Phil Kessel vs Daniel Alfredsson

[Cap'n Flavour]

If Alfredsson is such a great leader how come we never saw him give Lalime the Heimlich maneuver in the playoffs?

 

[joe dirte]

Showing lack of knowledge again, as that was Pittsburgh. Like I said, won the leadership award from 700 players.

Probably not.

 

[NyQuil]

If Alfredsson is such a great leader how come we never saw him give Lalime the Heimlich maneuver in the playoffs?

We saw him lead the Stanley Cup playoffs in goals and points.

 

[Karl Eriksson]

Alfredsson never played centre.

Your opinion lacks credibility.

Burn

This one is ready to be locked for lopsided result. Hot dog man got creamed.

 

[trentmccleary]

Best 10 season averages (not adjusted, but the last stat is the NHL average GPG in those seasons):
Alfredsson produced at a noticeably higher rate in slightly lower scoring NHL seasons.

Best 10-yrs	GP	G	A	Pts	GPG	PPG	Avg-GPG
DA11	73	30	48	78	0.41	1.07	2.79
PK81	79	31	42	73	0.40	0.92	2.82

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Stats like takeaways, giveaways, hits and blocks weren't counted until 1 season into Kessel's career and when Alfie turned 35yo... so only the twilight of his career is counted.

Player	GP	BLK	Hit	TKA	GVA
PK81	926	218	155	389	677
DA11	463	206	333	376	334

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Between the ages of 35-40yo, Alfredsson finished 4,5,12,13th in takeaways among all NHL players per season.

Player	GP	SH TOI	SH TOI/GP
DA11	1088	1434.14	1:19
PK81	996	57.21	0:03

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Selke voting placements:
Alfredsson = 4, 10,11,15,20,35,38
P. Kessel = N/A

 

[Albus Dumbledore]

Alfie was the better player hands down. But let's not downplay some of the great teams he was apart of and some of his insane linemates.

Alfie was never a ppg player consistently till age 30 all the way too age 37. He had some crazy players like spezza,heatley havlat,hossa. Some combination of that. I dont believe he was ever outscoring them or was the best offensive player they were all in close.

Kessel in his Toronto days was the de facto best player and was the best scorer hands down.


But add in Alfie overall game and hes better. Just offense is closer then it seems.

 

[trentmccleary]

Alfie was the better player hands down. But let's not downplay some of the great teams he was apart of and some of his insane linemates.

Alfie was never a ppg player consistently till age 30 all the way too age 37. He had some crazy players like spezza,heatley havlat,hossa. Some combination of that. I dont believe he was ever outscoring them or was the best offensive player they were all in close.

Kessel in his Toronto days was the de facto best player and was the best scorer hands down.


But add in Alfie overall game and hes better. Just offense is closer then it seems.

2015-2019 Pittsburgh
Kessel = 303 points
with Crosby and/or Malkin = 204 points
Elite player collaboration = 67.3%

2005-2009 Ottawa
Alfredsson = 353 points
with Spezza and/or Heatley = 226 points
Elite player collaboration = 64.0 %

Out of Alfredsson's 1157 points, he collaborated with Hossa 37 times and Havlat maybe 25 times. They were competition for offensive opportunities for Alfredsson, they were not beneficial.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

I never liked Alfredsson and I'm a Kessel fan, but Alfredsson was the better player

 

[Albus Dumbledore]

2015-2019 Pittsburgh
Kessel = 303 points
with Crosby and/or Malkin = 204 points
Elite player collaboration = 67.3%

2005-2009 Ottawa
Alfredsson = 353 points
with Spezza and/or Heatley = 226 points
Elite player collaboration = 64.0 %

Out of Alfredsson's 1157 points, he collaborated with Hossa 37 times and Havlat maybe 25 times. They were competition for offensive opportunities for Alfredsson, they were not beneficial.

Sure but spezz and heatley and Alfie all helped each other get amazing totals without them hes really not better then kessel offensively.

Kessel in Toronto has outscored his linemates moderately to significantly in a 3 year span.

 

[trentmccleary]

Sure but spezz and heatley and Alfie all helped each other get amazing totals without them hes really not better then kessel offensively.

Kessel in Toronto has outscored his linemates moderately to significantly in a 3 year span.

PP Game rank over a 5 season period (min. 250 GP):
2000-2004: Alfredsson was 7th in PPG
2006-2010: Alfredsson was 5th in PPG

We know he played extensively with Spezza and Heatley between 2006-2010. But who were his elite linemates from 2000-2004?

Kessel is easy to explain. Massive defensively liability whose offensive stats are to some extent; smoke and mirrors.
Boston: didn't score much because he was new to the league, but also because his minutes were heavily managed to keep him from being detrimental.
Toronto: allowed to do whatever he wanted to score (a la Kovalchuk in Atlanta). In 4 1/2 seasons in Toronto, he was -80. That's basically what should expect if you try to use a player like this as your 'Franchise player'.
Pittsburgh: recognizing that he was a liability at even strength, they gave him a whopping 65% offensive zone starts.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Alfie was the better player hands down. But let's not downplay some of the great teams he was apart of and some of his insane linemates.

Alfie was never a ppg player consistently till age 30 all the way too age 37. He had some crazy players like spezza,heatley havlat,hossa. Some combination of that. I dont believe he was ever outscoring them or was the best offensive player they were all in close.

Kessel in his Toronto days was the de facto best player and was the best scorer hands down.


But add in Alfie overall game and hes better. Just offense is closer then it seems.

Alfie was PPG or above in 8/10 seasons between the ages of 27-37

He led the team in scoring by a 22pt margin in his rookie year, and led the team in scoring or PPG several times

I agree, theyre close offensively but Alfie could dominate a shift to an extent that Phil cannot

 

[Albus Dumbledore]

Alfie was PPG or above in 8/10 seasons between the ages of 27-37

He led the team in scoring by a 22pt margin in his rookie year, and led the team in scoring or PPG several times

I agree, theyre close offensively but Alfie could dominate a shift to an extent that Phil cannot

His overall impact was just too much I agree but yeah offensively they were close.

 

[Albus Dumbledore]

PP Game rank over a 5 season period (min. 250 GP):
2000-2004: Alfredsson was 7th in PPG
2006-2010: Alfredsson was 5th in PPG

We know he played extensively with Spezza and Heatley between 2006-2010. But who were his elite linemates from 2000-2004?

Kessel is easy to explain. Massive defensively liability whose offensive stats are to some extent; smoke and mirrors.
Boston: didn't score much because he was new to the league, but also because his minutes were heavily managed to keep him from being detrimental.
Toronto: allowed to do whatever he wanted to score (a la Kovalchuk in Atlanta). In 4 1/2 seasons in Toronto, he was -80. That's basically what should expect if you try to use a player like this as your 'Franchise player'.
Pittsburgh: recognizing that he was a liability at even strength, they gave him a whopping 65% offensive zone starts.

But that's what in getting at offensively they are close. Once you take into account who they played with and the teams they were on.

We all know Alfie is better but in terms of offense only it's close.

 

[spiny norman]

Lopsided result.