Confirmed with Link: Parayko signs 8-year extension $52 million $6.5 AAV

[MissouriMook]

First person to reference Pietrangelo in this thread was Blueston. The second was BlueDream.

Neither poster belongs to the group of posters who were upset with Armstrong (for whatever reason) after the Pietrangelo situation played out, so if you want to know why the issue came up in here, perhaps you should start by asking them why they referenced such a sore subject in what should be a happy thread?

Edit: Brian39 mentioned Pietrangelo's $6.5M deal in passing as well on the first page.

Thanks for keeping score.

 

[Brian39]

First person to reference Pietrangelo in this thread was Blueston. The second was BlueDream.

Edit: Brian39 mentioned Pietrangelo's $6.5M deal in passing as well on the first page.

 

[TruBlu]

You can keep moving the goal posts all you want but there’s been numerous posts here insinuating we won’t be able to keep any of our core because of the Pietrangelo situation.

There’s literally a thread a few posts down from here where the majority of people voted that we wouldn’t be able to keep Parayko.

I’ll admit, at first I blamed Armstrong for Petro leaving but now it’s pretty clear that Alex would still be here if he wanted to be and wasn’t so stubborn. Armstrong is signing everyone else with ease it seems like.

This was pretty evident to me early on. You're spot on with your previous post. Several people that other teams would love to have signed have come back here for long term. It's comical that if you sign a guy for a good AAV people complain about the term, and if you sign a guy for short term they complain about the total cost. No one here complains about the fact that this team has been competitive for pretty much the whole time DA has been here. The structure of the contracts and the ABSENCE of a NMC has kept us able to dump contracts that are no longer good for the team. Here's to several more years of winning.

 

[Blueston]

First person to reference Pietrangelo in this thread was Blueston. The second was BlueDream.

Neither poster belongs to the group of posters who were upset with Armstrong (for whatever reason) after the Pietrangelo situation played out, so if you want to know why the issue came up in here, perhaps you should start by asking them why they referenced such a sore subject in what should be a happy thread?

Edit: Brian39 mentioned Pietrangelo's $6.5M deal in passing as well on the first page.

I brought Petro up in context that I didn’t think team would be comfortable losing both of their top defensemen and that they likely felt confident in resigning Parayko all along. Wasn’t meant to be endorsement or criticism of Petro negotiations, but was rather offered up to those that were convinced Parayko wanted to leave at first chance.

 

[AjaxManifesto]

Petro who?

I like this Colt kid. Good head on his shoulders. Likes being here. Very good hockey player. Enough said.

 

[A Real Barn Burner]

First person to reference Pietrangelo in this thread was Blueston. The second was BlueDream.

Neither poster belongs to the group of posters who were upset with Armstrong (for whatever reason) after the Pietrangelo situation played out, so if you want to know why the issue came up in here, perhaps you should start by asking them why they referenced such a sore subject in what should be a happy thread?

Edit: Brian39 mentioned Pietrangelo's $6.5M deal in passing as well on the first page.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

So yeah, what Brian39 said. If you don't like NMC's or don't think Pietrangelo was worth one AND you can intelligently defend your position, I have much respect for you. If you keep making inane arguments that misunderstand the other sides point and distract from the conversation, then I don't. I don't care if someone agrees with me or not. I care if they can have a rational and productive conversation about those disagreements. There are several posters who agree with me that make me cringe. Several times my most respected posters disagree with me as well. The conclusion you come to isn't the sign of intelligence, its the process and understanding that got you there.

As for the people we didn't sign, again you miss the point. It doesn't matter which one you like better or why they didn't sign. The fact that we were interested in them and didn't sign them is proof that we did NOT "sign everyone with ease". We unsurprisingly are not a franchise that nobody wants to play for regardless of contract. The only one who is pushing that narrative is one of those posters who makes me cringe. However, it is also unsurprising that we are not a franchise that everyone is dying to play for regardless of contract. We can't sign everyone with ease. We have to offer players the most attractive package to them, whatever that may be. It could be any combination of money, term, talent of line-mates, location, competitive window, opportunity to play, NTC, NMC, bonuses, coaching staff, medical staff, etc. It all depends on what the player values.

To be fair, I don't think ANY NHL club has that mythical status: everyone wants to go there and willing to sign team-friendly deals. Tampa is probably closest to that, and its probably true for most reigning SC champs year to year. But I don't think St Louis's status in that regard is really a knock, or any different than every other team. A guy wants a longer contract. A guy wants to be on the East coast. Its not a knock on St Louis the organization.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

I brought Petro up in context that I didn’t think team would be comfortable losing both of their top defensemen and that they likely felt confident in resigning Parayko all along. Wasn’t meant to be endorsement or criticism of Petro negotiations, but was rather offered up to those that were convinced Parayko wanted to leave at first chance.

Multiple people made statements to the effect that Parayko would demand a higher salary in Pietro's absence, since he was more crucial to the team's future. Its amusing that the insistence that Parayko would need a big contract, a NMC and would probably still prefer to play in Edmonton gave way to the reality that he just signed a very friendly deal.

The team is gambling a bit on his back, but Parayko is securing his future too. Its a win-win, and he obviously is pleased to stay in St Louis. That's the take-away message to me.

 

[GoldenSeal]

Pat Maroon must not love his kid. He could still be in St. Louis if he was willing to accept whatever lowball offer Army would give him. If Perron walks because Armstrong won't give him a competitive offer at his age, he must not want to be here. Let's ignore that he has signed here twice: once after getting traded and once after getting exposed in the expansion draft. If he really wanted to be here, he'd accept whatever Armstrong offers, no matter how low it is.

Give me a break with this "If he really wanted to be here narrative". Nobody is arguing that Pietrangelo couldn't have compromised down to what Armstrong was offering and accepted an offer to remain a Blue. Likewise, he'd be a Blue if Armstrong was willing to compromise up to what he wanted. The question that is being discussed by the more intelligent members of the board is which one if any SHOULD have compromised, not COULD they have.

As to whether we can re-sign our players, most of the trepidation with Parayko (at least for me) was because he was a big Oilers fan growing up. Having won a cup here, I didn't know if he could pass up the boy hood dream of playing for Edmonton. The NMC question is about players who could get an NMC elsewhere. Those are generally the upper echelon players. For whatever reason Parayko didn't sign a contract of an upper-echelon player. That could be becuase he loved it here and took a team friendly deal. It could be because people get paid for offense and his numbers are merely ok. Or it could be back-related. Whatever the reason,not many $6.5M contracts have NMCs.

Can we re-sign ROR without an NMC, or could we have signed a guy like Dougie Hamilton? Those are the questions the NMC will play a role. And it will only play a role if that particular player puts any value in an NMC. Not everyone will. But I doubt anyone is arguing that we should give NMCs away like candy on Halloween. Its just a tool that we should have in our arsenal for the right player. If its not necessary, then its not necessary.

Also, we didn't sign Hoffman, Chara or Sutter. All are guys we expressed interest in. So we didn't sign everyone with ease. We signed the guys we signed with apparent ease, because we don't see the negotiations. Who knows how hard it was to sign them. We could have paid significantly more AAV than their next best offer and we'd have no clue.

Did Army even extend an offer to Maroon? I have a shoddy memory but I don't remember one. (Not like Mr. 3 Cup ring wearing with an M-NTC this year is minding lol. If that keeps going, he'll end up with some Ric Flair quote: Stanley Cup Wearing, Big Rig Roaring, Cigar Smokin', Beer Drinking, etc. etc. Wooo LOL.)

And for the record, I'm one of 'those' people who outright went ham and criticizing Army on 'Him-Who-I-Refuse-To-Name' and I've come to the point of saying 'Yeah, that's between them' and leaving it at that. We got a second Cup to hoist and Colt rocking with us is moving in the right direction, so Thank You Army & Colt!

 

[GoldenSeal]

To be fair, I don't think ANY NHL club has that mythical status: everyone wants to go there and willing to sign team-friendly deals. Tampa is probably closest to that, and its probably true for most reigning SC champs year to year. But I don't think St Louis's status in that regard is really a knock, or any different than every other team. A guy wants a longer contract. A guy wants to be on the East coast. Its not a knock on St Louis the organization.

Totally agree with the exception that if you live in a place like Toronto or Montreal that you're looked at and judged on a level not appropriate for mere mortals; some places view hockey literally as more than a religion.

 

[EastonBlues22]

Thanks for keeping score.

It's not about "keeping score."

You added commentary. I added context.

There was nothing malicious about how the conversation evolved, and it wasn't started by chronic malcontents just to poison the well, so what is the real complaint? Is it really surprising that the topic would come up given the context?

 

[Ranksu]

Is this EB22 between Missouri and Bluestone?

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

keep seeing it's a risk with his back (heck, I think I even said "if he's healthy" ) but does anyone really know his medical status?

did anyone hear exactly what was wrong last year? seen/heard anything said about it this offseason?

 

[TruBlu]

keep seeing it's a risk with his back (heck, I think I even said "if he's healthy" ) but does anyone really know his medical status?

did anyone hear exactly what was wrong last year? seen/heard anything said about it this offseason?

Kind of like how Tank is injury prone...except he's not, but it fuels the narrative for why he HAAAAS to be traded.

 

[Celtic Note]

keep seeing it's a risk with his back (heck, I think I even said "if he's healthy" ) but does anyone really know his medical status?

did anyone hear exactly what was wrong last year? seen/heard anything said about it this offseason?

I believe there was talk of a bulging disk. I think it was a tweet from JR but I cannot honestly remember nor do I know if it was true.

It does sound like he is cleared to play (in not so many words) by Army.

How well he is doing and looks on the ice, I am sure we are all chomping at the bit to see.

 

[Ranksu]

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

Did Army even extend an offer to Maroon? I have a shoddy memory but I don't remember one. (Not like Mr. 3 Cup ring wearing with an M-NTC this year is minding lol. If that keeps going, he'll end up with some Ric Flair quote: Stanley Cup Wearing, Big Rig Roaring, Cigar Smokin', Beer Drinking, etc. etc. Wooo LOL.)

And for the record, I'm one of 'those' people who outright went ham and criticizing Army on 'Him-Who-I-Refuse-To-Name' and I've come to the point of saying 'Yeah, that's between them' and leaving it at that. We got a second Cup to hoist and Colt rocking with us is moving in the right direction, so Thank You Army & Colt!

Several observers (including me) came to the conclusion that there simply wasn't a roster spot for Maroon, unless it was at the expense of Kyrou. He didn't have a spot in the top 9, and the 4th line of Blais-Steen-Barbashev had been excellent in the post-season run. The chances are that he'd have been sent to the AHL team and have to clear waivers. The public comments were polite, but I don't get the impression that they ever offered Maroon a contract he could reasonably sign. He waited for a while to see if things developed, and then signed a 2y deal, I believe, with Tampa. I can't imagine Pat regrets that.

I don't fault Armstrong for the way he handled that. It would have been a big mistake to keep Kyrou in the minors locked out of a roster spot by Maroon. If there was a choice to make, it was probably about whether to keep Sanford or trade him and bring back Maroon.

 

[Xerloris]

Several observers (including me) came to the conclusion that there simply wasn't a roster spot for Maroon, unless it was at the expense of Kyrou. He didn't have a spot in the top 9, and the 4th line of Blais-Steen-Barbashev had been excellent in the post-season run. The chances are that he'd have been sent to the AHL team and have to clear waivers. The public comments were polite, but I don't get the impression that they ever offered Maroon a contract he could reasonably sign. He waited for a while to see if things developed, and then signed a 2y deal, I believe, with Tampa. I can't imagine Pat regrets that.

I don't fault Armstrong for the way he handled that. It would have been a big mistake to keep Kyrou in the minors locked out of a roster spot by Maroon. If there was a choice to make, it was probably about whether to keep Sanford or trade him and bring back Maroon.

Worst mistake Armstrong ever made. We'd have a threepeat right now if we had kept Maroon.

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

I believe there was talk of a bulging disk. I think it was a tweet from JR but I cannot honestly remember nor do I know if it was true.

It does sound like he is cleared to play (in not so many words) by Army.

How well he is doing and looks on the ice, I am sure we are all chomping at the bit to see.

guess that was my point.. I hear some people talk about him having a degenerative disc and how it's gonna be so bad going forward..etc..

bad contract..bad length..etc..

I would like to think that IF he had something that was going to be a problem going forward, the team wouldn't sign him to an 8yr deal

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

Several observers (including me) came to the conclusion that there simply wasn't a roster spot for Maroon, unless it was at the expense of Kyrou. He didn't have a spot in the top 9, and the 4th line of Blais-Steen-Barbashev had been excellent in the post-season run. The chances are that he'd have been sent to the AHL team and have to clear waivers. The public comments were polite, but I don't get the impression that they ever offered Maroon a contract he could reasonably sign. He waited for a while to see if things developed, and then signed a 2y deal, I believe, with Tampa. I can't imagine Pat regrets that.

I don't fault Armstrong for the way he handled that. It would have been a big mistake to keep Kyrou in the minors locked out of a roster spot by Maroon. If there was a choice to make, it was probably about whether to keep Sanford or trade him and bring back Maroon.

you had me at "trade Sanford"...

 

[ChicagoBlues]

I’m glad we didn’t re-sign Maroon.

We got to watch one guy from STL win three straight Cups with two teams!

 

[Celtic Note]

guess that was my point.. I hear some people talk about him having a degenerative disc and how it's gonna be so bad going forward..etc..

bad contract..bad length..etc..

I would like to think that IF he had something that was going to be a problem going forward, the team wouldn't sign him to an 8yr deal

A bulging disk is a degenerative condition by vary nature, based on my understanding of how this all works. This was all learned after seeing an orthopedic specialist that focuses on back issues and does some highly advanced procedures but advocates for preventative measures first. So, a 20min conversation with him and some online research. That said, I am no doctor and may not have it all 100% correct.

I do think it is worth unpacking degenerative though. When I first learned of my degenerative back issues, I was admittedly freaked out. By definition, the issue will never heal and will continue to decline with wear and tear. That’s the scary part.

The good news is there are strategies for reducing pain, promoting mobility and limiting expedited wear through strengthening and stretching. That helps keep the flare ups at bay. If Colt is able to do that then he may have a good rest of his career, assuming the damage is not at that critical point where he can no longer play. Given his and Army’s interview, it doesn’t seem that is the case, nor is the fact that he got an extension.

But, I also would not confuse the extension as meaning he will be fine moving forward. As I noted before, there are strategies using LTIR to mitigate those problems and Colt also didn’t get a market value AAV, so he may be hedging a bit.

If he does in fact have a bulging disc, it’s a degenerative problem and he plays a sport that is physically demanding and hitting an age where the body starts to pick up its decline. So, it would be something that could impact his career. Whether that is tomorrow, year 5, his last year or never, we don’t really know. I do think this year will help us gage and form a better assessment.

 

[GoldenSeal]

I’m glad we didn’t re-sign Maroon.

We got to watch one guy from STL win three straight Cups with two teams!

He won his first one here and that’s what matters. Hometown Hero

He has so much locker room swagger that I’m wondering if he’ll go into coaching after he retires.

 

[Blueston]

Capfriendly shows ntc for first 6 years and partial ntc last 2. Don’t think that was mentioned anywhere yet.

 

[Ranksu]