Price and PK and the Elephant

[Kriss E]

I'm curious

What was our culture before Martin got here and after iyo

Martin unleashed himself in the first camp practice barking away at the Kost broz and Lats.
He said he had never seen such a poorly structured and out of shape group of guys.

 

[macavoy]

Martin unleashed himself in the first camp practice barking away at the Kost broz and Lats.
He said he had never seen such a poorly structured and out of shape group of guys.

\
Thanks, I don't really remember that period. That was the Ribeiro era right?

 

[Kriss E]

\
Thanks, I don't really remember that period. That was the Ribeiro era right?

Nah this was the first year of the Gomez-Gio-Cammy era.

 

[Wats]

If Price isn't or wasn't our best player on the ice last season, he was simply not earning his salary. Price with a, say, .915 sv%, is not doing his job.

Not sure I see your point. If Price is not doing his job with a .915 sv% costing the Habs games, does it suddenly mean MT is not doing his job too?

 

[macavoy]

Not sure I see your point. If Price is not doing his job with a .915 sv% costing the Habs games, does it suddenly mean MT is not doing his job too?

Obviously.

 

[Brainiac]

\
Thanks, I don't really remember that period. That was the Ribeiro era right?

Waaaaaaath?

And you've been posting since 2009?

No really, it was the end of the Koivu/Kovalev era. Lots of cliques in the locker room. The team just wasn't a team like it is now. No need to point out specifics. Martin did bring a "team's first" mentality and Therrien did build up on that.

 

[optimus2861]

Vigneault is really the only good coach I can think of since Demers.

Vigneault then was not as good a coach as Vigneault today. He was still learning his craft at the NHL level, and frankly he had garbage rosters to work with here. I'd almost like to re-watch some of those games with those points in mind and reevaluate him; I wasn't a fan of him when he was here. Nor Julien, but you might be able to make similar points (it was somewhat unjust that he got fired for realizing that Jose Theodore had lost it).

Therrien can't hold a candle to either of them today. Vigneault made him look like a total chump during the ECF.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Vigneault then was not as good a coach as Vigneault today. He was still learning his craft at the NHL level, and frankly he had garbage rosters to work with here. I'd almost like to re-watch some of those games with those points in mind and reevaluate him; I wasn't a fan of him when he was here. Nor Julien, but you might be able to make similar points (it was somewhat unjust that he got fired for realizing that Jose Theodore had lost it).

Therrien can't hold a candle to either of them today. Vigneault made him look like a total chump during the ECF.

I just remember thinking that Vigneault did the best he could with a bad group. I guess Julien was in a similar situation but the other coaches we've had have been mostly bad.

There's just no way to justify the idiocy of MT last season. He was off the charts bad. Stupid roster management, terrible system, throwing players under the bus... basically everything you can do wrong as a coach he was the poster boy for. I really hope he's better this season - he can't be any worse.

 

[optimus2861]

There's just no way to justify the idiocy of MT last season. He was off the charts bad. Stupid roster management, terrible system, throwing players under the bus... basically everything you can do wrong as a coach he was the poster boy for. I really hope he's better this season - he can't be any worse.

I do worry about the dynamic between he & PK this year. Both have fresh contracts, so both in theory have the full confidence of the organization to continue in their roles. If MT continues his moronic treatment of PK this season though, Bergevin or even Molson himself will have to step in and get him to smarten the hell up. Or, preferably, fire his ass, but frankly that's not gonna happen this year.

I think we'll continue to underachieve so long as Therrien is at the helm, and we frankly don't have the years to waste underachieving. This roster is close, damn close, and we need to be pushing it to be consistently elite. Not grinding it down with bad coaching.

 

[Not The One]

The Habs made it because their goalie stood on his head. We couldn't score, we couldn't defend and we were outplayed all year.

So AGAIN, why are you telling us to credit the coach?

I expected the Habs to be a playoff team. Most people here did because we showed that we have the talent to score back in 2013. So I'm not sure what you're talking about here.

Do we beat the Bruins without Price standing on his head? No.

In the playoffs I think we actually played pretty well for the most part btw. MT seemed to step away from the ridiculous dump and chase that he had in the regular season. But again, we don't even make it past Boston if Price isn't insanely good in that series, esp early on.


Sure. But most don't have to rely on it the way we did. Most top teams can score and defend. That's because they have good rosters and a coach who knows what he's doing. We had a good roster and a coach who was an idiot. That's why we were outshot most of the time.

You still haven't told us what MT has done to warrant credit. You keep pointing at the standings and the conference finish.

Why should we credit MT and not Price? Tell us.

Was it the bottom third in shots that has you excited?
Bottom third in goals?
Bottom third in shots against?
Below average PP from a team that has two of the best QBs in the game?
Was it the regression of play from almost every player on the roster?

Tell us. What the **** did MT do to warrant any kind of credit last season? We gave up tons of scoring opps and didn't have many for ourselves. Our goalie stepped up and saved the day. Hence why our GA was top five in the league.

Yep, looking at the standings is good enough for you. That's why you aren't being taken seriously here. You've done zero to tell us why MT deserves credit for this.

We won despite him, not because of him.

Yeah, I credit the coach for being part of the best Canadiens season in twenty years. You're too myopic and busy playing the part of an internet tough guy/keyboard warrior to see how absurd your posts are.

Results>>>>Everything else, and in two seaons MT's team has exceeded expectations twice. By your "standards", there's probable only two or three coaches worthy of keeping they jobs. But by all means, don't mind me and please keep on hatin' and lowering the bar for everybody else.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Results>>>>Everything else

But you aren't able to articulate how we got the results we did. And you aren't able to tell us why the coach deserves credit for those results.

Ironic that you would call others "myopic" while writing the posts that you have in this thread.

 

[Big Lurk]

LOL @ results>>>everything else

Its the kind of ideology that keeps one from learning and improving.

 

[Not The One]

But you aren't able to articulate how we got the results we did. And you aren't able to tell us why the coach deserves credit for those results.

Ironic that you would call others "myopic" while writing the posts that you have in this thread.

I don't have to... the results speak for themselves and you'll likely counter your ridiculous "It's only because of Price" argument, as it wast true of every good team in the league.

Reading the last few pages it's abundantly clear that, sadly, there is are some fans that NOTHING could please and that will spend the best days of summer arguing in circles about things they have no control over all the while while missing the forest for the trees.

I find it incredibly depressing, but whatever works for you...

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I don't have to...

We won in spite of our coach, not because of him. You've done absolutely nothing to show us otherwise.

We had a good roster and yet we were below average across the board except goaltending. Until you can explain why we should credit the coach for this, you aren't going to be taken seriously.

 

[Kriss E]

I don't have to...

Of course you have to. How can you make a proper analysis if you don't look at the numbers? How do you know what areas of the game we weren't actually good at last year and need to improve on the most? How do you know anything about the team if you don't look at the numbers??

If you start doing that, you'll realize that we were pretty mediocre-poor in most facets of the game and we only excelled in one, goaltending.

 

[Burke the Legend]

Nor Julien, but you might be able to make similar points (it was somewhat unjust that he got fired for realizing that Jose Theodore had lost it).

I remember it that Julien kept playing Theo even though he sucked and Gainey wanted him to play Huet. I guess they had a big arguement over it and Gainey fired Julien after. Maybe I am wrong though.

Julien seems to have fit in with Boston, but there also must be quite a background story in how Lamerillo decided to fire him at the end of the reg season, just before the playoff round, I don't think that was just a snap decision. Julien must really grate on people.

 

[optimus2861]

I remember it that Julien kept playing Theo even though he sucked and Gainey wanted him to play Huet. I guess they had a big arguement over it and Gainey fired Julien after. Maybe I am wrong though.

Theodore was an inconsistent mess all season and Julien was increasingly leaning on Huet. He gave Theodore a 5-game stint after Christmas to see if Theodore had anything left; Theodore lost 4 of the 5 and stunk the joint out in the last 3. Julien went back to Huet for 2 in a row and it felt like he'd had enough of Theodore's play; then Gainey axed him, put Theodore back in net, and Theodore rebounded... for a week. Then he fell apart completely and by the end of the month Gainey had seen enough. Theodore was shipped to Colorado and Huet was the new #1.

 

[De Montreal]

To get back to the OP: would you be ready to overpay for Evgeni Malkin? Then have a prime player in every position?

Pacioretty, Desharnais, Eller and Beaulieu?

Then we sign Ray Whitney 1 year

Whitney - Malkin - Parenteau
Bourque - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
Bournival - Plekanec - Sekac
Weise - Malhotra - Prust
Moen

Markov - Subban
Emelin - Gilbert
Tinordi - Weaver

Price

I'm not saying Pens would do it.. but let's say a big time center get available, would you be ready to pay a heifty price?

 

[JLP]

To get back to the OP: would you be ready to overpay for Evgeni Malkin? Then have a prime player in every position?

Pacioretty, Desharnais, Eller and Beaulieu?

Then we sign Ray Whitney 1 year

Whitney - Malkin - Parenteau
Bourque - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
Bournival - Plekanec - Sekac
Weise - Malhotra - Prust
Moen

Markov - Subban
Emelin - Gilbert
Tinordi - Weaver

Price

I'm not saying Pens would do it.. but let's say a big time center get available, would you be ready to pay a heifty price?

Would rather try one of Galchenyuk or Eller first. We have one of the top-paid goalies and the top-paid defenceman -- not sure we want to spend $10m on a #1C. Plus theoretically we'd have to trade away our solid young wingers, which would create other weaknesses.

 

[macavoy]

We won in spite of our coach, not because of him. You've done absolutely nothing to show us otherwise.

We had a good roster and yet we were below average across the board except goaltending. Until you can explain why we should credit the coach for this, you aren't going to be taken seriously.

If we won, in spite of our coach, why did the team turn on the jets whenever MT said to? Why did they protect all those 3rd period leads and when they blew it, why did they go to war for him to win it back.

This team played their butts out for the coach and did what he said when he said to.

 

[macavoy]

Look at the Habs record going into the 3rd period.


Look at the Habs record, when they blew a 3rd period lead.

then look at what happened when they blewed that lead, the came back and won the game everytime they won.

 

[overlords]

If we won, in spite of our coach, why did the team turn on the jets whenever MT said to? Why did they protect all those 3rd period leads and when they blew it, why did they go to war for him to win it back.

This team played their butts out for the coach and did what he said when he said to.

So you're saying Therrien never said to turn on the jets for most of the rangers series?

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

If we won, in spite of our coach, why did the team turn on the jets whenever MT said to? Why did they protect all those 3rd period leads and when they blew it, why did they go to war for him to win it back.

This team played their butts out for the coach and did what he said when he said to.

MT should've had them turn on the jets a lot more than he did then... Maybe then we might've actually been able to score.