Player Discussion Rickard Rakell

[PCDiesel]

glad mckenzie is dishing out more news than our beat writer. easy money eh stephens

I wish we could get a new beat writer.

 

[bumperkisser]

im a big fan of that move by murray if it works out. 6 years for anything int he 3's would be a great contract

 

[Emerald Duck]

No way Rakell is getting anything close to a 6 year deal or $3.75M per year either. If he's not careful, Murray will allocate some of his money to signing Lindholm and Ricky will be sitting around while Murray tries to move some salary or maybe he'll end up with a bridge deal he doesn't like.

Perhaps his health issue will enable Murray to make a trade while Rakell is still recuperating ? Once Lindholm is signed then he will know exactly how much money he has to work with rather than trying to juggle the two negotiations at the same time.

 

[bumperkisser]

No way Rakell is getting anything close to a 6 year deal or $3.75M per year either. If he's not careful, Murray will allocate some of his money to signing Lindholm and Ricky will be sitting around while Murray tries to move some salary or maybe he'll end up with a bridge deal he doesn't like.

Perhaps his health issue will enable Murray to make a trade while Rakell is still recuperating ? Once Lindholm is signed then he will know exactly how much money he has to work with rather than trying to juggle the two negotiations at the same time.

McKenzie said ducks don't want to bridge

 

[caliamad]

McKenzie said ducks don't want to bridge

That was the best part of the story. I'm glad they want to sign them up long term and trying to get them down to a reasonable AAV.

Even if Rakell goes down to 3.5 and Lindholm 5.4, we don't have the cap space. I wonder how we are going to make it happen.

 

[12ozPapa]

That was the best part of the story. I'm glad they want to sign them up long term and trying to get them down to a reasonable AAV.

Even if Rakell goes down to 3.5 and Lindholm 5.4, we don't have the cap space. I wonder how we are going to make it happen.

You silly goose. We won't. Don't you see? Bob just wants to watch the world burn.

 

[Paul4587]

Not a fan of a 6 year deal for Rakell unless it's awfully cheap. Would far rather a bridge deal as it's going to make being competitive this year a hell of a lot easier.

 

[Nurmagomedov]

Not being interested in a bridge doesn't mean 6 years. 4/12 would be fine.

 

[Emerald Duck]

Both Lindholm and Rakell are playing a real life version of game theory's "Prisoner's Dilemma".

- There's not enough money to meet both player's asking price.

- They could both hold out to force Murray to accept their salary demands, and return home and just wait until it happens;
- Either one of them could suddenly accept close to their offer, making it much more difficult for the Ducks to sign the other one;
- They could both accept Murray's contract offers and then allow him to adjust the roster to fit under the salary cap.

Unfortunately for Rakell, it might not be realistic to expect Murray to easily or quickly "dump" Fowler or Despres during the season unless another team panics or suffers an early season injury in order to fit him under the cap (though moving Thompson to LTIR once the season opens might create a little breathing room for both players).

Will be interesting to see how Murray resolves the impasses.

 

[Opak]

Not being interested in a bridge doesn't mean 6 years. 4/12 would be fine.

Four years is absolutely out of the question, as it takes Rakell (and Lindholm, for that matter) straight to UFA status. It's either going to be a 2-3 year bridge or a long-term deal.

If McKenzie's rumors have truth to them, Ducks are looking into getting them both on a long-term deal.

 

[heffbe]

small update from stephens

Rakell has yet to resume his training after being unable to play for his homeland in the World Cup of Hockey. But it is believed that while the Ducks would prefer to stay lower than Rakell’s six-year, $24 million asking price, they’ve made more headway with the center’s agent, Peter Wallen.

In an e-mail to the Register, Wallen confirmed as much while saying Rakell has slowly started to work out again and will need "a couple of weeks" to get back in top shape. "Back negotiating," Wallen said. "More frequently now."

updated article

 

[jfc64]

No way Rakell is getting anything close to a 6 year deal or $3.75M per year either. If he's not careful, Murray will allocate some of his money to signing Lindholm and Ricky will be sitting around while Murray tries to move some salary or maybe he'll end up with a bridge deal he doesn't like.

Perhaps his health issue will enable Murray to make a trade while Rakell is still recuperating ? Once Lindholm is signed then he will know exactly how much money he has to work with rather than trying to juggle the two negotiations at the same time.

Talent, size and option value... 3.75 is my bet... should be 4.5 or something playing real hardball.

btw... Rakell was on the winning WJC team in 2012, who outshot Russia in the finals by 60-20, Russia who led by 6-2 against Canada in the semifinals...

 

[jfc64]

Both Lindholm and Rakell are playing a real life version of game theory's "Prisoner's Dilemma".

- There's not enough money to meet both player's asking price.

- They could both hold out to force Murray to accept their salary demands, and return home and just wait until it happens;
- Either one of them could suddenly accept close to their offer, making it much more difficult for the Ducks to sign the other one;
- They could both accept Murray's contract offers and then allow him to adjust the roster to fit under the salary cap.

Unfortunately for Rakell, it might not be realistic to expect Murray to easily or quickly "dump" Fowler or Despres during the season unless another team panics or suffers an early season injury in order to fit him under the cap (though moving Thompson to LTIR once the season opens might create a little breathing room for both players).

Will be interesting to see how Murray resolves the impasses.

It's easy to move a soon to be free agent or two. They are relative unimportant in relation to Rick and Hamp. Long, mega salary for Lindholm and a short "see what happens" salary for Rakes? (Victor Hedman style)

 

[jfc64]

You silly goose. We won't. Don't you see? Bob just wants to watch the world burn.

At least he used the cap space this time!

 

[Sojourn]

Talent, size and option value... 3.75 is my bet... should be 4.5 or something playing real hardball.

btw... Rakell was on the winning WJC team in 2012, who outshot Russia in the finals by 60-20, Russia who led by 6-2 against Canada in the semifinals...

Which is significant, how?

And 4.5? Based on what? All due respect to Rakell, but his career high is 20/20, and he's only done it once. His career regular season numbers and, especially, his playoff numbers, don't really justify "should be 4.5" in the least. 20/20 once from a player who has been fairly one-dimensional for us isn't worth $4.5.

 

[Ducks Nation*]

Which is significant, how?

And 4.5? Based on what? All due respect to Rakell, but his career high is 20/20, and he's only done it once. His career regular season numbers and, especially, his playoff numbers, don't really justify "should be 4.5" in the least. 20/20 once from a player who has been fairly one-dimensional for us isn't worth $4.5.

All this plus his recent health issues. He shouldnt get anymore than 3.3ish

 

[paine]

I'm fine with Rakell at 3.75x6.

 

[Magnus the Duck]

Which is significant, how?

And 4.5? Based on what? All due respect to Rakell, but his career high is 20/20, and he's only done it once. His career regular season numbers and, especially, his playoff numbers, don't really justify "should be 4.5" in the least. 20/20 once from a player who has been fairly one-dimensional for us isn't worth $4.5.

He shouldn't get more than Silfverberg. I still have hopes for Silf, that he can improve and get a full great season together. Hope RC changes up so 2nd line isn't just put on ice to neutralize other teams top players. Silf+Kesler+X has the potential to score more.

 

[Paul4587]

He shouldn't get more than Silfverberg. I still have hopes for Silf, that he can improve and get a full great season together. Hope RC changes up so 2nd line isn't just put on ice to neutralize other teams top players. Silf+Kesler+X has the potential to score more.

I don't know about that, Rakell is a significantly better offensive player (with much higher offensive upside) than Silfverberg and if we're locking him up for 6 years I would think he would ask for at least what Silfverberg is getting.

 

[Magnus the Duck]

I don't know about that, Rakell is a significantly better offensive player (with much higher offensive upside) than Silfverberg and if we're locking him up for 6 years I would think he would ask for at least what Silfverberg is getting.

Potentially. But Silferberg was a superb offensive talent in Sweden. As I said I have hopes Silf gets his old mojo back. And he is just 2,5 years older than Rakell. Somehow Silf has got locked into this defensive role, which was not his role in his young days. Hope he gets unstuck.

 

[Ducks DVM]

I don't know about that, Rakell is a significantly better offensive player (with much higher offensive upside) than Silfverberg and if we're locking him up for 6 years I would think he would ask for at least what Silfverberg is getting.

I don't know that you can say this until Silfverberg is put onto a line with next to no defensive responsibilities. Rakell is flashier, but he hasn't really outperformed Silfverberg offensively in the regular season despite far better linemates and zone starts, and Silfverberg has had outstanding offensive production in the playoffs 2 years running. Agreed that he appears to have a higher upside, but he hasn't put it together yet, and he's a pale shadow of Silfverberg defensively. I don't see any reasonable measure by which he should get what Silfverberg got.

 

[Sojourn]

Objectively, I'd say that Rakell is the more creative, and skilled offensive player. I think he creates more offense. Silfverberg has shown some of that, when he's looked his best(different type of player and style, obviously), but I think it's fair to say that Rakell has shown more ability to create offensively. The problem is that the numbers don't play out that difference in a very noteworthy way. Rakell has an advantage in PP time, offensive quality of linemates, and in offensive opportunities. Despite that, the difference in their offensive numbers is pretty small. It favors Rakell, at least in the regular season, but I wouldn't say it's substantial. Rakell is still very much an example of a player with good offensive tools, but he hasn't shown enough signs of putting it all together.

The difference defensively, though, is pretty significant. The difference in the playoffs, arguably, more so.

I'm not against paying for potential, but if we're paying him $4+, that's primarily what we're paying him for, and I am very against that. Especially when we aren't talking about, say, Lindholm upside. Rakell should be paid based on what he's currently showing, not what we hope he shows. I'd be willing to put in some extra wiggle room, if we sign him for 6 or more seasons, but ultimately the real advantage to that, for Anaheim, is to lock him up more cheaply. It kind of defeats the purpose if we pay him based heavily on potential, over the long-term. The value of the contract, for us, drops, and the risk is greater. What if he doesn't really take another significant step? Is he worth that money now? How much better does he need to get to be worth it in the future? Not every player does put it all together and, personally, I'd be much more comfortable paying for some of that potential, as well as current play, if he had another good season under his belt. Something that gave us a better look at his progression, and the slope of it.

Edit: I'd actually feel much more comfortable about paying a bit more for potential, if he had shown the strong defensive game that we saw from Silfverberg. Rakell is still the kind of player who we either notice in a positive sense on the offensive side of things or, I feel, we notice him in a negative way on the defensive side. I was pleasantly surprised by what I saw from him in the games he got to play for Sweden, and it gives me hope that he can contribute at both ends of the ice, but so far, for us, it's been very one-sided. He's either contributing offensively, or he isn't really contributing at all. That differed from his CHL game, where he was also known more as a two-way guy.

 

[PhoenyX]

While we are on the topic, what do people think is Rakell's upside?

Can he be a 30-30 guy? Similar production to, say, JvR? He's got a ton of skill, a great shot, and size.

Personally, I'd be happy if he puts up 25 goals and 50 points on a consistent basis.

 

[Exit Dose]

I don't see him consistently putting up 30. I'd guess 20-30, if it slides upwards it would be assists(on average).

 

[Sojourn]

I don't see him consistently putting up 30. I'd guess 20-30, if it slides upwards it would be assists(on average).

I agree. I think that's about where his average would be, if he continues to trend up. Given Rakell's talent level, I wouldn't be shocked to see him have that one career year, where everything he touches turns to gold, and he could put up a 30/30+ type of season. But if we're looking at an average, over his prime, I definitely think 20/30 is about right over his best years.