Speculation: Roster Building Thread Part XII: The Great Sell-off of 2018

[cheech70]

I'm excited at the prospect of getting some homegrown star players via development.

I'm much less excited that we're unsure what level Hank will be at after a possible 2 years of rebuild.

In planning for the future Hank is a see as you go. If he continues to play at this years level fine he is the starter if not move to the Russian kid.

 

[Kovalev27]

No on waiving smith or buying him out. Don’t like either of those ideas

I’d like to trade him really would but I’d be fine with seeing him back next year in better shape. He really let this team down.

 

[cheech70]

Seeing Porzingas go down brings me back to the trade deadline and making moves. If I were Gorts I would push teams for there best offers asap. It quickens the tank and moves players before any chance of injury's.

 

[NYR Viper]

Yeah, if I was Gorton, I would state to all interested parties, that the Rangers deadline on rentals is prior to the actual deadline. There is no reason to risk Nash, Holden, DD or Grabner getting injured.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Anyone subscribed to the athletic want to give me cliffs on Lebrun's latest article?

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

Unless a team calls about Smith, I keep him and call this year a mulligan. If he can get himself sorted out and return to the guy of last years playoffs, we’ll need guys like him to pair with the younger more offensive D that we have in the pipeline and via trade.

 

[NYR]

Promoting the Wolfpack should get us a lottery pick.

That might just happen depending on how these trades go.
I'm down..

 

[NYRFANMANI]

These propasals the last pages? Necas for example. Lmao, right, CAR is gonna trade their prime prospects.

We like to overvalue our players, we all want the best return possible. But I don't realisticly see a chance in hell we end up with 4 1st round pick.

Let's be honest a late 1st for Grabner would be beyond larsony.

Nash should fetch us a late 1st and a prospect. That the max return imo.

Anything else we got except Zucc and Mac wont fetch us much, and I don't want them gone anyhow.

If we luck out and pick a Brock Boeser in the late 1st, I'm a happy camper.

 

[Roo Returns]

Drafting was not the problem. We had 6 second rounders in 2004 and 2005. Of them, 2 made it. That's 33%. The league average is 20%. All 3 firsts made it, though Montoya was underwhelming for a #8 IS.

The problem was that literally all the prospects we got became busts.

And that's on the scouting from Maloney and Renney's reign. I loved Renney as a coach and the team had some nice success with Maloney as AGM, but there was no reason to pick Korpi that high. Even back then his ceiling was at most a complimentary second liner. Montoya I kind of got because Blackburn was hurt and no one knew Lundqvist would be as good as he is.

 

[Roo Returns]

I'm excited at the prospect of getting some homegrown star players via development.

I'm much less excited that we're unsure what level Hank will be at after a possible 2 years of rebuild.

Every player who plays as long as Lundqvist has goes through it in their career.

 

[Avery16]

No on waiving smith or buying him out. Don’t like either of those ideas

I’d like to trade him really would but I’d be fine with seeing him back next year in better shape. He really let this team down.

It’d be great to trade him but I think the issue is that no one is interested. Hence the waiver or buy-out talk. Being out of shape was the excuse that was raised in pre-season but at game 53 the proof is in the pudding. Smith is just not a great defender, or at best is really inconsistent. Just ask the Detroit board. We should have done our homework scouting him and it appears that we did not.

 

[Avery16]

Unless a team calls about Smith, I keep him and call this year a mulligan. If he can get himself sorted out and return to the guy of last years playoffs, we’ll need guys like him to pair with the younger more offensive D that we have in the pipeline and via trade.

I wouldn’t pair Smith with a rookie. You have to treat Smith like a rookie in his pairings. Personally, I don’t think any of our guys can really cover for him except Staal and McD, and for the latter at the expense of his offensive ability.

 

[Avery16]

They won't buyout Smith. I'm not sure if his modified NTC prevents him from being waived, etc... but they certainly have the money to just bury him in Hartford without taking on those precious cap hits/buyout dollars. Maybe he'll turn it around. Hard to judge with this sad sack team that's been gutted up the middle. Defense starts from there.

He doesn’t have NMC, so shouldn’t be any protection against waivers. The waiver protection he has is his play sucking so bad and his contract so terrible no one will claim

 

[Avery16]

Do you know why Smith was better in the playoffs than he is right now? Two reasons. 1. AV let Smith play the game that Smith wanted to play. AV wasn't worried about his stupid ass system like he is this year. 2. Smith was in much better shape. The former is on the coach. The latter is on the player. I want to see Smith a full year after coming into camp in shape and with a new coach. If next year he is equally as bad with at least one of those two things being fixed then we can say it was a bad signing.

Smith was basically at this level in Detroit also. You might not like AV, but at some point players aren’t good if they can’t play what is a legitimate (if not the best) system. Coaches are harder to replace than third pairing Ds. We are probably stuck with both Smith and AV next season, but if I could only move one it would be Smith. There’s nothing left to be shown with him.

 

[ManUtdTobbe]

Smith was much better then this in Detroit and during last spring, just look at the numbers, they crashed this season.
Give him a mulligan on this season and start fresh next training camp and hope he finds his game... hopefully under a new coach.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Anyone subscribed to the athletic want to give me cliffs on Lebrun's latest article?

RB posted it:

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/posts/141136213/

 

[Lion Hound]

These propasals the last pages? Necas for example. Lmao, right, CAR is gonna trade their prime prospects.

We like to overvalue our players, we all want the best return possible. But I don't realisticly see a chance in hell we end up with 4 1st round pick.

Let's be honest a late 1st for Grabner would be beyond larsony.

Nash should fetch us a late 1st and a prospect. That the max return imo.

Anything else we got except Zucc and Mac wont fetch us much, and I don't want them gone anyhow.

If we luck out and pick a Brock Boeser in the late 1st, I'm a happy camper.

How many players in the league scored 27 goals last year from the 3rd or 4th line? Do it once, and mgmt. around the league will keep an eye out. Do it twice, and you will garner lots of attention. Factor in the ridiculous skating, and the pennies on the dollar contract and you as a GM have a tremendous amount to work with here.

Beyond Larcony? If GMJG doesn't land a late first he fails on this one. To be honest, they shouldn't even move him if that was the case. He produces here in NY and produces really well.

 

[Avery16]

Smith was much better then this in Detroit and during last spring, just look at the numbers, they crashed this season.
Give him a mulligan on this season and start fresh next training camp and hope he finds his game... hopefully under a new coach.

Why settle for rebuild. Should think rebrand also.
The New York Mulligans

 

[NYR Viper]

I'd probably trade Smith for Andrew Shaw if the Habs were interested. I think the Rangers could use a winger at this point more than a defenseman. Shaw has an extra year on his contract but has a smaller cap hit ($3.9m). 19 points in 43 games this season and he is a RH shot. Plays in front of the net on the PP when needed. Even if he plays on the 3rd line I think he would be fine for the next couple of seasons at the very least and provide some energy and edge.

 

[Lays]

We agree on that then. In my opinion, neither was a reach but Chytil was definitely a bit of a surprise pick. Not that I didn't expect him to go that high, I just didn't expect the Rangers to go with that type of player.

It’s funny because HF gave us so much shit for those two picks, I remember a lot saying NYR effed up with their draft
You look back at it now and we had one of the best drafts with later picked guys like Barron, Virta

 

[NYRFANMANI]

Grabner producing is not good for the Tank. Sell definitely, seek a comeback in July maybe.

But a 1st, again is an overpayment for Grabner. I'm talking from another Gm's perspective here.
They should see his production is based on odd-man rushes, his speed (biggest asset) and some luck. Many flucky goals and ENs.
He has the Hagelin jitterbug thing a little. But he a PK-machine.

I guess it actually is ok to ask for 1st at least. Not sure someone is willing to pay it.

Grabs => 1st or 2nd and prospect - would be huge for FA-signing.

 

[TheTakedown]

The Hanzal deal is the Rangers bottomline for Nash. They will retain money.

Some GM's feel Grabner is a better buy than Nash. More cost efficient.

McKenzie mentioned JT Miller as a trade possibility.

The Rangers want young players, picks and prospects.

The Rangers will listen for anyone.

They are using the word REBUILD.

On the italic, it seems to me that the retool was going to go one of two ways:

1) it would keep the team competitive while piling up talent and then the rangers would come out a good team later in the year or beginning of next season
2) the retool would not keep the team competitive and turn into a rebuild.

I remember reading a post on here like a year ago when people were saying how this retool could possibly be a "stealth rebuild", and it looks like they were right. Right now the only move that makes no sense to me is the Girardi buyout coupled with the Smith signing. Not that Girardi is any good but if the Rangers were going to use this year as transition year, then I am not sure why they bought out Girardi and signed smith--unless they saw an upgrade to smith.

Long and short, I think a lot of the quick fixes didn't work:
Andersson couldn't just step into the NHL
McDonagh never got his partner
Smith regressed
Girardi showed no signs of rebounding especially since he was already given a shot to rebound with the "long offseason" the year before (remember all that chatter?)
Skjei hit a major sophomore slump
DeAngelo couldn't play out of the gate (this one is all on AV unfortunately... As if Kampfer was ever actually better than DeAngelo)
Shattenkirk with a long term injury
Kreider with a long term injury
Zibanejad Concussion hampered him

Just about everything that could go wrong for this team, this year, did... The only things that went right were:

Hayes looked good in his "Stepan role"... While he's only playing at a pace for 35 points, he's also had a glob of wingers, no actual chemistry with anyone, and this system is a joke.
DeAngelo has progressed well and is looking like a main stay on the team
AV's system has proven to be awful, and this year there is no excuse for it--the team has actually looked like trash since day one and was carried by a good powerplay--again not that the latter is a bad thing, but this coach has gone so stale, that it's a blessing that this has happened at this point. He should be fired.


I don't know if the plan was ever for this to be a massive rebuild, but I think both missed calculations, the coach losing the team, the long term injuries, and the lack of cohesiveness as a unit constitutes that the Rangers can't just band-aid this team anymore. I don't think starting with the "retool" was a bad idea--on the contrary, starting your season with "blowing it up" is horrible for morale, and we made some moves that theoretically should have had us in the 1st round of the playoffs.

Rebuilds aren't bad though in this day and age--if this is done right, the rangers are average next year but will play like a hungry team. The year after, when Chytil and Andersson make their way through, they'll start to look like a contender. Rangers did good by not pulling these guys in too quickly and not ruining their ELC slides for a wasted season. DeAngelo got some needed experience.

Add in THREE 1st round picks this year along with the two 1st round picks last year, plus a good core of:
Kreider
Shattenkirk
Hayes
Lundqvist

The suck we are seeing right now is going to be well worth it.

 

[NYR Viper]

I would probably settle for:

Nash for 1st '18 + top prospect
- Andrew Ladd-esque deal
Grabner for 2nd '18 + 3rd '18
- Patrick Eaves-esque deal
Holden for 3rd '18
Desharnais for 4th '18

 

[Kaapo di tutti capi]

We don't need three righty defensemen. Take Schmaltz out, I'd prefer someone like Barbashev anyway. I'd probably prefer a second round pick to both.

I thought Fabbro was a lefty - my bad.

 

[EpicDing]

On the italic, it seems to me that the retool was going to go one of two ways:

1) it would keep the team competitive while piling up talent and then the rangers would come out a good team later in the year or beginning of next season
2) the retool would not keep the team competitive and turn into a rebuild.

I remember reading a post on here like a year ago when people were saying how this retool could possibly be a "stealth rebuild", and it looks like they were right. Right now the only move that makes no sense to me is the Girardi buyout coupled with the Smith signing. Not that Girardi is any good but if the Rangers were going to use this year as transition year, then I am not sure why they bought out Girardi and signed smith--unless they saw an upgrade to smith.

Long and short, I think a lot of the quick fixes didn't work:
Andersson couldn't just step into the NHL
McDonagh never got his partner
Smith regressed
Girardi showed no signs of rebounding especially since he was already given a shot to rebound with the "long offseason" the year before (remember all that chatter?)
Skjei hit a major sophomore slump
DeAngelo couldn't play out of the gate (this one is all on AV unfortunately... As if Kampfer was ever actually better than DeAngelo)
Shattenkirk with a long term injury
Kreider with a long term injury
Zibanejad Concussion hampered him

Just about everything that could go wrong for this team, this year, did... The only things that went right were:

Hayes looked good in his "Stepan role"... While he's only playing at a pace for 35 points, he's also had a glob of wingers, no actual chemistry with anyone, and this system is a joke.
DeAngelo has progressed well and is looking like a main stay on the team
AV's system has proven to be awful, and this year there is no excuse for it--the team has actually looked like trash since day one and was carried by a good powerplay--again not that the latter is a bad thing, but this coach has gone so stale, that it's a blessing that this has happened at this point. He should be fired.


I don't know if the plan was ever for this to be a massive rebuild, but I think both missed calculations, the coach losing the team, the long term injuries, and the lack of cohesiveness as a unit constitutes that the Rangers can't just band-aid this team anymore. I don't think starting with the "retool" was a bad idea--on the contrary, starting your season with "blowing it up" is horrible for morale, and we made some moves that theoretically should have had us in the 1st round of the playoffs.

Rebuilds aren't bad though in this day and age--if this is done right, the rangers are average next year but will play like a hungry team. The year after, when Chytil and Andersson make their way through, they'll start to look like a contender. Rangers did good by not pulling these guys in too quickly and not ruining their ELC slides for a wasted season. DeAngelo got some needed experience.

Add in THREE 1st round picks this year along with the two 1st round picks last year, plus a good core of:
Kreider
Shattenkirk
Hayes
Lundqvist

The suck we are seeing right now is going to be well worth it.

Great post. Those 4 guys, Zibanejad plus the kids (Skjei, Buch, ADA) should all stay. Ship everyone else out.