Prospect Info: Round 2, Pick 34: Bobby Brink, RW, Sioux City (USHL) --> Denver (signed 4/10/22)

[deadhead]

Are you saying you think Brink has average offensive skills? Average compared to what? Physical skills like hard shot and stick handling or mental like vision and iq.

I was responding to Ted's assertation that his off puck skills were enough to make him valuable, i.e., good enough to make him a NHL player if he had only average offensive skills.

QUOTE="VladDrag, post: 163661221, member: 298321"]He just does a lot of very good things for his hockey club. He's such an effective player, and he's tenacious. He is a guy that adds value to your lineup even if he's not relied on to be a primary goal scorer. .

Brink is one of those players who is useful because of his tenacity/compete level. If he isn’t scoring, he impacts the game in other ways: winning battles, cycling the puck, creating space for himself & his teammates with his deception, forechecking, and through his back-checking.

The idea that he’ll be a liability if he isn’t scoring or that he’s a “one zone player” has a whiff of: “I’ve only seen him play a few times and I’m basing my critiques/player projections off of this limited sample size.”

My point was that his tenacity/compete level is insufficient to overcome his lack of size combined with average skating and offensive skills.

That is, if he wasn't an excellent playmaker with an exceptional shot and high hockey IQ, he'd have zero chance of being a NHL player.

And I'm still waiting for the counter-example, a player his size with average skating and offensive skills who IS a NHL player.

 

[TB87]

Are you saying you think Brink has average offensive skills? Average compared to what? Physical skills like hard shot and stick handling or mental like vision and iq.

Flaws list: Skating stride, power generation, & puck control when he gets moving fast

Everything else in his toolkit is very, very good.

 

[wasup]

Flaws list: Skating stride, power generation, & puck control when he gets moving fast

Everything else in his toolkit is very, very good.

Yup i agree with this . When dead talks about gaining weight to help him improve i question it cause players have an optimum playing weight . Gaining pounds for strength causes your stride to chug and limits your agility . If his optimum playing weight is 165 - 170 lbs , so be it he will have to adapt , but just gaining weight will not work .

 

[deadhead]

Actually, I look at it very differently from "gaining weight to help him improve."
Part of scouting is projecting a player's physical development from 18 to 22 or so, the years when kids fill out into their adult bodies.
So my point isn't that he should gain weight, he will, but how much and how will it determine the kind of player he'll become.

Some players fill out and get faster as they add lower body strength.
Some players fill out and get bigger but slower as they add mass at a faster rate than the strength to propel it.

How big a player ends up matters because it determines what he can and can't do and the style of play that will be effective.

Giroux is a "space" player b/c he's not big enough to muck with the big boys like Couts (not necessarily hitting, but riding an opposing player on defense, establishing position near the net on offense, JVR isn't a physical player, but he's hard to move when he parks that big butt near the net). Space players need quickness and agility to make room to operate.

Brink, even if he fills out to 5'9 180, is going to be limited, he can find soft spots near the net but he can't park there, so he has to anticipate the opportunities and have a center on the same page who can get him the puck before the defense closes on him. But if he's quick and agile and smart, he can make plays in crowds and use a quick release to get shots off among the trees.

 

[TB87]

Yup i agree with this . When dead talks about gaining weight to help him improve i question it cause players have an optimum playing weight . Gaining pounds for strength causes your stride to chug and limits your agility . If his optimum playing weight is 165 - 170 lbs , so be it he will have to adapt , but just gaining weight will not work .

It’s not like he routinely gets pushed around in 50/50 battles either. He comes away with the puck pretty consistently. Once the skating & puck control comes around (hopefully both do in due time), he “should” be a menace to play against.

 

[NYCFlyer]

Flaws list: Skating stride, power generation, & puck control when he gets moving fast

Everything else in his toolkit is very, very good.

Those are all improvable. The kid doesn't even have peach fuzz let alone shave yet.

 

[deadhead]

It’s not like he routinely gets pushed around in 50/50 battles either. He comes away with the puck pretty consistently. Once the skating & puck control comes around (hopefully both do in due time), he “should” be a menace to play against.

Let's see how that works out in college, right now he's playing against 18-19 year olds, this fall he'll be playing a lot of guys who are far bigger and stronger.

 

[Adtar02]

I was responding to Ted's assertation that his off puck skills were enough to make him valuable, i.e., good enough to make him a NHL player if he had only average offensive skills.



My point was that his tenacity/compete level is insufficient to overcome his lack of size combined with average skating and offensive skills.

That is, if he wasn't an excellent playmaker with an exceptional shot and high hockey IQ, he'd have zero chance of being a NHL player.

And I'm still waiting for the counter-example, a player his size with average skating and offensive skills who IS a NHL player.

So you’re asking for an example of a player that doesn’t match brinks skill set.

 

[deadhead]

So you’re asking for an example of a player that doesn’t match brinks skill set.

I am asking for a player that fits Ted Brown's "he doesn't need offensive skills to be valuable" paradigm.
I don't care how tenacious he is, without size and straight line speed he's got no future without those exceptional offensive skills.

You'll figure it out, go back and read the conversation again.

 

[VladDrag]

Yup i agree with this . When dead talks about gaining weight to help him improve i question it cause players have an optimum playing weight . Gaining pounds for strength causes your stride to chug and limits your agility . If his optimum playing weight is 165 - 170 lbs , so be it he will have to adapt , but just gaining weight will not work .

No, it does not limit agility. Seriously, this is the equivalent of hockey guy talk of strength and conditioning.

 

[deadhead]

No, it does not limit agility. Seriously, this is the equivalent of hockey guy talk of strength and conditioning.

Depends how you put on the weight.
Too much weight lifting can make you stiff and cause you to lose agility.
And it depends where you put the weight on, and how you put it on.

Which is why a lot of modern training is holistic, strength/endurance/flexibility, trying to maintain a balance.
But that also limits how much a player will bulk up - Wasup is right in that each player has an optimal weight determined by his genetics.

 

[wasup]

No, it does not limit agility. Seriously, this is the equivalent of hockey guy talk of strength and conditioning.

It 100 percent does . About 6-7 years ago i went to some Brandon wheat kings games earlier in the year and i saw a bunch of their players chugging real bad . It took till half way thru the season for this to change back to their regular stride . I am talking upper body bulk and the summer training facilities i deal with talk of this all the time . There is very little weight training done any more it is all bands and resistance strength training and this goes right thru to teams as well . Yogo has become a huge part of training now as will they are trying to stretch and elongate the muscles and it is to help with some muscle injury prevention .

Was told by top end trainers that a hockey player is not meant to be jacked upstairs , jacked just slows you down limits your agility and carrying weight above your belly button affects your center of gravity . They said players that come to jacked they will take those pounds off them before they leave for the fall .

Hockey is way different now than 10 years ago , they are concentrating speed and quickness and dynamics , the rules in hockey are changing too to allow the small skilled player back in the game .

 

[Ghosts Beer]

It 100 percent does . About 6-7 years ago i went to some Brandon wheat kings games earlier in the year and i saw a bunch of their players chugging real bad . It took till half way thru the season for this to change back to their regular stride . I am talking upper body bulk and the summer training facilities i deal with talk of this all the time . There is very little weight training done any more it is all bands and resistance strength training and this goes right thru to teams as well . Yogo has become a huge part of training now as will they are trying to stretch and elongate the muscles and it is to help with some muscle injury prevention .

Was told by top end trainers that a hockey player is not meant to be jacked upstairs , jacked just slows you down limits your agility and carrying weight above your belly button affects your center of gravity . They said players that come to jacked they will take those pounds off them before they leave for the fall .

Hockey is way different now than 10 years ago , they are concentrating speed and quickness and dynamics , the rules in hockey are changing too to allow the small skilled player back in the game .

I’m not a personal trainer, but I’ve always held this opinion when it comes to hockey. I would hate to hear that a player “packed on __ pounds of muscle” during the offseason. Inevitably it meant he muscled up his upper body, & got slower carrying weight that doesn’t help in hockey & probably left him more susceptible to muscle pulls.

 

[GapToothedWonder]

It 100 percent does . About 6-7 years ago i went to some Brandon wheat kings games earlier in the year and i saw a bunch of their players chugging real bad . It took till half way thru the season for this to change back to their regular stride . I am talking upper body bulk and the summer training facilities i deal with talk of this all the time . There is very little weight training done any more it is all bands and resistance strength training and this goes right thru to teams as well . Yogo has become a huge part of training now as will they are trying to stretch and elongate the muscles and it is to help with some muscle injury prevention .

Was told by top end trainers that a hockey player is not meant to be jacked upstairs , jacked just slows you down limits your agility and carrying weight above your belly button affects your center of gravity . They said players that come to jacked they will take those pounds off them before they leave for the fall .

Hockey is way different now than 10 years ago , they are concentrating speed and quickness and dynamics , the rules in hockey are changing too to allow the small skilled player back in the game .

Gonna go out on a limb and suggest VladDrag was talking about Brink adding strength and explosiveness to his lower body. I don't think he was talking about him bulking up for the sake of bulking up.

 

[VladDrag]

It 100 percent does . About 6-7 years ago i went to some Brandon wheat kings games earlier in the year and i saw a bunch of their players chugging real bad . It took till half way thru the season for this to change back to their regular stride . I am talking upper body bulk and the summer training facilities i deal with talk of this all the time . There is very little weight training done any more it is all bands and resistance strength training and this goes right thru to teams as well . Yogo has become a huge part of training now as will they are trying to stretch and elongate the muscles and it is to help with some muscle injury prevention .

Was told by top end trainers that a hockey player is not meant to be jacked upstairs , jacked just slows you down limits your agility and carrying weight above your belly button affects your center of gravity . They said players that come to jacked they will take those pounds off them before they leave for the fall .

Hockey is way different now than 10 years ago , they are concentrating speed and quickness and dynamics , the rules in hockey are changing too to allow the small skilled player back in the game .

The blanket statement that strength training limits your agility just isn't true. It's improper periodization that limits any specific area of athletic performance. If your program does not properly address agility, then you'll lack in agility. This is true of strength, power, flexibility and mobility, etc.

Have you seen the physiques of NFL running backs? Build like brick sh** houses, and some of the strongest and most agile athletes in the world. Darren Sproles squats more than 400 lbs (I know this is just an example, and it's a different sport, but still illustrates my point). If you're program only focuses on strength, of course you won't have agility, but that's not specifically because you've gotten stronger. It's because you've failed to adequately program for agility.

But you are right; hockey-specific training is not geared for large improvements in overall strength. This is not because improvements in strength will not be beneficial to hockey (it most certainly would be), but rather, this is because improvements in other areas of athletic performance (agility and mobility for example) are more important to the hockey athlete.

I can go longer if you want me to, as training is one of my more favorite topic to discuss, but I think I've made my point.

 

[wasup]

The blanket statement that strength training limits your agility just isn't true. It's improper periodization that limits any specific area of athletic performance. If your program does not properly address agility, then you'll lack in agility. This is true of strength, power, flexibility and mobility, etc.

Have you seen the physiques of NFL running backs? Build like brick sh** houses, and some of the strongest and most agile athletes in the world. Darren Sproles squats more than 400 lbs (I know this is just an example, and it's a different sport, but still illustrates my point). If you're program only focuses on strength, of course you won't have agility, but that's not specifically because you've gotten stronger. It's because you've failed to adequately program for agility.

But you are right; hockey-specific training is not geared for large improvements in overall strength. This is not because improvements in strength will not be beneficial to hockey (it most certainly would be), but rather, this is because improvements in other areas of athletic performance (agility and mobility for example) are more important to the hockey athlete.

I can go longer if you want me to, as training is one of my more favorite topic to discuss, but I think I've made my point.

Yup you are bang on on this . I though you were talking like it would help Brink to play at 5'9" 180 vs say 170 or so . But your statements meant ,you know what you are talking about . It is something that i have had long long talks with younger players about and some just don't get it . i have had goalies go on weight training programs over the years and that just totally wrecks them . omg

 

[gertbfrobe16]

The blanket statement that strength training limits your agility just isn't true. It's improper periodization that limits any specific area of athletic performance. If your program does not properly address agility, then you'll lack in agility. This is true of strength, power, flexibility and mobility, etc.

Have you seen the physiques of NFL running backs? Build like brick sh** houses, and some of the strongest and most agile athletes in the world. Darren Sproles squats more than 400 lbs (I know this is just an example, and it's a different sport, but still illustrates my point). If you're program only focuses on strength, of course you won't have agility, but that's not specifically because you've gotten stronger. It's because you've failed to adequately program for agility.

But you are right; hockey-specific training is not geared for large improvements in overall strength. This is not because improvements in strength will not be beneficial to hockey (it most certainly would be), but rather, this is because improvements in other areas of athletic performance (agility and mobility for example) are more important to the hockey athlete.

I can go longer if you want me to, as training is one of my more favorite topic to discuss, but I think I've made my point.

i agree with you, rod the bod is a good example. he played football in his youth and saw the benefit of strength training as well as agility training. being fast and flexable is good, but being strong and quick may be as important, if not more so depending on what position you play.

 

[Appleyard]

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

For anyone that has Disney+, Brink is available for streaming.

 

[Magua]

 

[Foggy14]

If you have a subscription to The Athletic, Charlie O has a good article on Bobby Brink's transition to the college game, his skating development and prospects to play for Team USA at the upcoming WJC.

There are a number of quotes in the article from Brink's head coach at Denver University, David Carle (Matt's younger brother) who's very positive on Bobby's development at the college level.

Flyers prospect Bobby Brink makes the adjustments, shows 'a...

 

[Ghosts Beer]

If you have a subsection to The Athletic, Charlie O has a good article on Bobby Brink's transition to the college game, his skating development and prospects to play for Team USA at the upcoming WJC.

There are a number of quotes in the article from Brink's head coach at Denver University, David Carle (Matt's younger brother) who's very positive on Bobby's development at the college level.

Flyers prospect Bobby Brink makes the adjustments, shows 'a...

Good stuff. Very happy to hear his skating is much improved. Seems to be smart, motivated, & a hard worker. Should keep improving with that work ethic & increased physical maturity & strength.

 

[deadhead]

There's never been any question about Brink's offense, when he hits the pro game he'll probably be more NHL ready in that regard than Frost or Farabee.
The only question with him was his skating and his physical development - if that's coming on, then he's probably got a starting spot waiting for him in two years.

 

[Curufinwe]

I subscribed a year ago at $30 to celebrate Hak's firing. Then last week I bought myself a gift sub at $40, that comes with a free t-shirt.

 

[Stizzle]

Season highlights.