Pouliot's Future?

[Replacement*]

Because HFOil.

Heres an interesting thing. Before seasons start in the Nostradamus thread the majority of HF posters figured the Oil would have 5 20 goal scorers and that Pouliot would be one of them. This was the baseline expectation right or wrong from poll and comments in that and other threads.

He has 16, sure he's played limited games but its what he has. lol that the team has 1 20 goal scorer with likelihood of two on the season.

Guess where my bet lied?

hfoil has negative leanings because, well, Oilers. If we're being honest that's a negative focal point that influences the board. If you have more patience I'd wonder how long you had been consistently following the club.

Either that or your a patient saint and judging from interaction that doesn't seem to be the case

 

[J4M13M]

Why are we cherry picking timelines with this. There was an extended period of time before Feb 1 where the topline, with Pouliot on it, was absolutely putrid and getting next to nothing for production.

Every timeline chosen to show anything is arbitrary, get over it. Someone saying "since Feb 1" is no more arbitrary than you talking about the period before.

Pouliot is far from the problem with the Oilers. He's not perfect, but he's a nice piece with lots of value to the Oilers. Given all the other issues, they'd be fools to move him.

 

[Replacement*]

Every timeline chosen to show anything is arbitrary, get over it. Someone saying "since Feb 1" is no more arbitrary than you talking about the period before.

Pouliot is far from the problem with the Oilers. He's not perfect, but he's a nice piece with lots of value to the Oilers. Given all the other issues, they'd be fools to move him.

Never said move him.

ftr longer samples and complete samples are always considered more indicative of overall play than randomly selected samples. For instance a player we're paying 4M for has 28 pts on a season while playing much of his time in topline and if not that second line.

Am I overjoyed at the actual contribution (not prorated) of course not. Pouliot perhaps has made a commensurate contribution on his contract this year. The reality is he hasn't helped the team, or his lines be better one bit.

So yet another player "who was just what we needed" if I ever chose to take offseason prognostications seriously, has not even impacted. Not made the slightest difference.

Again Roy has made much more difference and for much less money. I can't imagine how bad this club would still be without Roy on it.

 

[McDeathbyCheerios*]

Never said move him.

ftr longer samples and complete samples are always considered more indicative of overall play than randomly selected samples. For instance a player we're paying 4M for has 28 pts on a season while playing much of his time in topline and if not that second line.

Am I overjoyed at the actual contribution (not prorated) of course not. Pouliot perhaps has made a commensurate contribution on his contract this year. The reality is he hasn't helped the team, or his lines be better one bit.

So yet another player "who was just what we needed" if I ever chose to take offseason prognostications seriously, has not even impacted. Not made the slightest difference.

Again Roy has made much more difference and for much less money. I can't imagine how bad this club would still be without Roy on it.

Roy has been very good and a bit more of an impact then Pouliot but that doesn't mean Pouliot isn't worth his pay this year. Roy is just a steal of a deal at the moment same with Lander.

And you can't say Pouliot hasn't impacted. After the line got used to each other and not playing with Hall they have been a very very good line. There was a span of the season where he scored our only 6 goals in 3 games or something.

He is a power forward who with a full season could put up 40-50 points and is something we sorely need. Him being on the top line allows RNH and Eberle to do their thing, something that we haven't had in years. Those two are all the skill you need on a top line and Pouliot is a great complimentary player to allow that skill to excel

 

[McDNicks17]

Never said move him.

ftr longer samples and complete samples are always considered more indicative of overall play than randomly selected samples. For instance a player we're paying 4M for has 28 pts on a season while playing much of his time in topline and if not that second line.

Am I overjoyed at the actual contribution (not prorated) of course not. Pouliot perhaps has made a commensurate contribution on his contract this year. The reality is he hasn't helped the team, or his lines be better one bit.

So yet another player "who was just what we needed" if I ever chose to take offseason prognostications seriously, has not even impacted. Not made the slightest difference.

Again Roy has made much more difference and for much less money. I can't imagine how bad this club would still be without Roy on it.

I don't know how anyone can take you seriously with a statement like that.

 

[McDeathbyCheerios*]

I don't know how anyone can take you seriously with a statement like that.

Imo he is more useful then Perron was.

 

[Approved Variety]

Nuge and Eberle disagree with you.*As does every analyst I've heard speak on the subject.

 

[Replacement*]

I don't know how anyone can take you seriously with a statement like that.

Actually try to demonstrate, with numbers, of any kind, that the team, a line, or selective players have been much improved due to the addition of Pouliot.

Try to do it without candycoating select arbitrary timelines.

See, I don't need to do that with Roy. He arrived and immediately had on, and off ice impact on the team, on Yak and gave this team two lines as an option in ways that nobody else had this year.

night and day more impactful than Pouliot. Do you really think Pouliot has improved RNH and Eberle. These players have been at these heights before, they will again. To his credit Pouliot can fill on first line, I give him that. But I expect more out of a veteran. With that I'm also considering such things as impact on team, players taking leadership roles, etc. From observation I'm not clear Pouliot or Purcell have done that. I'm pretty sure guys like Roy, Hendricks, Gordon, even Scrivens have.

We need Pouliot to be a leader here I think. if you feel he has been that maybe help me with understanding in what way.

 

[Replacement*]

Nuge and Eberle disagree with you.*As does every analyst I've heard speak on the subject.

Nuge and Eberle felt and expressed repeatedly that Eakins was a quality coach that they're learning a lot from.

What should we really take from such verbal offerings. Journal just did a full pages spread on why and how Hockey talk and quotes is generally such an empty, inane pond with waters not running deep. Mostly pad, rote, answers. I don't always put a lot of stock in what players state. What else are they gonna state?
Yak is one of the few straight shooters on this club. I'll listen to what he has to say.

 

[McDNicks17]

Actually try to demonstrate, with numbers, of any kind, that the team, a line, or selective players have been much improved due to the addition of Pouliot.

Try to do it without candycoating select arbitrary timelines.

See, I don't need to do that with Roy. He arrived and immediately had on, and off ice impact on the team, on Yak and gave this team two lines as an option in ways that nobody else had this year.

night and day more impactful than Pouliot. Do you really think Pouliot has improved RNH and Eberle. These players have been at these heights before, they will again. To his credit Pouliot can fill on first line, I give him that. But I expect more out of a veteran. With that I'm also considering such things as impact on team, players taking leadership roles, etc. From observation I'm not clear Pouliot or Purcell have done that. I'm pretty sure guys like Roy, Hendricks, Gordon, even Scrivens have.

We need Pouliot to be a leader here I think. if you feel he has been that maybe help me with understanding in what way.

I understand what you're doing.

You were Pouliot's biggest detractor when he was signed. Because he's been playing extremely well, you feel the need to come up with some vague conjecture to prove you were right about him.

It really isn't worth anyone's time to argue with you about this. No one is changing your mind.

This board would be a much better place if people would just admit when they were wrong and let it go.

 

[Replacement*]

I understand what you're doing.

You were Pouliot's biggest detractor when he was signed. Because he's been playing extremely well, you feel the need to come up with some vague conjecture to prove you were right.

It really isn't worth anyone's time to argue with you about this. No one is changing your mind.

This board would be a much better place if people would just admit when they were wrong and let it go.

OK. If it satisfies I'm wrong on the basis of one season and Pouliot has produced better than I expected thus far.

Its fine for you to think I'm not bringing any other position but that's an equally unfair view. Could you even question that Roy has not been imminently more impactful to the club than Pouliot?

Anyway hopefully we get leadership from Pouliot and a bigger role than he's typically been prepared to take in his career.

make no mistake either. This is good pouliot this year and most of last. That's positive, but theres been years of questionable Pouliot and concensus of some NHL teams with experience with this player being you don't always know which one is showing up.

Anyway, these are discussions, people are free to engage, or not. I guess we can talke about yet another year of team failure blah blah blah instead.

Really virtually anything expressed at this silly time of year when we're again out of the playoffs approaches noise.

ps I actually like Pouliot when I see him playing the way he can. Immensely skilled player. Ive stated that a dozen times in the thread.

 

[McDeathbyCheerios*]

Actually try to demonstrate, with numbers, of any kind, that the team, a line, or selective players have been much improved due to the addition of Pouliot.

Try to do it without candycoating select arbitrary timelines.

See, I don't need to do that with Roy. He arrived and immediately had on, and off ice impact on the team, on Yak and gave this team two lines as an option in ways that nobody else had this year.

night and day more impactful than Pouliot. Do you really think Pouliot has improved RNH and Eberle. These players have been at these heights before, they will again. To his credit Pouliot can fill on first line, I give him that. But I expect more out of a veteran. With that I'm also considering such things as impact on team, players taking leadership roles, etc. From observation I'm not clear Pouliot or Purcell have done that. I'm pretty sure guys like Roy, Hendricks, Gordon, even Scrivens have.

We need Pouliot to be a leader here I think. if you feel he has been that maybe help me with understanding in what way.

Pouliot is finally on a team that has showed interest past 1 year. And that's odd for him.

The thing is though you hated the Pouliot signing in its entirety since the beginning. So it's harder for you to notice.

Yes RNH and Eberle have looked good offensively in the past. However since they have had Pouliot on their line and started clicking... They play confident.

Pouliot makes them better. Pouliot sticks up for his team mates, he is a big body that can pass, crash the net and skate. He doesn't show up on the score board but if you watch what he does to help his linemates you can really see his contribution. On zone entries Pouliot either zooms in unchecked as the defenders are all over the kids or he draws attention away. When he is left unchecked he gets right to the net and either screens or gets ready for a juicy rebound. When they defend him it clears space for Eberle and Nuge to play their passing game and prepare for scoring chances.

It's why so many of us don't want Hall with them anymore, Pouliots style works better with RNH and Eberle.

Pouliot didn't have a direct impact as he was playing on a line with a struggling Yak and a rookie center before he got injured.

 

[Aerchon]

I understand what you're doing.

You were Pouliot's biggest detractor when he was signed. Because he's been playing extremely well, you feel the need to come up with some vague conjecture to prove you were right about him.

It really isn't worth anyone's time to argue with you about this. No one is changing your mind.

This board would be a much better place if people would just admit when they were wrong and let it go.

I am still completely flabbergasted on how anyone would want to discuss Pouliot at this point in anything less than a positive manner.

Thanks for enlightening me. Now it makes some sense. Weird how some people just can never admit they were wrong and the lengths they will go to rationalize there poor judgement.

 

[Replacement*]

Pouliot is finally on a team that has showed interest past 1 year. And that's odd for him.

The thing is though you hated the Pouliot signing in its entirety since the beginning. So it's harder for you to notice.

Yes RNH and Eberle have looked good offensively in the past. However since they have had Pouliot on their line and started clicking... They play confident.

Pouliot makes them better. Pouliot sticks up for his team mates, he is a big body that can pass, crash the net and skate. He doesn't show up on the score board but if you watch what he does to help his linemates you can really see his contribution. On zone entries Pouliot either zooms in unchecked as the defenders are all over the kids or he draws attention away. When he is left unchecked he gets right to the net and either screens or gets ready for a juicy rebound. When they defend him it clears space for Eberle and Nuge to play their passing game and prepare for scoring chances.

It's why so many of us don't want Hall with them anymore, Pouliots style works better with RNH and Eberle.

Pouliot didn't have a direct impact as he was playing on a line with a struggling Yak and a rookie center before he got injured.

Thanks, appreciated, and I actually stated multiple times for people to help me understand what the player brings. I don't see all of it, admittedly. Your post helps me to do that.

Penner had somewhat of similar make space role to create openings for others. Now that you mention that I have seen that.

Anyway, time to enjoy the great outdoors. Hope everybody has a great weekend.

 

[McDeathbyCheerios*]

Thanks, appreciated, and I actually stated multiple times for people to help me understand what the player brings. I don't see all of it, admittedly. Your post helps me to do that.

Penner had somewhat of similar make space role to create openings for others. Now that you mention that I have seen that.

Anyway, time to enjoy the great outdoors. Hope everybody has a great weekend.

He reminds me of an in shape Penner with a bit more skill, now that you mention it

 

[Beerfish]

I thought the Pouliot contract has heinous and still think it will bite us in the ass, the term is the problem. However he has played well this year and is a good fit with RNh and Eberle. There is no reason why Hall can't drive the offense on another line, even with lesser players.

The one thing to know about Replacement is once he has made up his mind about something you can slap him in the face with as many stats and accomplishments as you wish and he will not budge.

See the Ricky Ray debates.

 

[PaPaDee]

I don't know how anyone can take you seriously with a statement like that.

Agreed - I haven't watched a tonne of games, but every game I have watched Pouliot has been effective and has done what I hoped he would when he was signed. He's not a player that will drive a line, but a very good complimentary player and has shown well playing with other talented players.

 

[CupofOil]

Never said move him.

ftr longer samples and complete samples are always considered more indicative of overall play than randomly selected samples. For instance a player we're paying 4M for has 28 pts on a season while playing much of his time in topline and if not that second line.

Am I overjoyed at the actual contribution (not prorated) of course not. Pouliot perhaps has made a commensurate contribution on his contract this year. The reality is he hasn't helped the team, or his lines be better one bit.

So yet another player "who was just what we needed" if I ever chose to take offseason prognostications seriously, has not even impacted. Not made the slightest difference.

Again Roy has made much more difference and for much less money. I can't imagine how bad this club would still be without Roy on it.

Sorry man but this is absurd, this Pouliot axe that you constantly grind.
Not made the slightest difference? Not helping his linemates? These are absurd statements in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

He's getting paid as a 2nd liner and there's absolutely nothing to suggest that he hasn't earned that pay. He has fit very well with the RNH-Eberle combo, much better than Hall, a player who you defend to no end.

He has absolutely made the RNH-Eberle line better. Their production took a spike up to another level after he returned from injury. How can you possibly deny that he has been beneficial for RNH and Eberle? Even Stevie Wonder can see that Pouliot has fit well on that line.

You do realize that you do this all the time. You pick out a player that you don't like then you constantly complain about them even when they are performing well, stubborn as a mule.

I give you credit for taking the bullets from the posters who disagree with you and not just drive by posting and leaving like some folks do but you are flat out pushing an agenda here and you know it.

 

[Replacement*]

Sorry man but this is absurd, this Pouliot axe that you constantly grind.
Not made the slightest difference? Not helping his linemates? These are absurd statements in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Perhaps I didn't word that correctly. What I mean anyway is that he doesn't make the line appreciably better than it would otherwise be with semi reasonable fill 3rd winger. He hasn't improved the production of the line beyond where its often been before. Not sure how this isn't clear.

He's getting paid as a 2nd liner and there's absolutely nothing to suggest that he hasn't earned that pay. He has fit very well with the RNH-Eberle combo, much better than Hall, a player who you defend to no end.

You know I've been an outspoken proponent of breaking up first line. Glad its happened. But I expect that line to be gold on most nights. I really do.

He has absolutely made the RNH-Eberle line better. Their production took a spike up to another level after he returned from injury.

This is hogwash. the line production was not great in January and RNH particularly was slumping. Really the only one going in Janurary on the line was Eberle. Am I supposed to credit Pouliot for improving Nuge and Eberle's game when any percieved change happened around a month after?

How can you possibly deny that he has been beneficial for RNH and Eberle? Even Stevie Wonder can see that Pouliot has fit well on that line.

What, on one month of selective results against easy opponents? I don't know that I've seen even 10 games with this line looking good. if you feel different name the games. Its being overstated. Look, this line has loaded up and had multiple goal nights against oppnents that are either lousy or could care less at this time of year. Against teams playing us hard they don't get out of the starting gate. same old same old, losing team, losing attitude, yada yada.

You do realize that you do this all the time. You pick out a player that you don't like then you constantly complain about them even when they are performing well, stubborn as a mule.

moi? **** no, don't tell my wife

In truth don't we all get ingrained to some extent?

I give you credit for taking the bullets from the posters who disagree with you and not just drive by posting and leaving like some folks do but you are flat out pushing an agenda here and you know it.

Maybe that would be fair if my opinion on Pouliot was black and white and stark. Its not that. Good player, great talent, but man I'm starving here as a long suffering fan and want him, want anybody else that doesn't typically do it take the reigns and start leading this team in a better way. First by example. In fairness Pouliot has made some strides and a better player clearly than he was a couple of seasons ago. If I'm guilty of anything its blatant impatience and that *visual* optics and small progress isn't doing it for me on most nights.

Finally, we all know that if Pouliot had been a decade long floater on this team everybody would hate him. I don't excuse it just because it happened elsewhere. I tend to resent players with a failure to launch epitaph, cites Brule who I was brutal to.

Really if we're being honest as well most if not all the players I have disliked have been proved to be ****. Unfortunately being right a whole lot more than I'm wrong.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

He's on a 26-20-46 pace, and has been a great fit on the top line. He's the first forward we've brought it, as a free agent, that's been good offensively, in ages. He uses his size well, and has the speed to keep up with Nuge and Ebs. I couldn't be happier with him.

He has a good shot and thinks the game well. Unless he regresses badly he'll be a fixture in our top 9 for the duration of his deal.

 

[Approved Variety]

Nuge and Ebs are on record giving Pou a lot of credit regarding their current clip for creating space for them on the ice, and digging the puck out of the corner, and driving to the net.

Could we, as a braintrust, find a cheaper version to do the same stuff for that line? Probably. But we can only work with what we have. Imo, he's the best WE HAVE on that LW. All that matters, and we don't get paid the big bucks like Bob Green. Hopefully he earns his new contract.

 

[The Nuge]

He has a good shot and thinks the game well. Unless he regresses badly he'll be a fixture in our top 9 for the duration of his deal.

Ya, and it'd probably take a Whitney esq injury. He'll be 32 when his contract runs out, so he's far from the point where we have to worry about his age.

Heres an interesting thing. Before seasons start in the Nostradamus thread the majority of HF posters figured the Oil would have 5 20 goal scorers and that Pouliot would be one of them. This was the baseline expectation right or wrong from poll and comments in that and other threads.

He has 16, sure he's played limited games but its what he has. lol that the team has 1 20 goal scorer with likelihood of two on the season.

Guess where my bet lied?

hfoil has negative leanings because, well, Oilers. If we're being honest that's a negative focal point that influences the board. If you have more patience I'd wonder how long you had been consistently following the club.

Either that or your a patient saint and judging from interaction that doesn't seem to be the case

No. The team has 2 20 goal scorers, and Perron is on pace for 19, Hall is on pace for 22, and Pouliot on pace for 26. It's fairly reasonable to suggest we could have had 5 20 goal guys this year.

 

[guymez]

I understand what you're doing.

You were Pouliot's biggest detractor when he was signed. Because he's been playing extremely well, you feel the need to come up with some vague conjecture to prove you were right about him.

It really isn't worth anyone's time to argue with you about this. No one is changing your mind.

This board would be a much better place if people would just admit when they were wrong and let it go.

Right on the mark on all counts.

 

[harpoon]

Interesting to see three posters (who to my knowledge have never acknowledged being wrong about anything - in spite of being spectacularly wrong on several accounts) calling out other posters for not admitting when they are wrong. Well done guys.

 

[McDeathbyCheerios*]

Ya, and it'd probably take a Whitney esq injury. He'll be 32 when his contract runs out, so he's far from the point where we have to worry about his age.



No. The team has 2 20 goal scorers, and Perron is on pace for 19, Hall is on pace for 22, and Pouliot on pace for 26. It's fairly reasonable to suggest we could have had 5 20 goal guys this year.

Injuries derailed that production