Post-Game Talk: Pens 3, Canes 1 - Deserves Got Nothin' To Do With It

[Dipsy Doodle]

Obviously my second son could not arrive at a time of defeat. Birth certificate says time of birth (minus 13 hours of course) is identical to the minute Geno scored the 3-1 goal. Coincidence? Well, probably .

Congrats man!

We gotta time a tank for about 2033, I guess.

The constant use of Hornqvist away from Sid will forever irritate all of us. I want to know the real reason. I'm afraid it's Sully sensing Sid's frustration with him. But man.. when something works, why stop it?

Whatever the excuse is, it's a bad one. As long as Horny's on the team, we will always be better with him beside Crosby than on another line.

Especially with all these injuries, we can't afford to be jerking around the things that are actually working.

Pens looked like ass until Sullivan FINALLY put Hornqvist with Sid and Guentzel, and put Geno between Hagelin and Kessel. They still didn't look dominant, but at least they actually showed signs of looking like a Cup contender, instead of whatever the hell it is they were looking like in the first 30 minutes tonight and the Detroit game.

Murray was the game star, though. He kept the Pens in it until the 5 on 3 PP goal, then kept making saves when the Pens decided to employ the "run around like chickens with their heads cut off" defensive zone scheme they've been using a lot lately.

Murray really was amazing. We'd be sunk without the guy.

 

[Tender Rip]

My first is due in 5 days...

Soak it all in (and tell your girl she is a superstar), are my only advice. Its kinda surreal.

At no point in my life have I felt more clarity and purpose than while having a smoke all alone in the dead of night outside the hospital an hour after my first was born about three years ago. And most of that has even stayed with me .
It's a cliché perhaps, but if life, the army or something else hasn't made a man out of you, having your first child most definitely ought to.



As for the Pens, to not be just an OT guy, with Daley out for a while potentially.... JR pretty much has to land someone somewhat real, like he has indicated a desire to.

I don't much like giving up good futures for rentals, but I don't care about our draft picks this year. We are third in the league while playing mostly disappointing hockey and having been savaged by injuries much more so than any other contender. Its one of those years your GM is not doing his job if he doesn't splash.

I just hope he identifies what the team needs - unlike Ray "All In" Shero back when, and at the same time it is hard to see where we find the cap-room absent a Flery trade.

 

[JTG]

Well who else do they have on the power play?

For left shots, they have the two best players in the world.

For right shots, they have one of the best wristers in the game, and a very good playmaker, in Kessel, plus Hornqvist who does great work in front of the net.

The PP should look elite, at the very minimum, no matter who else they have on it. The fifth guy could be an AHLer and as long as they had someone other than the AHL guy handle the puck most of the time. If the PP does not look elite with those four guys, then the fifth guy needs to give up the damn puck. They could have Geno running things from the half wall, Kessel running things from the other half wall, Geno running it from the point or even Crosby running it from behind the net and those four players would find a way to score goals.

The idea that Schultz should run the powerplay, and the idea that Letang shouldn't, are actually two separate ideas. Even if Letang is on the powerplay, why is he the one running it? It makes no sense when you have the option of using any one of three elite players instead.

Because the elite players don't want to run it. Sid likes being down low. Geno likes being on the half wall. That leaves someone having to man that point spot where the puck is going to naturally flow through. Schultz just has such a better feel for the PP than Letang. He's able to maneuver PK'ers with moves he makes and open things up for others. Schultz has very similar Gonchar qualities in his ability to work the point on the PP. Letang really shouldn't be anywhere near a PP unit.

 

[ColePens]

Congrats TR!

 

[NewAgeOutlaw]

You really wonder if something is wrong with the Pens' S&C coaches or medical staff. Every season seems to be a war of attrition.

Still, Letang's play and the lack of a solid 3rd center are much larger issues. Murray can win the team a series or even maybe 2, but they need something else to make themselves better than the other top contenders in the east.

 

[Coastal Kev]

You really wonder if something is wrong with the Pens' S&C coaches or medical staff. Every season seems to be a war of attrition.

Still, Letang's play and the lack of a solid 3rd center are much larger issues. Murray can win the team a series or even maybe 2, but they need something else to make themselves better than the other top contenders in the east.

Really?? They are a light, soft team. It is what it is.

 

[Pancakes]

I was at this game in person. A few thoughts from live observation:

- Sid hardly ever touched the puck with speed through the neutral zone. The few times he did, he was dangerous.

- Guentzel is FAST. But he was also getting ragdolled in the corners. I don't think Carolina is a good matchup for him because they have a ton of guys that have speed and size. He was having trouble holding onto pucks in the corners.

- Kunitz was dreadful, and the line immediately became better the moment Horny got put on it.

- Hagelin was one of our best players. Was all over the ice, and made a great play on the third goal.

- I didn't realize that the whistle had blown when Murray made that save with his blocker but it was an unbelievable save and everyone in the building was wowed by it.

- Letang was making AWFUL decisions with the puck all night long, especially on the pp.

- I thought Olesky battle hard and made some decent plays. Ruhwedel can clearly skate but his brain does not move at an NHL pace. He was taking forever to make decisions with the puck.

- The fourth line had a few good shifts. I like Kuhnhackl, and wish he'd be given more of a chance, especially over Fehr.


There were a ton of Penguins fans there. It was kind of embarrassing how many there were. Overall though it was a bad turnout of fans for a professional hockey team. Arena was very empty.

 

[NewAgeOutlaw]

Really?? They are a light, soft team. It is what it is.

There are other light and soft teams that don't get nearly as many injuries. How many Penguins this year have even been hurt on cheap hits? Besides, this has been a problem ever since they had a much larger, more physical team.

 

[Coastal Kev]

There are other light and soft teams that don't get nearly as many injuries. How many Penguins this year have even been hurt on cheap hits? Besides, this has been a problem ever since they had a much larger, more physical team.

That might be true, but it's also true that the Pens current makeup is small and light.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

AS I stated in the offseason, there was a huge risk to standing pat with the roster after winning the cup.

It's tough to get too worked up over roster makeup in the middle of such a bad run of injuries. But it's not like I disagree. I've been pretty vocal for a while that punting on team improvement this past offseason and instead casting their gaze backwards (again) was going to cost them. You never think you have it all figured out. You never stand still. But they did.

But I imagine our ideas about what should have been done are much different. I don't think getting a lot "heavier" was going to be the answer. That isn't generally the way successful teams have trended (that I can tell) in recent years. And the Penguins just proved pretty demonstrably that it is not anything close to a necessity in order to win a Cup.

I would have preferred to run with a more "traditional" third line this season. I think the "three scoring line" model is a bunch of unsustainable bunk.

 

[Coastal Kev]

It's tough to get too worked up over roster makeup in the middle of such a bad run of injuries. But it's not like I disagree. I've been pretty vocal for a while that punting on team improvement this past offseason and instead casting their gaze backwards (again) was going to cost them. You never think you have it all figured out. You never stand still. But they did.

But I imagine our ideas about what should have been done are much different. I don't think getting a lot "heavier" was going to be the answer. That isn't generally the way successful teams have trended (that I can tell) in recent years. And the Penguins just proved pretty demonstrably that it is not anything close to a necessity in order to win a Cup.

I would have preferred to run with a more "traditional" third line this season. I think the "three scoring line" model is a bunch of unsustainable bunk.

I would prefer the team to have 2-3 physical defensemen and 2-3 physical forwards. But that's my preference on how I would build the roster.

But standing pat after winning the cup is an entirely different conversation. The Pens rode a wave last year. You could see sometime last February that they were going to be a scary team come playoffs for anyone to beat. It's so tough in any sport, but especially one like hockey which can be such a long grind to expect that same roster to get that magic again.

I thought that JR should have made a couple of big moves this offseason, but I completely understand his mindset and why he didn't. We'll see if he's able to pull anything off at the deadline, but I think he would have had a much easier task if he decided to pull the trigger back last summer.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

The Pens rode a wave last year. You could see sometime last February that they were going to be a scary team come playoffs for anyone to beat. It's so tough in any sport, but especially one like hockey which can be such a long grind to expect that same roster to get that magic again.

Yup. There is a lot of truth to that that people (including basically the entire organization) just didn't want to hear. You'd think there were enough people around from 2010-2015 to tell some tales about the dangers of trying in vain to make repeatable formulas out of capturing lightning in a bottle. But not so much.

I was encouraged by seeing some lines that actually made some sense in this particular game. That was basically the only thing I was encouraged by. Well... and Matt Murray. But that's nothing new.

 

[DegenX]

It seems the discussion has moved on from last night's games to other topics, so let's shut this down and move to more appropriate threads ...

Salary Cap & Roster Building thread is here
All-Purpose thread is here
The Murray vs. Fleury thread is here