Pre-Game Talk: Penguins @ Boston Bruins 12/16/15

[pistolpete11]

I'm curious as to why most people here seem higher on Scott Wilson than Conor Sheary? We've already seen what Scott Wilson can do at the NHL level. Ditto Bryan Rust. Let's give Sheary a shot. They're the same age, but Sheary is a late-bloomer. I believe Wilson is what he is...a bottom-six forward option.

I'm anxious to see what Sheary can do.

Because they called up Sheary. If they would have called up Wilson, there would be the same number of people complaining that they should have called up Sheary.

 

[Evgeny Oliker]

...

I know the 3rd line looks weird on paper but it can actually work I think.

It is a similar concept to what Chicago is doing with Panarin - Anisimov - Kane. You have 2 skilled guys on the wing and then a physical guy with size in the middle. So Anisimov basically tends to go straight to the net or behind the net, which draws the D to him , thus opening up more space for Panarin and Kane to do their magic.

IF Fehr can do what Anisimov does, it could work. The other advantage is that being the 3rd line, Kessel will tend to go against the 3rd pairing of the other team. Kane line tends to draw the 1st or 2nd pairing...

So I think its worth a shot actually. Kessel can't do any worse than he has done on Malkin line...so give this a try and if it doesn't work you change it up...

 

[pistolpete11]

I know the 3rd line looks weird on paper but it can actually work I think.

It is a similar concept to what Chicago is doing with Panarin - Anisimov - Kane. You have 2 skilled guys on the wing and then a physical guy with size in the middle. So Anisimov basically tends to go straight to the net or behind the net, which draws the D to him , thus opening up more space for Panarin and Kane to do their magic.

IF Fehr can do what Anisimov does, it could work. The other advantage is that being the 3rd line, Kessel will tend to go against the 3rd pairing of the other team. Kane line tends to draw the 1st or 2nd pairing...

So I think its worth a shot actually. Kessel can't do any worse than he has done on Malkin line...so give this a try and if it doesn't work you change it up...

I think it could work, but long term, it is still best for Kessel to find some chemistry with Crosby or Malkin.

 

[Penguinzilla*]

I like those lines. I've always said (or maybe just thought it in my head) that Kessel doesn't need Sid or Malkin. He can do stuff on his own. I'm excited about the game tonight. We could very well lose because of our bad defensemen but still should be fun.

 

[Asuna]

http://www.tsn.ca/penguins-in-no-rush-with-rookie-sprong-1.409546

Nice article about Sprong.

Kinda ironic his mentor is Bill Guerin

 

[DegenX]

Man, I hate to be a negative Nancy, but am I the only one who is wondering if Sully is not the guy to coach this team? I mean, it's been one game, and things can change, but, I'm thinking this guy might be too much like Torts.

 

[chrisp200]

Man, I hate to be a negative Nancy, but am I the only one who is wondering if Sully is not the guy to coach this team?

I kind of feel that way about every coach not named babcock

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm curious as to why most people here seem higher on Scott Wilson than Conor Sheary? We've already seen what Scott Wilson can do at the NHL level. Ditto Bryan Rust. Let's give Sheary a shot. They're the same age, but Sheary is a late-bloomer. I believe Wilson is what he is...a bottom-six forward option.

I'm anxious to see what Sheary can do.

Wilson played 1 shift of a regular season game and like 2 playoff games. Not much to go off there.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

Man, I hate to be a negative Nancy, but am I the only one who is wondering if Sully is not the guy to coach this team? I mean, it's been one game, and things can change, but, I'm thinking this guy might be too much like Torts.

Maybe, but I need to see more. The problem with Torts is that he's full psycho all the time, if Sullivan can be calmer and ****ing sane he might be okay. I'm more concerned about player usage overall and his strategy than I am about him being too hard on the players or punishing them. That defense getting exposed without Fleury there is going to be something.


Huh, Kassian cleared waivers. I thought someone would take him.



So Sheary is definitely in.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

Man, I hate to be a negative Nancy, but am I the only one who is wondering if Sully is not the guy to coach this team? I mean, it's been one game, and things can change, but, I'm thinking this guy might be too much like Torts.

It's only been one game and the conversation pretty much ends there. I'm not high or low on the guy but what justification is there for optimism or pessimism at this point? He's screwing with the lines just to freshen up everyone's mindset in my opinion. Does anyone really think he wants Hornqvist on the fourth line long term? He's just trying to put a small message out there given he hasn't had a ton of time with the team. Lastly why is anyone afraid if the guy has a little Torts in him? They've needed a little bit of that for a long time. I thought that was a given.

It doesn't matter anyways because I'm not convinced anyone is going to work miracles here until the D is bolstered. Our D is merely serviceable on a good day.

 

[mpp9]

What's the deal with Bonino? Hurt?

 

[Jesse]

What's the deal with Bonino? Hurt?

He wasn't on the ice this morning. Waiting for HCMS to clarify as to why.

EDIT: He's sick. Game time decision.

 

[DegenX]

Maybe, but I need to see more. The problem with Torts is that he's full psycho all the time, if Sullivan can be calmer and ****ing sane he might be okay. I'm more concerned about player usage overall and his strategy than I am about him being too hard on the players or punishing them. That defense getting exposed without Fleury there is going to be something.


Huh, Kassian cleared waivers. I thought someone would take him.



So Sheary is definitely in.

I get that a new guy is going to come in and want to try new things. And I get the concept of accountability. But not to the detriment of the team. And, really, how effective is screaming like a drill sergeant at a group of guys who are not rookies? They're gonna tune that **** out pretty fast.

It's only been one game and the conversation pretty much ends there. I'm not high or low on the guy but what justification is there for optimism or pessimism at this point? He's screwing with the lines just to freshen up everyone's mindset in my opinion. Does anyone really think he wants Hornqvist on the fourth line long term? He's just trying to put a small message out there given he hasn't had a ton of time with the team. Lastly why is anyone afraid if the guy has a little Torts in him? They've needed a little bit of that for a long time. I thought that was a given.

It doesn't matter anyways because I'm not convinced anyone is going to work miracles here until the D is bolstered. Our D is merely serviceable on a good day.

You are absolutely right ... it has been one game. And I've been beating the 'our D needs upgraded' drum for a while now. But I don't know if there is a need for any degree of Torts with this team. There is a difference between discipline and punishment. Time will tell. It's early. I just ... I don't know, I have doubts.

 

[Koempel]

Before some of us start the usual doomsday preaching again, maybe wait a week or two, to at least give Sullivan a chance to make even the slightest of impressions on this team. First there is a call for accountability, but when it finally seems to be addressed, complaints about the lines arise. In fact, every single decision made by the coach that does not conform to one's own (often unrealistic) conception of how the team should look, becomes a descent in exasparation and paranoia. The last few years appear to have chipped away at the sanity of some. Take a step back and breathe. Sullivan has the unenviable task of getting this team on the right track again. The lack of PMD, injuries to key players (Letang, Fleury) and changing a system mid-season are severe obstacles. Anyone expecting this team to suddenly cruise to a 4th/5th spot in the standing, should consider the reality surrounding this team. Battling for those wildcard spots will be a hard enough mission all of its own, considering the circumstances. Let the man get an idea of the players and their strengths and weaknesses, before declaring him a failure after a few days and a game against one of the better teams in the league.

 

[Shady Machine]

I get that a new guy is going to come in and want to try new things. And I get the concept of accountability. But not to the detriment of the team. And, really, how effective is screaming like a drill sergeant at a group of guys who are not rookies? They're gonna tune that **** out pretty fast.



You are absolutely right ... it has been one game. And I've been beating the 'our D needs upgraded' drum for a while now. But I don't know if there is a need for any degree of Torts with this team. There is a difference between discipline and punishment. Time will tell. It's early. I just ... I don't know, I have doubts.

How do you know Sullivan is screaming like a drill sergeant?

What type of coach do you think this team needs?

 

[Waffle Fries]

Now if Kunitz and Hornqvist get swapped, we'll have the top-6 most of is wanted before the season started.

Kessel is with Malkin tonight.

Are you going to apologize for your little outburst?

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

I get that a new guy is going to come in and want to try new things. And I get the concept of accountability. But not to the detriment of the team. And, really, how effective is screaming like a drill sergeant at a group of guys who are not rookies? They're gonna tune that **** out pretty fast.



You are absolutely right ... it has been one game. And I've been beating the 'our D needs upgraded' drum for a while now. But I don't know if there is a need for any degree of Torts with this team. There is a difference between discipline and punishment. Time will tell. It's early. I just ... I don't know, I have doubts.

My thing is just not really having any expectations either way. I think the realistic hope is he moves the needle slightly in the right direction and they make the playoffs with little doubt that they would. That's about it, depending on what moves they make from here if any.

 

[Shady Machine]

Now if Kunitz and Hornqvist get swapped, we'll have the top-6 most of is wanted before the season started.

Yup it's so close!

Perron-Crosby-Hornqvist
Plots-Malkin-Kessel
Kunitz-Bones-Sprong
Sheary-Cullen-Fehr

Come on Sully, make it happen.

 

[ColePens]

I mean... here's the deal. Kessel is struggling and we switched systems on him twice in less than 40 games. So in 40 games, he's been a part of 3 coaches and systems. I'm not making excuses, but I damn sure expected a bit of a growing pain as he came over to play w/ Geno/Sid.

But realistically, if we are trying to create accountability, Kessel deserves to get a little ****. His effort level has been down. I'm not expecting him to be a 2 way player, but there were a few times he REALLY took the easy way out and that's not what the team needs right now as they get a little desperate. He needs to lead on the ice and I've seen him do it before (multiple times).

So I'm not going to judge the coach from 1 week. I will take the rest of the season in and look at what actions MS is constantly making to determine what his stock is as NHL coach. I LOVED the speed/tenacity out of the team. We just looked out of sorts defensively. I think Sid looked about as fast as he's ever looked and it was unfortunate Beau got hurt because that line was going to town. Let's stop reacting to every single movement and see how the system operates over time, player usage, how accountability is dealt with, etc.

 

[Waffle Fries]

Yup it's so close!

Perron-Crosby-Hornqvist
Plots-Malkin-Kessel
Kunitz-Bones-Sprong
Sheary-Cullen-Fehr

Come on Sully, make it happen.

Yepp. I'm hoping Hornqvist has a strong game and that that will be enough to move him back up.

 

[Jesse]

I mean... here's the deal. Kessel is struggling and we switched systems on him twice in less than 40 games. So in 40 games, he's been a part of 3 coaches and systems. I'm not making excuses, but I damn sure expected a bit of a growing pain as he came over to play w/ Geno/Sid.

But realistically, if we are trying to create accountability, Kessel deserves to get a little ****. His effort level has been down. I'm not expecting him to be a 2 way player, but there were a few times he REALLY took the easy way out and that's not what the team needs right now as they get a little desperate. He needs to lead on the ice and I've seen him do it before (multiple times).

So I'm not going to judge the coach from 1 week. I will take the rest of the season in and look at what actions MS is constantly making to determine what his stock is as NHL coach. I LOVED the speed/tenacity out of the team. We just looked out of sorts defensively. I think Sid looked about as fast as he's ever looked and it was unfortunate Beau got hurt because that line was going to town. Let's stop reacting to every single movement and see how the system operates over time, player usage, how accountability is dealt with, etc.

The offsides thing is really killing me. We're talking 3-5 times a game now. That's something that's completely avoidable in most cases.

As far as Sullivan goes, there's been 0 indication given that he's anything like he's being made out to be here. In fact, I'd go as far as to say the guys appreciate how punctual and succinct he is. He's been drilled with questions about Tortorella the last 5 days and has steadily responded with plenty of quips about how the two of them aren't even remotely close. HCMS said the only comparison between them is in how neither likes to waste anyone's time.

Not putting up with bull and holding players accountable is exactly what this team needs. That doesn't mean it has to come in the form of swearing and being a drill sergeant.

 

[DegenX]

How do you know Sullivan is screaming like a drill sergeant?

What type of coach do you think this team needs?

Every single beat reported commented on it at the first practice.

What type of coach? I don't know. I really don't. But I know what I don't want.

Take Kessel, for example. He's an American hockey player. He grew up playing baseball and hockey. There's a correlation there as to why American hockey players tend to shoot with their natural handedness. Right handed guys shoot right, left handed guys shoot left. Kessel, was part of the USNDT, played in college, and has been in the NHL for 10 years now. You don't think in all that time, someone, somewhere thought to try him on the left? Especially since Canada takes the opposite approach to handedness? And, you're going to demote him after one bad game? The first game with a new coach? Yet promote Perron? Really?

We've seen that Plotnikov and Hornqvist don't work on the same line. It's a sign of intelligence to be able to learn from other people's mistakes, right? Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it and all that. And, we know Horny and Geno don't mesh, despite what their advanced stats may say. Watching just a game or two will show that. And one would think a coach watches lots of game tape.

But, it has only been one game. Things can go any number of ways from here. Hopefully they go up. My concerns may be nothing more than lingering trauma from the last few years.

 

[Asuna]

Every single beat reported commented on it at the first practice.

What type of coach? I don't know. I really don't. But I know what I don't want.

Take Kessel, for example. He's an American hockey player. He grew up playing baseball and hockey. There's a correlation there as to why American hockey players tend to shoot with their natural handedness. Right handed guys shoot right, left handed guys shoot left. Kessel, was part of the USNDT, played in college, and has been in the NHL for 10 years now. You don't think in all that time, someone, somewhere thought to try him on the left? Especially since Canada takes the opposite approach to handedness? And, you're going to demote him after one bad game? The first game with a new coach? Yet promote Perron? Really?

We've seen that Plotnikov and Hornqvist don't work on the same line. It's a sign of intelligence to be able to learn from other people's mistakes, right? Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it and all that. And, we know Horny and Geno don't mesh, despite what their advanced stats may say. Watching just a game or two will show that. And one would think a coach watches lots of game tape.

But, it has only been one game. Things can go any number of ways from here. Hopefully they go up. My concerns may be nothing more than lingering trauma from the last few years.

You do know those practice lines are just practice lines right? They aren't the game lines.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Yepp. I'm hoping Hornqvist has a strong game and that that will be enough to move him back up.

IF Hornqvist is moved up to play with Perron and Crosby, then Kunitz will be on Malkin's line. Who are we kidding?

 

[Waffle Fries]

Every single beat reported commented on it at the first practice.

What type of coach? I don't know. I really don't. But I know what I don't want.

Take Kessel, for example. He's an American hockey player. He grew up playing baseball and hockey. There's a correlation there as to why American hockey players tend to shoot with their natural handedness. Right handed guys shoot right, left handed guys shoot left. Kessel, was part of the USNDT, played in college, and has been in the NHL for 10 years now. You don't think in all that time, someone, somewhere thought to try him on the left? Especially since Canada takes the opposite approach to handedness? And, you're going to demote him after one bad game? The first game with a new coach? Yet promote Perron? Really?

We've seen that Plotnikov and Hornqvist don't work on the same line. It's a sign of intelligence to be able to learn from other people's mistakes, right? Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it and all that. And, we know Horny and Geno don't mesh, despite what their advanced stats may say. Watching just a game or two will show that. And one would think a coach watches lots of game tape.

But, it has only been one game. Things can go any number of ways from here. Hopefully they go up. My concerns may be nothing more than lingering trauma from the last few years.

Perron is the closest player we have to Bennett. I'm glad that Sullivan recognized that Sid needed a guy with that skillset.

And experimenting in practice isnt a bad thing. Kessel is still on Geno's line. However, how is Sullivan to know that Hornqvist and Geno don't work or Hornqvist and Plotnikov have been tried? I doubt he's watched and analyzed every game, and even still there's nothing wrong with him wanting to get looks of things he hasn't seen in person in a low-stakes practice situation.

I also think you may be exaggerating a bit on this drill sergeant idea.

IF Hornqvist is moved up to play with Perron and Crosby, then Kunitz will be on Malkin's line. Who are we kidding?

Let's give Sullivan a chance to see if he means it about rewarding ice time based on play before we ultimately decide he doesn't.