Rate the players on your team by Defensive ability

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Agree to disagree, I guess. The stuff I saw from him in the past two weeks suggests that the offensive side of his game is on point, but defensively, he makes horrendous mistakes.

He's a lot better defensively than Shea Weber.

 

[Sabresruletheschool]

Assumed 3=better than average, reread OP and the scale is a bit weird.
I’d hand Jack and Reinhart an extra point with the current scale. Rhino is better as a traditional defensive forward but Jack solves a lot of difficult situations with his strength and speed.

I don’t agree with your assessment of Girgensons, he works hard but tend to make bad decisions. Could be the overall confusion of the team. It’s hard to look good when the team is terrible as a whole.

My biggest problem with this is where you have Ristolainen. He's not that bad in his own end. When I watch goals against Buffalo, I see a that a good portion of the time, Ristolainen's doing his job, and it's the team defence that's at fault. If the other teams cycles the puck against Buffalo, most of the players seem to forget or don't know who or what there assignments are somebody ends up wide open without a Sabre within 3 feet from them.

 

[Trap Jesus]

Waaaaay too much disparity between 1 and 2, and 4 and 5.

 

[ConnorMcMullet]

Larsson 5
Sekera 4
Russell 4
Nurse 3
Klefbom 2
Benning 2

Mcdavid 4
Draisaitl 4
Nugent-Hopkins 4
Strome 3
Lucic 3
Kassian 3
Khaira 3
Caguilla 2
Pulijaarvi 3
Aberg 3
Rattie 2

I'd probably give Nurse a 4 and Russell a 3, but great list overall.

 

[rubikscube]

Morrissey, trouba: 4.5
Buff:4
Enstrom: 3
Myers: 2.5
Chiarot: 2

Lowry: 4.5
Scheif: 4
Wheeler, Little, Perrault, Copp: 3
Ehlers, Laine, Connor: 2.5

Hendricks: -10

 

[Maukkis]

He's a lot better defensively than Shea Weber.

Why is this information relevant to the point at hand?

 

[Porkleaker]

Larsson 4.5
Russell 2.5
Klefbom 1 (last year 4.5)
Nurse 3
Sekera 2 (last year 3.5)
Benning -5

McDavid 3.5
RNH 3.5
Drai 3.5
Strome 2.5

Basically just 0.5 less than your rankings.

Fixed.

 

[TOGuy14]

He'll shut you down in the sense that he'll spend a good chunk of his shifts cycling in your end, and if that fails he'll forecheck and agitate you into taking a penalty hopefully. That one game against McDavid was his very best work, if he can bring that every night he'd be a 5. Looking purely his work in the defensive zone he's probably a 2.5 on average, but on the whole he's probably closer to a 3.5 in terms of limiting how much time his opponent is generating good scoring chances.

I would say he thrives in man to man coverage but not as good in a zone system so it really depends on coaches deployment and utilization.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Disagree quite severely with Eric Robson above about the Leafs. Komarov for example is a very good defensive player still, even though he's not quite the same anymore there either. He still has a pronounced defensive impact, and if you look at heat maps his side of the ice tends to be quite dead in terms of shots and chances. It's just that it's now the only thing he can provide.

1.5 Tyler Bozak (A) 3.5 Connor Brown 3 Zach Hyman 3.5 Nazem Kadri 3 Kasperi Kapanen 4 Leo Komarov (A) 2 Josh Leivo 3.5 Patrick Marleau 2 Mitchell Marner 3.5 Matt Martin 3.5 Auston Matthews 2.5 Dominic Moore 2 William Nylander 4 Tomas Plekanec 1 James van Riemsdyk [TBODY] [/TBODY]

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Problem with our forwards last year is that most of our defensively reliable forwards got limited minutes because they are not very strong overall. These numbers put them as quite average, but would plummet if you adjusted for ice time.

Defense

Player 2 Connor Carrick 2 Jake Gardiner 4 Ron Hainsey 3 Roman Polak 2.5 Morgan Rielly (A) 2.5 Nikita Zaitsev [TBODY] [/TBODY] [TBODY] [/TBODY]

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

I agree entirely with this list except I think Rielly and Hainsey should both be 3-3.5, due to the former's ability to move the puck and the latter's inabilty to do so.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Why is this information relevant to the point at hand?

Because I sat and watched Weber literally be THE reason why Nashville lost to San Jose in 2016. I also watched this Nashville series and Subban didn't make nearly as many egregious mistakes, nor was he as bad as you're saying.

 

[Nithoniniel]

I agree entirely with this list except I think Rielly and Hainsey should both be 3-3.5, due to the former's ability to move the puck and the latter's inabilty to do so.

I don't generally include puck-moving capability among defensive ability, even though it has a large effect on defensive impact. I see transition as a separate area that links offense and defense. But it's a matter of personal preference.

 

[terry01]

Karlsson 4
Chabot 2
Ceci 2
Oduya 2
Everyone else, also 2

Stone 5
Duchene 4.5
Pageau 3
Ryan 3
Hoff maybe 3
http://:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:/buluhidung/33/o.png
​

 

[Maukkis]

Because I sat and watched Weber literally be THE reason why Nashville lost to San Jose in 2016. I also watched this Nashville series and Subban didn't make nearly as many egregious mistakes, nor was he as bad as you're saying.

Cool, but what Weber is has nothing to do with what Subban is. Moreover, base your argument on something else. Eye test does not cut it.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Cool, but what Weber is has nothing to do with what Subban is. Moreover, base your argument on something else. Eye test does not cut it.

Apparently it does when you're speaking.

 

[Mickey Marner]

I don't generally include puck-moving capability among defensive ability, even though it has a large effect on defensive impact. I see transition as a separate area that links offense and defense. But it's a matter of personal preference.

I agree if we extend puck moving beyond the defensive zone. But successful & failed zone clears I believe fall under the scope of defense. And the only two players worse at that last season were Polak and Dotchin.

Babcock's fetish for stretch-passing certainly didn't help. But I didn't consider a defenseman ringing the puck around the boards to the opposing defenseman an acceptable method of clearing the puck when I was 10 and I still don't now.

 

[olli]

Agree to disagree, I guess. The stuff I saw from him in the past two weeks suggests that the offensive side of his game is on point, but defensively, he makes horrendous mistakes.

??? maybe in Montreal. There's a reason why Laviolette uses PK primary as a shutdown D-man 5 on 5. Its not like he doesn't have other options.

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

Calgary:

Forwards:
4.5: Backlund
4: Tkachuk, Frolik
3: Shore, Lazar, Monahan, Jankowski
2.5: Gaudreau, Bennett, Stajan
2: Ferland, Hathaway
1: Brouwer

Defenseman:
5: Giordano
3.5: Hamonic, Hamilton
3: Brodie, Kulak
2: Stone
negative infinity: Bartkowski

I think I missed a few but whatever.

 

[Maukkis]

Apparently it does when you're speaking.

Why is it the right side that is giving up shots at a higher rate than the left one with Subban on the ice?

Subban is also the second worst defenseman on the Preds at preventing high danger chances, with 11.31 chances against per 60 minutes of play. It is true that most of his metrics are generally positive, but they don't stand out.

A good defenseman, but not a 5 defensively.

 

[NetflixandPhil]

I'll try Anaheim:

Forwards:
Cogliano-4.5
Kesler-4 (5 last year)
Silfverberg-4
Henrique-3.5
Getzlaf-3.5
Grant-3.5
Brown-3
Rakell-3
Kase-2.5
Ritchie-2.5
Vermette-2.5
Perry-2
Chimera-1.5
Kelly-1.5

Defenceman:
Lindholm-4.5
Manson-4.5
Fowler-4
Beauchemin-3
Montour-2.5
Welinski-2.5
Pettersson-2
Holzer-1.5
Bieksa-1

 

[RickP]

Why is it the right side that is giving up shots at a higher rate than the left one with Subban on the ice?

Subban is also the second worst defenseman on the Preds at preventing high danger chances, with 11.31 chances against per 60 minutes of play. It is true that most of his metrics are generally positive, but they don't stand out.

A good defenseman, but not a 5 defensively.

This season, he played with Emelin most of the time. That really hurt his numbers. Plus, he had crazy D-zone starts, which also hurt his defensive numbers, compared to his teammates who had easier zone starts. If you look at last year, regular season or playoffs, you'll see his defensive numbers were much better.

As for this year in the playoffs, I think Subban was great defensively overall, except for his bad habit of trying to cover for his teammates when they mess up, and in the process, leaving his man open. I saw that at least 4 or 5 times against the Jets. Don't know if Subban was trying to do too much, or if it was because his teammates messed up more than usual... Probably a bit of both. The fact that Rinne allowed such bad goals probably didn't help the players' confidence too. And the Jets have very dangerous players.

But other than that, he was very solid. His defensive numbers in the playoffs were pretty good too, other than +/-. Scheifele's line had a 45% CF against Ekholm-Subban, and 40% scoring chances for. Against the other pairings, that line had closer to 55-65% CF and SCF.

 

[Volica]

Calgary:

5
Mikael Backlund
Mark Giordano

4.5
Michael Frolik
Matt Tkachuk

4
Travis Hamonic

3.5
Dougie Hamilton
Drew Shore

3
Sam Bennett
TJ Brodie
Johnny Gaudreau (Hard to slot, always looking for an outlet playing D, amazing transition defender)
Matt Stajan
Brett Kulak
Sean Monahan
Michael Ferland
Mike Stone
Curtis Lazar
Garnet Hathaway
Mark Jankowski

2.5
Troy Brouwer

-1
Matt Bartkowski

 

[cowboy82nd]

1: Entire Isles team this season

You're being tooooooooo generous.

I kid of course.

 

[lomiller1]

This season, he played with Emelin most of the time. That really hurt his numbers.

Why are all the shots coming from Subban's side of the ice?

 

[Appleyard]

Flyers:

Fwds:

5: Couturier
4: Giroux, Raffl, Lindblom, Laughton, Read
3: Simmonds, Voracek, Patrick, Leier
2: Konecny, Filppula, Lehtera, Weal, Weise

Dmen:

5:
4: Provorov, Gudas
3: Gostisbehere, Hagg, MacDonald, Sanheim
2: Manning, Oduya

 

[RickP]

Why are all the shots coming from Subban's side of the ice?

Good question. That heat map is compared to league average though. I'm not sure how relevant it is to compare him with league average when he has much tougher deployment than league average.

Only 8 dmen in the league started in the D-zone more often than Subban this season.

Looking at Ekblad's heat map, Vlasic's heat map, they had similar deployment, and they're considered great Dmen, but their heat maps are kinda similar to Subban's heat map (Vlasic on the left side though). Not sure why the shots come from their side of the ice more.

I would be curious to see the league average heat map, does that exist?