Post-Game Talk: Pens 3, Canes 2 - Kunitz Ties Guentzel for 2nd to Last Among Forwards in Goals

[66-30-33]

Sorry for posting that, but when people are going full yinzer, it's hilarious and sad at the same time for me.

The love Fleury and Kunitz have is DISGUSTING! Sure, they may be nice people outside of hockey but the world has lots of nice people too. I want to win, not lose and be frusterated, a lot of people don't seem to want the same thing because they are "nice people". That's how you build a great team, have a team full of nice players!!! cups every year.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

The love Fleury and Kunitz have is DISGUSTING! Sure, they may be nice people outside of hockey but the world has lots of nice people too. I want to win, not lose and be frusterated, a lot of people don't seem to want the same thing because they are "nice people". That's how you build a great team, have a team full of nice players!!! cups every year.

The bolded is so accurate. It's not even their fault (Fleury/Kunitz), so I'm not blaming them or anything for those kind of idiotic tweets. But man, fans like that make me wonder how people can watch a hockey game and draw those kinds of conclusions.

There's watching a hockey game and understanding the nuances of the game, and then there's those idiots who probably can't grasp the game beyond the absolute basics they learned from playing video game hockey.

 

[PensPlz]

I'm not sure the downside of Fleury doing well in net. His trade value going up should motivate anyone to cheer for him. Anyone scared of this organization picking Fleury over Murray for the future is pretty dramatic, and any media trying to make a case for Fluery over Murray for the future is just click-baiting.

Kunitz isn't going anywhere even if they wanted him gone, he's just untradeable imo. So him scoring a goal now and then is also a good thing. Just something we have to deal with.

If when the first period ended you told me we were going to win his game with Murray not playing the third then I would said you were crazy. We were very outplayed, even in the third where Fleury made 19 saves. But we pulled out a team win with some players who don't show up contributing. Good for us. Yay.

 

[PensPlz]

Also, a game with zero penalties. How often does that happen?

 

[KrisLetAngry]

Also, a game with zero penalties. How often does that happen?

As often as Kunitz scores

 

[billybudd]

If there was an award for doing everything right to get a scoring chance and then getting no puck luck on the finish, Scott Wilson would win it. He was the exact opposite in the AHL. All the glorious chances he gets were just buried every time. It doesn't look to me like he's doing anything wrong either; the puck just doesn't go in.

Daley was really bad btw. Totally responsible for both goals. Brutal defense. That happens when you come back rusty and need to play 20+.

The one goal, he confused the Hell out of me. Schultz picks his guy up and then Daley...picks up Schultz's guy, too, while Daley's guy (Lindholm?) wasn't covered in the low slot with a great screen. Good to see him back a little early, but I didn't understand that sequence at all.

 

[Son Goku]

Come to think of it, how big of a bust has Eric Fehr been for us? Thought he would be a solid contributor for us but nada.

 

[Gurglesons]

Come to think of it, how big of a bust has Eric Fehr been for us? Thought he would be a solid contributor for us but nada.

Having a player like Fehr as a 12th/13th forward is great. He can play center and wing. He can PK, and he has enough skill to not look completely out of place if we have some real big issues in our top six in terms of injuries. He's getting paid 2 million a year. Fehr being in our bottom six is one of the reasons we won last year, and it's not like he doesn't get scratched for younger players, so who really cares. He's the same reason you pick up a player like Seidenberg if you're a championship squad, because it is insurance in case someone like Rust or Hornqvist gets a puck in their face randomly and has a broken jaw in the playoffs.

 

[orby]

Fehr has been less good than most people anticipated but for a fourth liner i think he's at least passable. Definitely not a great fit for Sullivan's system but at least he can occasionally score and has a few big goals as a Penguin.

 

[Ogrezilla]

The one goal, he confused the Hell out of me. Schultz picks his guy up and then Daley...picks up Schultz's guy, too, while Daley's guy (Lindholm?) wasn't covered in the low slot with a great screen. Good to see him back a little early, but I didn't understand that sequence at all.

confusion from playing the opposite side of the ice that he's used to? I mean, it shouldn't have mattered, but its the best I can think of.

 

[NMK11]

Come to think of it, how big of a bust has Eric Fehr been for us? Thought he would be a solid contributor for us but nada.

I wonder how much is from playing the wing. He always looked good at center for the caps, and I wonder if he was flanked by two fast wingers he could prove to be a solid anchor for the bottom six if Cullen and Bonino are gone.

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

Fehr has been less good than most people anticipated but for a fourth liner i think he's at least passable. Definitely not a great fit for Sullivan's system but at least he can occasionally score and has a few big goals as a Penguin.

This goes along with what i ways saying yesterday, which i think i burried in the wrong thread.

Fehr IS less good than people thought but when he's your 13th forward and when he plays he's the worst player on the ice for your team and still is a 20ish point 4th liner than can PK, you really dont have any problems.

As far as Kunitz hate i get it, he doesnt have anywhere near the jump he used to and his hands are pretty much toast but...

His GF% is 5th best forward on the team above 60%
His GA/60 is the 3rd best for forwards on the team
His Corsi % is the 6th best among forwards above 53%

So yeah, he aint the player he used to be, and he sure as **** aint driving the train offensively while he is out there but for anyone to look at those facts and say that he bring NOTHING are either missing something or just miserable and need something to complain about.

Now thats not to say he cant be replaced or upgraded but the unabashed hate is just silly.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Are there advanced stats for turnovers, bad passes, and the like?

 

[Crosbyfan]

Nice to see Fleury turn around what seemed like a game heading for a loss, and great to see defensive grinder extraordinaire Kunitz tie a sniper like Guentzel in goals this season, albeit in a couple more games.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

This goes along with what i ways saying yesterday, which i think i burried in the wrong thread.

Fehr IS less good than people thought but when he's your 13th forward and when he plays he's the worst player on the ice for your team and still is a 20ish point 4th liner than can PK, you really dont have any problems.

As far as Kunitz hate i get it, he doesnt have anywhere near the jump he used to and his hands are pretty much toast but...

His GF% is 5th best forward on the team above 60%
His GA/60 is the 3rd best for forwards on the team
His Corsi % is the 6th best among forwards above 53%

So yeah, he aint the player he used to be, and he sure as **** aint driving the train offensively while he is out there but for anyone to look at those facts and say that he bring NOTHING are either missing something or just miserable and need something to complain about.

Now thats not to say he cant be replaced or upgraded but the unabashed hate is just silly.

He makes $2 mil. That's too much for what he's brought this year. I know salaries are always going up but $2 million should get you more than veteran savvy and about 15 points (which is what he's on pace for this year even though he got 14 last year in 55 games).

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

He makes $2 mil. That's too much for what he's brought this year. I know salaries are always going up but $2 million should get you more than veteran savvy and about 15 points (which is what he's on pace for this year even though he got 14 last year in 55 games).

Yeah, he's slightly overpaid but nothing absurd and easily movable if they needed the space.

My general point though is that if this guy is your biggest roster issue then your in great shape.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

The bolded is so accurate. It's not even their fault (Fleury/Kunitz), so I'm not blaming them or anything for those kind of idiotic tweets. But man, fans like that make me wonder how people can watch a hockey game and draw those kinds of conclusions.

There's watching a hockey game and understanding the nuances of the game, and then there's those idiots who probably can't grasp the game beyond the absolute basics they learned from playing video game hockey.

The tweets make me cringe every night, but hey it's the team that fosters that kind of stuff. Their marketing feeds into it.

Last night was the worst though: The Penguin twitter account had to compose a message saying they didn't know why the team changed goaltenders. In other words, they had to request that people stop asking some intern manning the Twitter feed why Sullivan made a certain decision at ice level. People legitimately think the general Penguin twitter account is an all-knowing oracle of information. That's just sad.

 

[Ogrezilla]

He makes $2 mil. That's too much for what he's brought this year. I know salaries are always going up but $2 million should get you more than veteran savvy and about 15 points (which is what he's on pace for this year even though he got 14 last year in 55 games).

until we have another use for that 2M, it really doesn't matter what he's paid though. If we need the cap space for something, then sure move him. But until then, who cares what he's paid?

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

until we have another use for that 2M, it really doesn't matter what he's paid though. If we need the cap space for something, then sure move him. But until then, who cares what he's paid?

I'm not clamoring for him to be dealt, but to suggest he's been fine is to fail to consider how much money he makes, which is pretty much all that matters.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

As far as Kunitz hate i get it, he doesnt have anywhere near the jump he used to and his hands are pretty much toast but...

His GF% is 5th best forward on the team above 60%
His GA/60 is the 3rd best for forwards on the team
His Corsi % is the 6th best among forwards above 53%

So yeah, he aint the player he used to be, and he sure as **** aint driving the train offensively while he is out there but for anyone to look at those facts and say that he bring NOTHING are either missing something or just miserable and need something to complain about.

Now thats not to say he cant be replaced or upgraded but the unabashed hate is just silly.

Remember what happened when he was ripped from his suckling generational bosom for 8 games a few short days ago?

I remember.

Literally any winger on our roster would do more with the opportunities he gets. But hey, he scored a goal, so thank heaven for small miracles. Maybe he'll get hot and hit 10 this year. Pretty good for a guy playing shotgun with a center who's 3rd in league scoring...at least when you consider his sweet GA/60, which is really the measure of any good scoring line forward.

 

[Ogrezilla]

I'm not clamoring for him to be dealt, but to suggest he's been fine is to fail to consider how much money he makes, which is pretty much all that matters.

Until we have another use for the money, all that matters is how he plays. He's playing like a decent 13th forward. That's a disappointment from him for sure, but its not the end of the world. If a 2m dollar 4th liner was our worst problem, we'd be in a great place. How much were we paying Satan, Sykora, and Dupuis to platoon on the 4th line in 2009?

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

Remember what happened when he was ripped from his suckling generational bosom for 8 games a few short days ago?

I remember.

Literally any winger on our roster would do more with the opportunities he gets. But hey, he scored a goal, so thank heaven for small miracles. Maybe he'll get hot and hit 10 this year. Pretty good for a guy playing shotgun with a center who's 3rd in league scoring...at least when you consider his sweet GA/60, which is really the measure of any good scoring line forward.

Sure if the only measurement that your looking is individual goals scored and not how the player effects the team as a whole, which is what really matters. And obviously im not saying Kunitz isnt a flawed player at this point, he certainly is, but if your team is scoring over 60% of all goals scored when that player is on the ice, that player is obviously not hurting you and likely helping in some way shape or form.

He doesnt have to drive the bus, he doesnt have to be the engine or even the wheels but as long as the bus keeps working he has value, even if all he is mud flaps and an ash tray.

If all he does is literally help keep the puck out of our net, help create zone exits and entries and get the f out of the way in the offensive zone, with how the team is constructed that is enough as long as the results keep being that overwhelmingly positive.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Sure if the only measurement that your looking is individual goals scored and not how the player effects the team as a whole, which is what really matters. And obviously im not saying Kunitz isnt a flawed player at this point, he certainly is, but if your team is scoring over 60% of all goals scored when that player is on the ice, that player is obviously not hurting you and likely helping in some way shape or form.

He doesnt have to drive the bus, he doesnt have to be the engine or even the wheels but as long as the bus keeps working he has value, even if all he is mud flaps and an ash tray.

If all he does is literally help keep the puck out of our net, help create zone exits and entries and get the f out of the way in the offensive zone, with how the team is constructed that is enough as long as the results keep being that overwhelmingly positive.

Being present on line with a great player is not a skill.

Scoring on pace for 8 goals over an 82 game season beside Evgeni Malkin wouldn't be enough to justify keeping that spot if Kunitz played defense like Bob Gainey and Guy Carbonneau's love child.

 

[Penske]

I'm not clamoring for him to be dealt, but to suggest he's been fine is to fail to consider how much money he makes, which is pretty much all that matters.

He got paid as a third liner. He's put up good numbers there. We play him on the 4th line so he won't produce as well (and personally think he's better at C).

I'd keep him unless we need the cap space. Currently he's the only bottom 6 C signed next season. We'll have to wait to see what happens with expansion and next off season before we move on from him.

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

Being present on line with a great player is not a skill.

Scoring on pace for 8 goals over an 82 game season beside Evgeni Malkin wouldn't be enough to justify keeping that spot if Kunitz played defense like Bob Gainey and Guy Carbonneau's love child.

I dont care if its a skill, its getting great results. Results are what i care about. There is no reason to believe these results are unsustainable.