Post-Game Talk: Post TDL Talk

[Riptide]

Same, although it could take him some time to mesh. Remember when Neal came over and did not score for a while. I am excited but being realistic about what we see tonight.

You mean in 2010/11? When we were missing Malkin and Crosby? Honestly, that never phased me, as I had zero expectations for him. The guy (Neal) is dependent on his center to create for him... no surprise that nothing much was happening.

As for Brassard... yeah, that's always a risk. But unlike with Neal, those two (Brassard/Kessel) are working with legitimate talent and won't likely be facing the other teams top shutdown units. And if they are... that means Crosby or Malkin are not - so win/win.

 

[66-30-33]

those two (Brassard/Kessel) are working with legitimate talent and won't likely be facing the other teams top shutdown units.

OH MAN!!!! RIP!

Shades of HBK dominance...oh man, that's so damn awesome! Thanks Vegas, i'm pulling for you in the West.

Now to just get Patty Kane at 50% retention for Sheary, Sprong, 1st. Crosby-Kane, Malkin-Hornqvist, Brassard-Kessel.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

Yes. This should be the reincarnation of HBK, but on steroids. I simply am not expecting them to come out of the gates on fire, but I hope that I am pleasantly surprised. There usually is an adjustment period to a new team and new linemates.

 

[66-30-33]

Yes. This should be the reincarnation of HBK, but on steroids. I simply am not expecting them to come out of the gates on fire, but I hope that I am pleasantly surprised. There usually is an adjustment period to a new team and new linemates.

Yeah I am not expecting lightning in a bottle or anything, just hope he can mesh with Kessel and Crosby/Malkin if put on the wing. Maybe trade for Zuccarello and roll a Hagelin-Brassard-Zuccarello 3rd line. Kirk would be happy.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Guentzel - Brassard - Kessel is potentially our third line. That's better than a lot of team's #1 lines.

Of course, the downside to that is Sid's playing with a bunch of leftovers. So there's the balancing act. Hopefully Sullivan can find the right combinations.

 

[ZeroPucksGiven]

Yes. This should be the reincarnation of HBK, but on steroids. I simply am not expecting them to come out of the gates on fire, but I hope that I am pleasantly surprised. There usually is an adjustment period to a new team and new linemates.

I really feel like Kessel and Brassard are gonna gel

 

[PensandCaps]

One thing i like about the Brassard trade is, that if Crosby or Malkin go down for a series vs a team not named Tampa...we still would have a chance in the series.

 

[mpp9]

Guentzel - Brassard - Kessel is potentially our third line. That's better than a lot of team's #1 lines.

Of course, the downside to that is Sid's playing with a bunch of leftovers. So there's the balancing act. Hopefully Sullivan can find the right combinations.

The balancing act is Guentzel is already back with Crosby.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

The balancing act is Guentzel is already back with Crosby.

Is he? I haven't read the current line updates since the Brassard trade. I was assuming they were keeping Kessel and Guentzel together.

 

[Riptide]

Is he? I haven't read the current line updates since the Brassard trade. I was assuming they were keeping Kessel and Guentzel together.

Looks like Sheary is going to start there, and that Guentzel will play with Crosby.

 

[mpp9]

Is he? I haven't read the current line updates since the Brassard trade. I was assuming they were keeping Kessel and Guentzel together.

Sheary was skating with Brassard and Kessel.

 

[66-30-33]

One thing i like about the Brassard trade is, that if Crosby or Malkin go down for a series vs a team not named Tampa...we still would have a chance in the series.

Jake-Brassard-Hornqvist
Hagelin-Malkin-Rust
Sheary-Sheahan-Kessel

vs

Jake-Crosby-Hornqvist
Hagelin-Brassard-Kessel
Sheary-Sheahan-Rust

Pens beat Caps last playoffs in the game Crosby went down if we had Brassard IMO.

 

[PensandCaps]

Jake-Brassard-Hornqvist
Hagelin-Malkin-Rust
Sheary-Sheahan-Kessel

vs

Jake-Crosby-Hornqvist
Hagelin-Brassard-Kessel
Sheary-Sheahan-Rust

Pens beat Caps last playoffs in the game Crosby went down if we had Brassard IMO.

We did beat them.

 

[cygnus47]

Guentzel - Brassard - Kessel is potentially our third line. That's better than a lot of team's #1 lines.

Of course, the downside to that is Sid's playing with a bunch of leftovers. So there's the balancing act. Hopefully Sullivan can find the right combinations.

I'd be fine with Sid "only" scoring at a ppg rate while shutting down top lines, especially if Malkin, Kessel, Guentzel and Brassard are also at a ppg rate because Sid is taking the hardest starts. It worked in 2016 even with 2 fewer offensive weapons.

 

[66-30-33]

We did beat them.

We lost game 3 in OT.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

I am guessing that no team plays a fourt line in the playoffs against the Pens. They go three lines deep to try and match up.

 

[Riptide]

I'd be fine with Sid "only" scoring at a ppg rate while shutting down top lines, especially if Malkin, Kessel, Guentzel and Brassard are also at a ppg rate because Sid is taking the hardest starts. It worked in 2016 even with 2 fewer offensive weapons.

Sid doesn't even have to score at a PPG rate - just go even with the lines he's matching up with. Let Brassard/Kessel do all the hard work. If he's keeping pace with whomever he's matching up against, odds are we're in great shape to win that series. I mean there's lots of teams out there that can between a quality line and D, shut down Crosby. Those teams might even have a 2nd line that can do the same to Malkin. There's maybe 3 teams in the league that could do that to Brassard/Kessel if they can click. Those are good odds - really good odds.

Crosby could go pointless in the POs if he's taking all the matchup's and shutting other teams down, while allowing L2/L3 to feast, and I'd be good with it as long as we were winning.

 

[Riptide]

I am guessing that no team plays a fourt line in the playoffs against the Pens. They go three lines deep to try and match up.

Or... you do what Washington did in 15/16. You have a FO in the OZ... and you have to put out your 4th line because everyone else needs a break. You need a goal... but that's your only option to rest guys.

I really wish I could find that Barry Trotz article that was written after the 15/16 playoffs. Maybe in Aug/Sept? There were some great comments in there about how he tried to deal with our lines then.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

Or... you do what Washington did in 15/16. You have a FO in the OZ... and you have to put out your 4th line because everyone else needs a break. You need a goal... but that's your only option to rest guys.

I really wish I could find that Barry Trotz article that was written after the 15/16 playoffs. Maybe in Aug/Sept? There were some great comments in there about how he tried to deal with our lines then.

Everyone of them tried to hit the Pens into submission ....... for three games. Then gave up already down in a hole they couldn't get out of.

They never learned then, I suspect that they will not now.

We will see that again this playoffs.

 

[Peat]

Yes. This should be the reincarnation of HBK, but on steroids. I simply am not expecting them to come out of the gates on fire, but I hope that I am pleasantly surprised. There usually is an adjustment period to a new team and new linemates.

You're right but I'm a bit more optimistic than I normally would be given that Sully's coached Brassard before and what he's doing here is pretty similar to what NYR have done. Can't ask for a better chance of a fit than that.

Should definitely keep a lid on my expectations though.

 

[Dey so soff*]

I really feel like Kessel and Brassard are gonna gel

Like hot dogs and mustard?

 

[Riptide]

Found it. Barry Trotz, August 2016
Barry Trotz on Subban vs. Weber, Radulov's return, playoff disappointments (Puck Daddy Q&A Part II)

"Where did we lose the series? We thought we lost the series last year in terms of the bottom end of our roster, the three and four lines got outplayed, but Pitt’s third-line outplayed everybody’s third and fourth line."

Q re PIT's speed:
"I think what Pittsburgh did against us, is their defense never made a D-to-D pass other than (Kris) Letang. They got it and they flipped it out. Their mantra was ‘as soon as the puck’s over the blueline, get it out as quick as possible’ and they would flip pucks out. They got it, hammered it out and chased it down. <snip> They simplified their game defensively with their defense – get it and get it out quickly and don’t try to make too many plays. I thought they did a really good job. Everybody talks about their speed offensively, but the speed I found was more dangerous defensively. It allowed them to defend better because they got back quicker. They were very committed to blocking shots. They collapsed and got in the lanes and they were very committed defensively. They had good goaltending and played strong, structural defense. They were committed on all four lines. "

"And then they deployed their third and fourth lines – some teams would say ‘how did they get so much time out of that Matt Cullen line?’ Well they had a lot of faith in Cullen and Crosby and Bonino’s line so what they would do, you’d get in the offensive zone and they would stick Cullen’s line out there. So I’m going ‘we’re down a goal, why put Mike Richards’ line out there when I could put Backstrom’s or Kuznetsov’s line out there against Cullen?’ But they were very good defensively and good on draws and that’s how they deployed their fourth-line and you would be trailing the game, so your fourth-line didn’t get a lot of time because you didn’t have the fourth-line that they did. I wasn’t putting my fourth line out when Crosby was in our end. I was going with Backstrom, so Backstrom was getting extra shifts. That happened with every series they played because their fourth line was that good defensively for them."

This is what we'll likely be doing again this year.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

Found it. Barry Trotz, August 2016
Barry Trotz on Subban vs. Weber, Radulov's return, playoff disappointments (Puck Daddy Q&A Part II)

"Where did we lose the series? We thought we lost the series last year in terms of the bottom end of our roster, the three and four lines got outplayed, but Pitt’s third-line outplayed everybody’s third and fourth line."

Q re PIT's speed:
"I think what Pittsburgh did against us, is their defense never made a D-to-D pass other than (Kris) Letang. They got it and they flipped it out. Their mantra was ‘as soon as the puck’s over the blueline, get it out as quick as possible’ and they would flip pucks out. They got it, hammered it out and chased it down. <snip> They simplified their game defensively with their defense – get it and get it out quickly and don’t try to make too many plays. I thought they did a really good job. Everybody talks about their speed offensively, but the speed I found was more dangerous defensively. It allowed them to defend better because they got back quicker. They were very committed to blocking shots. They collapsed and got in the lanes and they were very committed defensively. They had good goaltending and played strong, structural defense. They were committed on all four lines. "

"And then they deployed their third and fourth lines – some teams would say ‘how did they get so much time out of that Matt Cullen line?’ Well they had a lot of faith in Cullen and Crosby and Bonino’s line so what they would do, you’d get in the offensive zone and they would stick Cullen’s line out there. So I’m going ‘we’re down a goal, why put Mike Richards’ line out there when I could put Backstrom’s or Kuznetsov’s line out there against Cullen?’ But they were very good defensively and good on draws and that’s how they deployed their fourth-line and you would be trailing the game, so your fourth-line didn’t get a lot of time because you didn’t have the fourth-line that they did. I wasn’t putting my fourth line out when Crosby was in our end. I was going with Backstrom, so Backstrom was getting extra shifts. That happened with every series they played because their fourth line was that good defensively for them."

This is what we'll likely be doing again this year.

Obviously that is exactly the plan with Sheahan and Brassard in their bottom six.

And given that everyone in WBS plays the same game they can call one of those no name defensemen, or forward for that matter, up and plug them in without missing a beat.

 

[Riptide]

One thing i like about the Brassard trade is, that if Crosby or Malkin go down for a series vs a team not named Tampa...we still would have a chance in the series.

Even if they don't... Brassard with Guentzel/Sheary and Rust/X is likely enough to still abuse teams, and you put Kessel with Crosby. Or you go back to JG - RS - PK, and put DB on the wing with Crosby.

Obviously these would be less than ideal... but as long as we're winning, and playing the right way, it should be very entertaining.

 

[Riptide]

Obviously that is exactly the plan with Sheahan and Brassard in their bottom six.

And given that everyone in WBS plays the same game they can call one of those no name defensemen, or forward for that matter, up and plug them in without missing a beat.

Hopefully. I'm not entirely convinced about that. I mean who do we have in WBS that we actually trust to play any minutes (F/D)? Simon? Sprong? Jooris? Other than JJ, I bet DS/DS do not see 10 games combined. And on the blueline... only Trotman and Corrado have played any games for us, and Trotman sucked. Corrado was better, but even in the RS was very sheltered and received limited icetime. The fact that they're playing the same system is key... but I'm really hesitant on trusting any of our depth aside from JJ - and that's only because he's better than Rowney.

There are also a few things that we're doing differently. We're not getting the puck out of the zone nearly as fast as we were in 15/16. Those 'murphy dumps' (the ones that go up really high, but land near the red/blueline), or dumping pucks and relying on Hagelin/Rust/Sheary's speed to chase the pucks down, do not happen nearly as often as they used to. A lot more D-D passes and not going north as quickly. At least not as consistently.

The defensive stuff we'll just have to start doing it... but we haven't so far. I'm not too concerned about that... but it's something we will have to pick up very very quickly with only 19 games left before the POs.