Peter Klima: Players in the 80s couldn't skate, a modern player would outscore Gordie Howe 1000x

[Hobnobs]

True and this has been analyzed many times here especially with players that overlapped eras like Gretzky, Messier, Lemieux, Jagr, etc. They all did well in overlapping eras. Heck Jagr at age 44 in 2015-2016 playing on the Panthers was the team's leading scorer and had nearly 30 goals.

Humans did not evolve that rapidly (we did not all of a sudden become super humans) but rather the equipment and rule changes had a much more substantial role in how the game is played and overall "appearance" to the average viewer. Training helps too quite a bit and the human body is remarkable in it's ability to adapt as well.

These are the elite players.. The outliers for these type of discussions. They dont represent the average player in the NHL.

When Klima came over he played mostly in the Norris division. So the defensemen he is talking about is guys like Ric Natress, Brad Maxwell and Hospodar.

No humans didn't evolve into super humans. No one has said that. But players did take practice and training more seriously during the 90s. This is something most players have talked about that played or started playing in this era. How the professional mentallity evolved.

 

[Yozhik v tumane]

What????
I can assure you that playing video games probably helped no one to play hockey.
Maybe in other sports though I doubt it

I recall like 20 years ago reading that Madden video game strategies led some players to start stalling their touchdowns by running along the line thus running the clock for a bit before scoring, as I guess you’d routinely do in order to piss of your buddy. Does strike me as odd that this wouldn’t have been prevalent earlier though, given that similar clock management certainly had been applied for long in other sports.

 

[daver]

These are the elite players.. The outliers for these type of discussions. They dont represent the average player in the NHL.

The elite players are the elite of the elite i.e. the 1% of players who had the talent to play in the NHL in addition to the required work ethic and compete level.

And the elite were still dominating the "average player" regardless of the era.

That being said, not sure what you are saying here. That older players should be rated lower than current players?

 

[gretzkyoilers]

The elite players are the elite of the elite i.e. the 1% of players who had the talent to play in the NHL in addition to the required work ethic and compete level.

And the elite were still dominating the "average player" regardless of the era.

That being said, not sure what you are saying here. That older players should be rated lower than current players?

Agreed. Also the 80's brought in bigger contracts and off season training, and this got more refined over time. Like I mentioned equipment changes have been HUGE (skates, sticks, protection, goalie equipment), where it has given the average player a better shot and can skate more efficiently. However, comparing bottom players relative to top players, the gap has always been the same. Watch an Oilers game: some of their 3rd and 4th liners are just awful! Can't shoot, no hockey sense, horrible plays...

 

[Minar]

If what Klima is saying Is correct then why didn't the European players that came into the NHL in the early 90s skate circles around everybody? It's not like a Makarov who was one of Russia's best players dominated the league when he came in. He was a point per game player and so was Federov. If Klima is correct then these players would have been skating circles around all these slow defenseman and dominating the league.

 

[BraveCanadian]

No humans didn't evolve into super humans. No one has said that. But players did take practice and training more seriously during the 90s. This is something most players have talked about that played or started playing in this era. How the professional mentallity evolved.

I really question why people keep repeating this.. there were players that practiced constantly and trained practically every free moment in the 90s and there are players that look like they have never seen a gym playing today too. By the 90s the NHL had long been paying players more than enough that it was their full time job.

What exactly is taking practice and training more "seriously"?

 

[Hobnobs]

I really question why people keep repeating this.. there were players that practiced constantly and trained practically every free moment in the 90s and there are players that look like they have never seen a gym playing today too. By the 90s the NHL had long been paying players more than enough that it was their full time job.

What exactly is taking practice and training more "seriously"?

How about not partying or drinking before practice/game days? Something thats been widely reported that it was going on well into the 90s.

I didnt say no one took practice seriously but you cant tell me the players in the league was as professional in all aspects as they are today when it comes to diet, workout, preparation etc etc.

 

[BraveCanadian]

How about not partying or drinking before practice/game days? Something thats been widely reported that it was going on well into the 90s.

I didnt say no one took practice seriously but you cant tell me the players in the league was as professional in all aspects as they are today when it comes to diet, workout, preparation etc etc.

This is just cliche.. and the idea that players today don’t do the same is laughable. We have plenty of reported instances of players getting themselves into interesting situations in the press and even players seeking help regularly for substance abuse lately.

 

[Run the Gauntlet]

If what Klima is saying Is correct then why didn't the European players that came into the NHL in the early 90s skate circles around everybody? It's not like a Makarov who was one of Russia's best players dominated the league when he came in. He was a point per game player and so was Federov. If Klima is correct then these players would have been skating circles around all these slow defenseman and dominating the league.

Even without Europeans, the NHL had already become a much tougher league in the early 90's.
Europeans just helped the league become even more exclusive.
Klima might be giving Europeans too much credit because he comes from Europe, but it does not mean his opinion is wrong.

 

[sr edler]

If what Klima is saying Is correct then why didn't the European players that came into the NHL in the early 90s skate circles around everybody? It's not like a Makarov who was one of Russia's best players dominated the league when he came in. He was a point per game player and so was Federov. If Klima is correct then these players would have been skating circles around all these slow defenseman and dominating the league.

You can't really skate circles around people in the NHL because the ice is too small, and at this time you could clutch and grab and rough people up as well, but I remember watching footage of Soviet Union vs Canada from the 1990 Worlds, and the Soviets were literally skating circles around the Canadians, eventually winning the game 7-1. This Canadian team included guys like Paul Coffey, Doug Gilmour, Brian Bellows, Steve Yzerman, Rick Tocchet, Mark Recchi, Joe Nieuwendyk, Al MacInnis, Theo Fleury, Jamie Macoun, John Cullen.

Younger European players like Selänne, Bure, Mogilny, Forsberg, Fedorov, Jagr, Lidström, also made fairly pain-free transitions to the NA game. If a young-ish first-year Euro player scores 76 goals on a season, that is a fairly eyebrow raising thing.

Btw, Makarov did well for his age. Mike Bossy was out of the league at an earlier age.