Roster Speculation 2015-16 Part IV

[mikemcburn]

Ennis and Moulson will be so damn good on our third line

Yep, with a 4th of Foligno & Gionta

Kane - Eichel - ??
Larsson - Reinhart - Girgensens
Moulson - ?? - Ennis
Foligno - ?? - Gionta

Good times.

 

[CarlWinslow]

Larsson is key. If nothing else, he's not a plodder. This team has Reinhart, Hodgson and Moulson who should be kept away from each other because they are all pretty slow. They need speed around them in the top 3 lines to make up for it.

I also am in the Larsson is actually good camp.

 

[stokes84]

Because points

Yeah, they actually do matter, contrary to the way some people think.

 

[Jame]

Yeah, they actually do matter, contrary to the way some people think.

yes, points matter.... but that's not what this is about

These arguments always work there way back to the same issue. You have trouble recognizing the wider array of skills and talent that lead to points. The finer points of the game... escape you.

That's why you failed to see a Ryan Oreilly playing a 3rd line role with Winnik, Tucket, Yip, and Mcleod and only scoring 26 points as a legit top line player in the future. If you weren't such a fan boy, i bet you'd take back your foolish comments in the Ennis for Oreilly trade proposal threads.

I wouldn't do Ennis for O'Reilly straight up.

That's why you failed to see Sekera as a top pairing 2 way defensemen, even though all the advanced metrics said otherwise, but he was in a strict defensive role, deployed in heavy d zone starts and with guys like Regehr and Weber. Yet, once his role/linemates/usage changed... he exploded with top 10 defensive scoring, and became the hottest commodity on the trade market.

You consistently fail in this manner because you only look at points produced, and can't see the underlying skills that lead to points.

the fun part of these failures is that you dig in.

Ask stokes if Sekera is a top pairing defensemen... nope
Ask stokes if Oreilly is better than Ennis... nope

He cant project their talent, but even when they reach those projections he stubbornly buries his head in the sand.

 

[krt88]

What do the Sabres do if....

Let's say Grigorenko has an average preseason and training camp, a definite possibility. What does the team do with him? Keeping him on the roster with a minor role seems like a waste but Rochester means exposing him to waivers and someone might grab him for free.

Guess we are realy paying for Darrcy's poor decision making with how to develop this kids. We wasted two full years of development and I have a feeling it won't work out in the long run.

 

[Sabretip]

Pretty easy to predict how this will unfold, based on 3 simple facts:

1) In 2 weeks, the Sabres will have 4 young, more talented and versatile centers on the roster (Eichel, Reinhart, Girgensons, Larsson) that fit Murray's preferred style of player - and a 5th center (McCormick) who Murray committed to long-term for leadership.

2) Grigorenko is no longer waiver-exempt and can't play in Rochester.

3) Murray is looking to make trades to improve the roster. Grigorenko is a young asset not far removed from a 12th overall draft ranking.


I don't expect Grigorenko to be in the organization by September.

 

[Husko]

Let's say Grigorenko has an average preseason and training camp, a definite possibility. What does the team do with him? Keeping him on the roster with a minor role seems like a waste but Rochester means exposing him to waivers and someone might grab him for free.

Guess we are realy paying for Darrcy's poor decision making with how to develop this kids. We wasted two full years of development and I have a feeling it won't work out in the long run.

Baring he's not traded, pretty simple:

If he wins a spot, he starts.

If not, he's a healthy scratch until someone gets hurt

 

[Sabretip]

Yep, with a 4th of Foligno & Gionta

Kane - Eichel - ??
Larsson - Reinhart - Girgensens
Moulson - ?? - Ennis
Foligno - ?? - Gionta

Good times.

If no outside additions are made (unlikely):

Kane - Eichel - Girgensons
Moulson - Reinhart - Ennis
Foligno - Larsson - Gionta
Deslauriers - McCormick - Kaleta

With trades/signings (hopeful):

Kane - Eichel - O'Reilly
Moulson - Reinhart - Ennis
Girgensons - Larsson - Gionta
Deslauriers - McCormick - Chiasson

Great times

 

[Old Navy Goat]

Or you just expose him to waivers knowing that whatever team that picks him up has to have him on the NHL roster, if they try to demote him then the Sabres have to choice to reacquire and automatically put him in Rochester.

There will be plenty of players hitting the waiver wire at the end of camp that are out of options and aren't quite ready for full time NHL action. You also have to remember that he'll be qualified so his cap hit will cost quite a bit and its debatable how many teams will have cap space for question marks.

 

[Myllz]

He plays on the wing somewhere or is traded.

 

[mikemcburn]

Hmm.....

If no outside additions are made (unlikely):

Kane - Eichel - Girgensons
Moulson - Reinhart - Ennis
Foligno - Larsson - Gionta
Deslauriers - McCormick - Kaleta

Not bad. But... on the premise that there aren't any additions, then you can't subtract Grigorenko (I'd argue Hodgson too, but in case he's truly bought out, let's skip him here).... I don't get where Girgorenko fits, but it's gotta be in the top 9 (or why else is he around?), which bumps one of Foligno-Larsson-Gionta down...

Otherwise the only question mark I'd put out there is why Reinhart, why oh why is it poor Reinhart who gets saddled with one gigantic defensive lazy butt on the left and one energic heart-on-sleeve defensive liability on the right? I'd do some swaps in the top 6 to even out the match-ups (and provide Reinhart with someone actually willing and able to have his back).

Kane - Eichel - Ennis
Moulson - Reinhart - Girgensens

With trades/signings (hopeful):

Kane - Eichel - O'Reilly
Moulson - Reinhart - Ennis
Girgensons - Larsson - Gionta
Deslauriers - McCormick - Chiasson

Great times

I know nuttin about Chiasson, but whatever. Still the same quirk trying to plug poor Reinhart in to account for both defensive issues on his wings. Also, not seeing Girgensens fall down onto the 3rd in favour of either Moulson or Ennis.

Ennis is cool, don't get me wrong, but he ain't no defensive rock star and despite his heart he won't be giving rookie Reinhart any protection/physical offset either. Moulson is probably the weakest link though as he's nothing more than an older and rapidly declining version of all that's negative in Hodgson and with none of Hodgson's play making vision. So, I'd again flip things around...

Kane - Eichel - O'Reilly (good luck with that happening, btw)
Girgensens - Reinhart - Ennis
Moulson - Larsson - Gionta

The moment Moulson and Gionta are out of even the thinking when making up the top 6 lines it equals AWESOME times!

 

[Husko]

Or you just expose him to waivers knowing that whatever team that picks him up has to have him on the NHL roster, if they try to demote him then the Sabres have to choice to reacquire and automatically put him in Rochester.

There will be plenty of players hitting the waiver wire at the end of camp that are out of options and aren't quite ready for full time NHL action. You also have to remember that he'll be qualified so his cap hit will cost quite a bit and its debatable how many teams will have cap space for question marks.

He would get claimed. Probably by Arizona or Toronto. 100% no doubt about it

 

[Jame]

What's the issue with him playing on the 4th line? Oh right, there is none.

Next

 

[dotcommunism]

Or you just expose him to waivers knowing that whatever team that picks him up has to have him on the NHL roster, if they try to demote him then the Sabres have to choice to reacquire and automatically put him in Rochester.

There will be plenty of players hitting the waiver wire at the end of camp that are out of options and aren't quite ready for full time NHL action. You also have to remember that he'll be qualified so his cap hit will cost quite a bit and its debatable how many teams will have cap space for question marks.

Only if Buffalo is the only team to put in a claim when he hypothetically gets waived by the team that claimed him from Buffalo.

 

[JonathanWashington]

it was pretty exciting, last night i had a dream that he scored a hat trick.

 

[Old Navy Goat]

Only if Buffalo is the only team to put in a claim when he hypothetically gets waived by the team that claimed him from Buffalo.

If you qualify him and then try to sneak him through waivers as a 21yo, then the odds are that you'd reacquire him if the claiming team tries to dump him, pending of course if you see that another year would accelerate his growth.

 

[Bps21*]

If he's here he just plays until he either makes it or...doesn't. We aren't a playoff team this year. He doesn't cost anything to keep. No long contract or big $. Play him until he shows you he can make it in which case great he can stay or get traded...or until he shows he can't and if you waive him and he's claimed then...who cares? We are in a perfect situation to find out.

 

[Reddawg]

The dump and hope to reacquire scenario worked out pretty poorly for Tampa last year when they waived Richard Panik hoping to sneak him down. That said, there are surprising players who make it through waivers every year...it's a roll of the dice and a lot of timing and luck.

There's no reason why Buffalo couldn't start Reinhart out in the AHL and keep Grigorenko up on the third line either as a winger or a center...give him a shot with decent wingers to see what he can do with the ice time.

 

[RoofIt5hole]

If he's not traded in a package for ROR or a top line RW like Kessel, JVR, etc, I'd see no problem sticking Grigs on the 4th line and letting him grow. Maybe even try him at RW. No need to rush him just because we can't put him back in Roch.

 

[CaptPantalones]

He's traded draft day

 

[BananaSquad]

What's the issue with him playing on the 4th line? Oh right, there is none.

Next

This. Who knows maybe he becomes a great 4th liner for us, Kruger lite lol.

 

[26CornerBlitz]

Let's say Grigorenko has an average preseason and training camp, a definite possibility. What does the team do with him? Keeping him on the roster with a minor role seems like a waste but Rochester means exposing him to waivers and someone might grab him for free.

Guess we are realy paying for Darrcy's poor decision making with how to develop this kids. We wasted two full years of development and I have a feeling it won't work out in the long run.

What if he has a better camp and preseason than Reinhart and Larsson just as it happened before last season? Then what?

 

[Jacob582]

I think Murray will trade him this summer in a package for a goalie and other pieces.

 

[allsilverdreams]

I think with new coaching staff he has the chance to play his game.with that said I think he stays in buffalo and makes it to the trade deadline after that ?????

 

[stokes84]

yes, points matter.... but that's not what this is about

These arguments always work there way back to the same issue. You have trouble recognizing the wider array of skills and talent that lead to points. The finer points of the game... escape you.

That's why you failed to see a Ryan Oreilly playing a 3rd line role with Winnik, Tucket, Yip, and Mcleod and only scoring 26 points as a legit top line player in the future. If you weren't such a fan boy, i bet you'd take back your foolish comments in the Ennis for Oreilly trade proposal threads.




That's why you failed to see Sekera as a top pairing 2 way defensemen, even though all the advanced metrics said otherwise, but he was in a strict defensive role, deployed in heavy d zone starts and with guys like Regehr and Weber. Yet, once his role/linemates/usage changed... he exploded with top 10 defensive scoring, and became the hottest commodity on the trade market.

You consistently fail in this manner because you only look at points produced, and can't see the underlying skills that lead to points.

the fun part of these failures is that you dig in.

Ask stokes if Sekera is a top pairing defensemen... nope
Ask stokes if Oreilly is better than Ennis... nope

He cant project their talent, but even when they reach those projections he stubbornly buries his head in the sand.

Sekera isn't a top pairing defenseman. I think I remember Carolina trying him out that way. Guess what? They were a bottom 5 team.

I'll take 4 years of Tyler Ennis over 1 year of ROR every day of the week.