Prospect Info: Phantoms (AHL), Reading Royals (ECHL), NCAA, Jrs., Int'l, etc. [Winter 2021 edition]

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deadhead

Registered User
Feb 26, 2014
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Any particular reason you left out GP? Just your usual bad faith nonsense, I assume. Let’s quickly expose just how full of shit you are.

In 15-16 when he was “just ahead” of Medvedev, Gudas played 76 games and Medvedev only played 45. MacDonald only played 28 games, and that was only after MDZ got hurt. That’s why his average ES TOI was inflated up to 17:33. By your simple minded analysis, AMac was the #2 dman on the 15-16 Flyers even though he spent most of the season in the AHL.

In 16-17 when you claim Gudas was only 3rd in ES minutes, Hagg is in the number one spot at 19:45. Except he only played one game. One.

Medvedev couldn't stay healthy, but when he played, he played significant minutes.
Dillon and Montour played limited games, but as soon as they were acquired by their teams at the TDL they played more minutes than Gudas.

His Flyer usage declined in his 3rd and 4th seasons, his usage in Washington was below his Flyer level, and it's only this season that Florida has used him in a top 4 role, beating out Montour and moving into the slot vacated by Stralman.

PS: guess what defenseman played 13 games for Florida before he was waived?
 

deadhead

Registered User
Feb 26, 2014
49,215
21,617
At some point you've gotta stop shooting yourself in the foot by presenting information made useless by stripped context and pretending it's a gotcha.

Well it is a gotcha, but for yourself.

Nothing stripped, I presented his minutes each year.
And the players who had similar minutes (a few seconds either way is noise).

People just don't like when facts refute extreme positions:
1) no evidence that the Flyer "development" is ruining players, at worst, it hasn't maximized the value of marginal forwards
2) no evidence that the Flyers hemorrhaged talent the last decade, unless you pine for Cousins and NAK.
3) that suggests the primary problem was obtaining talent in the draft and acquiring value in trades. Other than draft picks, who have they picked up in trades, waiver wire claims, etc.?

The rebound by the Phantoms, and their improved quality of play with lesser talent, points to years of bad coaching that may have hampered the development of marginal prospects (defined by those who don't stand out in CHL D+1, D+2, college, SHL seasons) - but it didn't seem to slow the progress of top prospects.

The loss of talent doesn't explain the decline from 2019-20 to this season, Voracek, Myers and Hagg v Risto, Yandle and Atkinson isn't enough to move the needle. Ghost wasn't even playing when they looked like a real team two years ago.
And the other other Flyers still playing from the 2019-20 team are Raffl, NAK, and Pitlick. Vorobyev is in the KHL and Twarynski in the AHL.
The problem is the loss of Ellis (Niskanen), Couts, Hayes, and AV's coaching meltdown.

What stands out is the lack of new talent two years later.
York is the only player added since that run. Frost has returned. Bunnaman hasn't improved. Willman?.
Where are all the prospects drafted in 2016-18 that should have arrived by now? Hart and Farabee were on the 2019-20 team.
 
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Beef Invictus

Revolutionary Positivity
Dec 21, 2009
128,087
166,003
Armored Train
Nothing stripped, I presented his minutes each year.
And the players who had similar minutes (a few seconds either way is noise).

People just don't like when facts refute extreme positions:
1) no evidence that the Flyer "development" is ruining players, at worst, it hasn't maximized the value of marginal forwards
2) no evidence that the Flyers hemorrhaged talent the last decade, unless you pine for Cousins and NAK.
3) that suggests the primary problem was obtaining talent in the draft and acquiring value in trades. Other than draft picks, who have they picked up in trades, waiver wire claims, etc.?

The rebound by the Phantoms, and their improved quality of play with lesser talent, points to years of bad coaching that may have hampered the development of marginal prospects (defined by those who don't stand out in CHL D+1, D+2, college, SHL seasons) - but it didn't seem to slow the progress of top prospects.

The loss of talent doesn't explain the decline from 2019-20 to this season, Voracek, Myers and Hagg v Risto, Yandle and Atkinson isn't enough to move the needle. Ghost wasn't even playing when they looked like a real team two years ago.
And the other other Flyers still playing from the 2019-20 team are Raffl, NAK, and Pitlick. Vorobyev is in the KHL and Twarynski in the AHL.
The problem is the loss of Ellis (Niskanen), Couts, Hayes, and AV's coaching meltdown.

What stands out is the lack of new talent two years later.
York is the only player added since that run. Frost has returned. Bunnaman hasn't improved. Willman?.
Where are all the prospects drafted in 2016-18 that should have arrived by now? Hart and Farabee were on the 2019-20 team.

Just total nonsense from start to finish.

Your refusal to accept truth doesn't make truth false.
 

deadhead

Registered User
Feb 26, 2014
49,215
21,617
As someone who’s stepped back from Flyers obsession in the past two years, have any of our prospects taken any real steps forward this season?

The ones not in the system yet,

Desnoyers has had a great season, McConnell is racking up points on a loaded team in the CHL, Brink, Attard, St Ivany in college, McLaughin is shining in the USHL, Fedotov is one of the top goalies in the KHL.

Zamula has steadily progressed on the Phantoms, and a number of forwards have started to step it up the last month or two.

York is on the Flyers and holding his own, Willman is making a good case for a 4th line slot.

Foerster is still injured, as are Allison and Laczynski, Wisdom is back in the CHL working his way into game shape.
 

gertbfrobe16

Registered User
Feb 3, 2018
5,553
7,563
As someone who’s stepped back from Flyers obsession in the past two years, have any of our prospects taken any real steps forward this season?
Just the ones they traded or were claimed off of waivers
 

Tripod

I hate this team
Aug 12, 2008
78,855
86,249
Nova Scotia
we haven’t traded or lost a prospect on waivers in at least 2 years except for Patrick if you still considered him a prospect
We waived a 25 year old who is on pace for 33 points since leaving our dysfunctional organization. But hey, we still have that great 37 year old C!

NAK has 13 pts in 32 games for Avs

Nate, MacEwen, Brown, Willman, Bunny have 11 points in 119 games combined.
 

BernieParent

In misery of redwings of suckage for a long time
Mar 13, 2009
24,678
44,313
Chasm of Sar (north of Montreal, Qc)
We waived a 25 year old who is on pace for 33 points since leaving our dysfunctional organization. But hey, we still have that great 37 year old C!

NAK has 13 pts in 32 games for Avs

Nate, MacEwen, Brown, Willman, Bunny have 11 points in 119 games combined.

"That's all you can expect from your fourth line."
 

Flyerfan18

Registered User
Dec 2, 2017
1,160
595
We waived a 25 year old who is on pace for 33 points since leaving our dysfunctional organization. But hey, we still have that great 37 year old C!

NAK has 13 pts in 32 games for Avs

Nate, MacEwen, Brown, Willman, Bunny have 11 points in 119 games combined.

25 yr olds aren’t prospects anymore. The question was about prospects. Why are you talking about NAK?
 

deadhead

Registered User
Feb 26, 2014
49,215
21,617
We waived a 25 year old who is on pace for 33 points since leaving our dysfunctional organization. But hey, we still have that great 37 year old C!

NAK has 13 pts in 32 games for Avs

Nate, MacEwen, Brown, Willman, Bunny have 11 points in 119 games combined.

NAK was on pace for the same two years ago, then last year was one of our worst forwards.

While he's a slight loss, let's not exaggerate, given his inconsistency, and the fact his rebound came on Colorado (probably the easiest team for a 4th line forward to garner points given their D-men), it's doubtful he'd be nearly as productive in Philly, even with a better HC.
CFrel -3.95, xGFrel -1.13, playing 10:16 per game. Last year, CFrel -0.19, xGFrel -3.71, playing 10:49 a game.

The fact that he doesn't PK, and doesn't play center limits his value, even as a 4th line forward.
He's a RFA next year, so it'll be interesting to see if Colorado tries to keep him.

Sure he's better than MacEwen, who has been a disappointment (look ma, no hands), but next year it's going to be a bit more crowded at forward.
IF Allison can ever stay healthy, Laczynski, Brink, Foerster, with Wisdom, JOB, McClennon in the wings. Sandin may get a shot later this year if he continues his revival in LHV.
 

Captain Dave Poulin

Imaginary Cat
Apr 30, 2015
68,276
200,392
Tokyo, JP
We waived a 25 year old who is on pace for 33 points since leaving our dysfunctional organization. But hey, we still have that great 37 year old C!

NAK has 13 pts in 32 games for Avs

Nate, MacEwen, Brown, Willman, Bunny have 11 points in 119 games combined.

A compassionate person wouldn't have felt the need to include Bunny in that. Be better.
 

landsbergfan

Registered User
Jun 20, 2018
6,760
24,097
Sorry Cap'n, but Bunnaman may be in the cooking pot.
He looks a little better lately, but not good enough to even pencil in next year.
Savetoby_com___Only_YOU_have_the_power_to_Save_Toby_.jpg
 

FLYguy3911

Sanheim Lover
Oct 19, 2006
53,164
86,555
Happened to Laughton and Sanheim, too. It's like they decide what their NHL roles will be on draft day, and it doesn't matter how they develop.
Sanheim at least got secondary work behind TJ Brennan (lol).

They wouldn’t even play Laughton on the PP his last year with the Phantoms after spending chunks of time in the NHL. No good teams do that.
 

pit

5th Most Improved Poster
Jun 25, 2005
5,001
20,348
Toronto
Happened to Laughton and Sanheim, too. It's like they decide what their NHL roles will be on draft day, and it doesn't matter how they develop.

Remember when Couturier had to go and request that he be given a chance on a scoring line because they had pigeon-holed him in at 3C?

"I'm 24, turning 25 soon,' said Couturier, whose birthday is Dec. 7. "It's really the year where if I wanted to be known as more than just a defensive guy I had to step up and put pressure on the coaches, the organization, to put me in this situation."

"I didn't go in there throwing chairs, I wasn't yelling at him," Couturier said with a laugh. "… Last year was really the first time that I maybe expressed a little frustration with the way I was put into situations to succeed. I thought to myself, 'I've waited long enough.' It was my sixth year last year and I really wanted to take a step forward and this was the only thing missing."

Couturier showing off offensive skills with Flyers


Yeah, good times.
 

Beef Invictus

Revolutionary Positivity
Dec 21, 2009
128,087
166,003
Armored Train
Remember when Couturier had to go and request that he be given a chance on a scoring line because they had pigeon-holed him in at 3C?



Couturier showing off offensive skills with Flyers


Yeah, good times.

Or how they really wanted to refuse to use Frost because they think he's a top 6 center and therefore unfit to play in the bottom 6, so if he isn't a clear top 6 center he shouldn't be anywhere on the roster. But also bottom 6 is a need for them, so they're trying to brutalize the skill out of him to turn him into what they think they need.

They're just stupid people.
 

renberg

Registered User
Dec 31, 2003
6,852
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Lewes Delaware
forums.hfboards.com
The Flyers deciding from Day Zero that Sanheim isn't a PP player is unspeakably dumb. But it's what they've done. And because the same brain trust handles all hiring to fit the same hockeythought patterns, these decisions last through regimes. Really amazing incompetence.
Many organizations are like this. They draft a guy for a certain reason; plug them in to do that and never change the guy's role. If another organization is smart and can see how a guy might flourish in a different role, they'd wise to trade for him and use him in a better manner. Occasionally the Flyers have done that but not recently.
 
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