who just never got on track. Despite that, he's shown enough that if he's out #2C going forward, we're in good shape.

 

[Aerchon]

Great topic and worthy of its own thread.

First off RNH is currently our number one center. Ice time, quality of competition, and experience. Even his PPG is relative to a low end #1 despite people moaning that he does not produce enough offense.

I personally hope Maroon stays with McDavid and Lucic goes to Nuge. Since he will most likely still be doing the heavy lifting. Pouliot is ok as well but I think Lucic would create more space for RNH.

I personally think RNH has a full nother gear we have not seen yet. More offense certainly but just overall he has more. He is young and I think most people agree that stylistically he needs more time than most to reach his potential. I don't expect to see the full Nuge till he is 27ish.

Moving forward RNH will be used less as Leon and McDavid take tougher minutes. But I really don't see that happening for a couple years. As it does I imagine Nuge will reap some nice benefits as his quality of competition lowers.

I personally never see Nuge getting on average less than 17 minutes a night and solid PP time as well in his career as an Oiler. Just can't see it.

He is our #1, I think he will get even better, and at worst he will be our #2.

Leon has shown well on the wing and will need time to build up experience against top quality of competition. He could take Nuges spot but I just don't see that really happening for a long time if ever.

I would make the lines as follows to balance experience and effectiveness.

Lucic RNH Puli
Maroon McDavid Ebs
Pouliot Leon Kassian (maybe Yak if very sheltered minutes and on the team)
Hend Lets Paka

Give Leon some sheltered minutes.

Give McDavid his old linemates.

Get Nuge some space and size to take on the leagues best.

 

[Replacement*]

The problem with your theory, is that this has likely happened a lot (as in every team, ever) in pro sports, where the person who is ultimately not keeping up with his contract or role is not moved due to low value as compared to other teammates who could bring in more of a return. Unless you believe this relates to all other players in the same scenario, it's just a story made up by you to suggest RNH has low self-confidence. And if you do think this applies to every player who has been in the same scenario, then did they all continually spiral into nothing because their self-esteem took a hit?

It hasn't happened a lot because very few, if any, NHL teams have multiple #1 draft picks. Very few NHL teams have had so many concurrent high picks. A lot of teams will have maybe a couple. Very few have 3-4, or several, that get into the league same time. Schultz was also part of the pack.

But I do continue to think this impacts Nuge. I think his place on the team was defined at least partly, or a lot, on a Hall, Eberle, Nuge, Schultz sphere. A lot of you think Nuge will easily survive losing that. I don't. I think Nuge is still very much a kid in mind and attitude. With 6M cheques rolling in. He's a guy with a Richie Rich grin whether he's scoring, playing poorly, or anything. Contractually sated at best.

This is a pro player that 6yrs into his pro career is still offseason training with his brother. Who's made not one appreciable change in his physical stature to better suit and accomodate his role as an NHL WC center.

I guess I can be happy and content thinking it might happen sometime.

 

[Replacement*]

Honestly, this keyboard psychologist stuff is embarrassing as hell. You don't know these guys, what they think, or how they react.

It was stated in figurative terms, figuratively, which is why I prefaced with that. Perhaps you missed that

Hey, some of us are in the working world. Some of us work clinically. We're also in the real world. If an employee gets fired in a business and others realize that worker was a better performer survivor guilt is real and a natural reaction. Its invariably even an automatic reaction. Anybody but a sociopath would probably feel it on some level. Its the first thought that occurs to honest, aware, people. "Should've been me.." Its so common a reaction its considered a dynamic reaction.

 

[Roof Daddy]

Perhaps that was the problem. A group of kids alienating themselves from the rest of the team because of this "rat pack" mentality with Hall being the leader of that group. I think it will actually benefit RNH to branch of on his own and not have to differ to Hall on the ice or in any leadership aspect. To be quite frank, I think he looked better away from Hall the last couple of seasons than with although a very small sample size last season with Hall.

Agreed. I think back to Andrew Ference's first impression of the Oilers dressing room, where he said that he'd never seen such a divided locker room, so many cliques, no team/family concept, just a bunch of individuals. He also mentioned a lot of guys were more concerned with what was going on after practice than at practice.

Then you fast forward another season and Ference voices his frustration with the locker room again, saying certain players get too negative and mope around when things aren't going right, that guys should be happy they are in the NHL. The following day Hall posts a sarcastic tweet, "another beautiful day in Winnipeg, just happy to be in the NHL."

I think Yak was definitely on the outside looking in when dealing with the young guns clique. It was apparent when watching the Oilers TV "how well do you know your teammate" special, where Hall, Ebs, Nuge and Schultz were clearly buddies, but none of them knew a single thing about Yak.

In terms of Nuge, he was the quiet guy compared to Hall and Ebs when it comes to life away from the rink. He'll survive fine without "the leader of the pack," it's Eberle that I'm curious about.

As far as Replacement's comments actually holding Hall's locker room presence in high regard (something I completely disagree with), Lucic brings much more accountability, experience and team concept than Hall could ever dream of. So even if you consider Hall to have a positive influence, you'd have to agree that Lucic brings an even larger presence.

 

[Halibut]

The only reason there is a question about RNH is because we arent sure about Draisaitl yet. If the big German is capable of producing at center without Hall then he becomes the #2 and RNH is a third wheel or third line center whichever you prefer. Once Drai and McDavid are on their next contracts $6 million on a third line center is probably something we cant afford. Maybe we move Drai to the wing but that just changes the expendable piece from RNH to Eberle and we have to see how well Drai produces on the wing.

In any case RNH is not a #3 center and he's never played wing so if Drai becomes the #2 it's pretty clear we will be moving RNH sooner or later.

 

[CupofOil]

I think Nuge is still very much a kid in mind and attitude. With 6M cheques rolling in. He's a guy with a Richie Rich grin whether he's scoring, playing poorly, or anything. Contractually sated at best.

That's weird because I think Nuge has carried himself as much more mature on and off the ice (at least based on what we see of them) than the other two.

 

[Ol' Jase]

That's weird because I think Nuge has carried himself as much more mature on and off the ice (at least based on what we see of them) than the other two.

That's very obvious to most people, yes.

It's also well known that Nuge isn't the regular bar/night club patron around town as some other Oilers are very famous for in those circles.

 

[McDraekke]

It hasn't happened a lot because very few, if any, NHL teams have multiple #1 draft picks. Very few NHL teams have had so many concurrent high picks. A lot of teams will have maybe a couple. Very few have 3-4, or several, that get into the league same time. Schultz was also part of the pack.

But I do continue to think this impacts Nuge. I think his place on the team was defined at least partly, or a lot, on a Hall, Eberle, Nuge, Schultz sphere. A lot of you think Nuge will easily survive losing that. I don't. I think Nuge is still very much a kid in mind and attitude. With 6M cheques rolling in. He's a guy with a Richie Rich grin whether he's scoring, playing poorly, or anything. Contractually sated at best.

This is a pro player that 6yrs into his pro career is still offseason training with his brother. Who's made not one appreciable change in his physical stature to better suit and accomodate his role as an NHL WC center.

I guess I can be happy and content thinking it might happen sometime.

Yes, because A, B, C, D, E and F, RNH is different from all of the other players who have gone through the same scenario, then ya only him and a couple others. But you can't really drill down that many times or else you can always choose the right stats and scenario to fit your dialogue. This is how people manipulate stats, by saying: RNH is the highest scoring 23 year old who has played 6 seasons and been injured X games and only has played with Taylor Hall 65% of the time. Take away those factors one at a time and it allows more individuals in that grouping, moving RNH lower and lower in the group.