Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLV

[kovazub94]

I would trade Vesey if we simply stopped saying pool party.

I would trade him for cleaning services after a party.

 

[Ola]

No.

If we were in a situations like Pittsburgh where we had two complete players like Malkin and Crosby already, I would consider a move for a one dimensional scoring threat. But Laine isn't the kind of player you can build a whole team around. No certainty that Kakko is either, but the hope is that he is.

Yeah, great point.

I’ve seen some ‘dream line-ups’ with Panarin and other top offensive players plus our kids. Thing is, unless you have the right balance you won’t get anything out of those top scorers. There are many examples of how delicate that balance is, Colorado when they got Sellanne and Kariya is one example, Russia having dream teams at the WCHs is another. Look at Russia this year, it’s 2-3 guys who can be effective at the same time, no matter if you have Kucherov, Kuznetsov, Malkin, AO and a bunch of guys like that on the same team, only 2-3 can fire on all cylinders at the same time.

It looks so given and like they are doing so much by themselves when they are playing on the same NHL team on the same line year in and year out, like really, couldn’t AO score with just about anyone? It’s a clear no. Not even remotely. He also must get a lot of support. Everyone does.

You must have the proper balance or you will be screwed.

And our younger players like Kakko, Kravtsov, Chytil, Lias, and Buch — must — also get that type of back up to perform. Ziba too. Sure, everyone’s needs are different, it’s not like Lias Andersson would suffer from playing with Panarin. Panarin with Kravtsov? Panarin with Kakko? Panarin with Ziba? It’s not a given that many of these combinations from a line perspective would be too unbalanced and hurt the kids.

 

[Edge]

I feel like the conversations concerning Laine this year really highlight how quickly, and significantly, the context and expectations concerning a player can change.

Not that he still isn't seen as a hell of a talent and one that is coveted. But he's also not quite a top ranking member of this board's sweetheart list either.

 

[17futurecap]

I would trade vesey for a literal pool party

This is the content that keeps me coming back to HFNYR.

 

[Thirty One]

Megan S or Megan A, aka Megan the *****?

Megan Jacobson. She has a cat named Alfred, works in a bank and is a C-cup.

 

[haohmaru]

Megan Jacobson. She has a cat named Alfred, works in a bank and is a C-cup.

And Identifies as a Panthers fan.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Random proposal:

Would you trade Jimmy Vesey straight up for Pool Party?

Yes. I am higher on Vesey than most and lower on Puljujarvi than most and I would make that trade. The risk is absolutely worth the reward. Jimmy Vesey is about the most I would give for Puljujarvi though.

I feel like the conversations concerning Laine this year really highlight how quickly, and significantly, the context and expectations concerning a player can change.

Not that he still isn't seen as a hell of a talent and one that is coveted. But he's also not quite a top ranking member of this board's sweetheart list either.

If Chevy can move Trouba for an elite winger, you then turn around and move Laine for a young, cost controlled defenseman to replace Trouba.

 

[Edge]

Yes. I am higher on Vesey than most and lower on Puljujarvi than most and I would make that trade. The risk is absolutely worth the reward. Jimmy Vesey is about the most I would give for Puljujarvi though.


If Chevy can move Trouba for an elite winger, you then turn around and move Laine for a young, cost controlled defenseman to replace Trouba.

I totally get that. Just interesting to think how the Laine component is viewed in June 2019, as compared to June 2018.

 

[Gardner McKay]

I totally get that. Just interesting to think how the Laine component is viewed in June 2019, as compared to June 2018.

Yeah for sure. This is one of those cases where I wonder if the general perception amongst fans isn't actually that far off from the consensus around the league.

 

[Edge]

Yeah for sure. This is one of those cases where I wonder if the general perception amongst fans isn't actually that far off from the consensus around the league.

I wonder as well.

There's part of me that thinks some of this is easy to pile on with right now because Laine is coming off a disappointing season, arguably his least impressive in three NHL seasons, and because the Jets bombed right out of the playoffs. As such, tensions are high and negativity is going to be more abundant.

There's also part of me that wonders if Laine's perceived personality is starting to contribute to the honeymoon phase of his career coming to an end.

Even before he was drafted, Laine was widely seen as a player with a very distinct, often strong personality. When you're a teenager and one of the best talents in your age group, people give the benefit of the doubt and there's never a shortage of people who will bank on time and maturity as a potential remedy. But in a few years, people do start to change the prism by which they judge a young player.

They're looking at growth, professionally and what they perceive to be on a personal level. Is the player listening, evolving, making the necessary changes? More importantly, is said player a guy you can with it, or is he the type of high-skill player that gets you over the top, but isn't necessarily quite that cornerstone player who you rely on to put the team on his back?

That's when you start questioning the difference between having strong talent and skill with individuals, compared to having that same view as the broader team. Is your team best served with a player you'd rate a 90, or is the best path turning a 90 into a return combo of an 85 and an 80?

Those are the type of questions to keep an eye on over the next year. Winning tends to smooth over most concerns. But another season like last year, and those whispers becomes more audible, and the frequency with which they are heard increases exponentially.

 

[Gardner McKay]

is there a list of vetted posters?

Yeah. The ones that claim insider info that don't get deleted.

 

[Trxjw]

Folks souring on Laine has a lot to do with his pending contract. Being one of the best pure scorers in the NHL is great until the time comes for a big pay day and you need to take a long, hard look at what else he brings to the ice. Then you start throwing in the off ice stuff and the picture isn't quite as pretty.

 

[n8]

Yeah. The ones that claim insider info that don't get deleted.

Well I'll have to do my best to quote every source I see then...

 

[n8]

Folks souring on Laine has a lot to do with his pending contract. Being one of the best pure scorers in the NHL is great until the time comes for a big pay day and you need to take a long, hard look at what else he brings to the ice. Then you start throwing in the off ice stuff and the picture isn't quite as pretty.

McDavid 12.5
Matthews 11.63
Tavares 11
Doughty 11
Price 10.5
Kane 10.5
Toews 10.5
Nylander 10.2
Eichel 10
Kopitar 10
Seguin 9.83
Ovechkin 9.53
Malkin 9.5
Benn 9.5
Stone 9.5
Kucherov 9.5
Subban 9
Crosby 8.7
Perry 8.62
Lundqvist 8.5
Stamkos 8.5
Draisaitl 8.5

Honestly though, how many of these contracts/AAVs are appetizing to you all? For each amazing contract you'd gladly take on, there's a woofer in there. Until a year ago, Lundqvist's contract looked not great but not bad in the "you pay your top goaltender top goaltender money" sort of way.

 

[Lion Hound]

Random proposal:

Would you trade Jimmy Vesey straight up for Pool Party?

Was listening to the NHL station on Sirius today. They were talking about Pool party. Specifically what his "current" value is. They said "maybe" you might get a second rounder, but likely a 3rd.

Vesey likely carries a similar value to that. Im one of Vesey's only remaining fans on this board, However I would do that deal. Maybe they get lucky and pool party just wasn't done cooking yet?

 

[Thirty One]

Was listening to the NHL station on Sirius today. They were talking about Pool party. Specifically what his "current" value is. They said "maybe" you might get a second rounder, but likely a 3rd.

Vesey likely carries a similar value to that. Im one of Vesey's only remaining fans on this board, However I would do that deal. Maybe they get lucky and pool party just wasn't done cooking yet?

If that’s the price for Pulujarvi, I’m paying it.

 

[Lion Hound]

If that’s the price for Pulujarvi, I’m paying it.

Me too...especially with the club having multiple picks in that range.

 

[Trxjw]

I think the Oilers will be able to swap Puljujarvi for another struggling prospect. He hasn't lived up to expectations and the hips are a concern but a 3rd still seems pretty light. If they'd take Vesey for him that's an easy yes.

 

[Edge]

Was listening to the NHL station on Sirius today. They were talking about Pool party. Specifically what his "current" value is. They said "maybe" you might get a second rounder, but likely a 3rd.

Vesey likely carries a similar value to that. Im one of Vesey's only remaining fans on this board, However I would do that deal. Maybe they get lucky and pool party just wasn't done cooking yet?

I’ve never been one of the posters who felt particularly compelled to put together a package for Pool Party, but I’d pick up the phone if the asking price was in that range.

With that said, I tend to think the preference would be a reclamation project or an under-performing player in the same general age range.

I’m still shocked that Pool Party has looked as unimpressive as he has over the past 3 years. Even if doubts started to creep in about his ability prior to the draft, I don’t think many people would’ve predicted this.

 

[Trxjw]

I do think Puljujarvi would do well with a change of scenery and change of expectations. Get out of the fishbowl in Edmonton and on to a team where it's completely acceptable if he's the 4th, 5th, or 6th best player in the top-six forward group. Hope for a guy who can be the F1 on his line, dig out pucks, and chip in 20-25 goals a season. I actually think Kravtsov/Zib/Puljujarvi could be a pretty solid line.

 

[Vinny]

He is a bust, i would not give Vesey.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

I predict if the Blues win the Cup the big Dmen will be back in fashion again.

 

[bobbop]

A question for the group...

Let’s for a moment assume the Rangers do not sign Panarin.

Who do they sign?

They will have quite a bit of salary cap room. Worst case $10-12 MM. best case? Closer to $18MM. They are not simply going quietly into the night. See John Davidson article in the Post tonight.

I don’t have a list. I do have a question which is what does JD think of Matt Duchesne? I’ve never been high on Duchesne but I am not making the decisions. What does JD think? Beyond that, I see a few small signs (e.g. Brian Boyle) that I wouldn’t mind but that’s not going to eat up much of the available $.

Who’s on your shopping list?

 

[Rongomania]

A question for the group...

Let’s for a moment assume the Rangers do not sign Panarin.

Who do they sign?

They will have quite a bit of salary cap room. Worst case $10-12 MM. best case? Closer to $18MM. They are not simply going quietly into the night. See John Davidson article in the Post tonight.

I don’t have a list. I do have a question which is what does JD think of Matt Duchesne? I’ve never been high on Duchesne but I am not making the decisions. What does JD think? Beyond that, I see a few small signs (e.g. Brian Boyle) that I wouldn’t mind but that’s not going to eat up much of the available $.

Who’s on your shopping list?

We don't need Duchene, we just don't.

Outside of Panarin & EK I don't even think anyone too worthy is hitting the market.

J.G. likes his smart trades and he has a great track record. I see us doing a few of those but none of the upcoming FA class seem worthwhile.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

A question for the group...

Let’s for a moment assume the Rangers do not sign Panarin.

Who do they sign?

They will have quite a bit of salary cap room. Worst case $10-12 MM. best case? Closer to $18MM. They are not simply going quietly into the night. See John Davidson article in the Post tonight.

I don’t have a list. I do have a question which is what does JD think of Matt Duchesne? I’ve never been high on Duchesne but I am not making the decisions. What does JD think? Beyond that, I see a few small signs (e.g. Brian Boyle) that I wouldn’t mind but that’s not going to eat up much of the available $.

Who’s on your shopping list?

no idea, depends who we trade away. Duchene is not physical enough for my liking. he is usually on the receiving end of the hits: