Ottawa Sharpshooters lets try this again

[arcjoif6]

part 2

could not fill it within one post.
Goals part was not directed at you, but at what's going on with some of these so called player advisers/agents around town. I always laugh when People tell me My son is trying to get an Ncaa scholarship,
Because they get sold by somebody who recruits well and does nice presentations.
but then when you take 2 minutes to talk to family, you realize they were never guided about SAT AND FCATS, how it could benefit them specifically. some of them are not even registered with the Ncaa eligibility center, they do not khow how admissions work, actual specific steps to take to get them where they want. Everything is so generalized so they can sell their service to the Populous.

 

[Tigers1992]

As for scouts, not being able to attend, again not an opinion but a fact, we had no issues attracting attention, if you do not believe me, just ask any of the families you meet in the rinks that played with us. and next year it will be even better, being a part of the Ejepl.

Joining the GMHL will take away any CHL scouts ability to scout your games, this is a fact. As Im sure your aware, they are banned from attending any non sanctioned Hockey Canada games.

Either way, there is no doubt a market for your product and as long as you say, parents are educated, then all the power too you.

 

[arcjoif6]

Joining the GMHL will take away any CHL scouts ability to scout your games, this is a fact. As Im sure your aware, they are banned from attending any non sanctioned Hockey Canada games.

Either way, there is no doubt a market for your product and as long as you say, parents are educated, then all the power too you.

you are partially right, first I am not joining gmhl,
second: games involving schools, usa games, exhibition games, are all valid areas, combines, camps, and other venues.and even then, they can watch tournaments, showcases,fasthockey, youtube, video, they just cannot be associated with independent teams. or else you would have to suspend somebody for being in the wrong rink.
thank you

 

[Tigers1992]

you are partially right, first I am not joining gmhl,

No, but your joining a spin off league that is being created by GMHL teams. Its going to have the same impact regarding CHL scouts being able to see your players. They are banned from seeing any non sanctioned league, no matter the initials in it.

 

[Lastcut]

Due diligence

A note of caution to all parents/kids tempted by joining a new Junior league.

In 2014, we were approached during the Chowder Cup of Boston by the owner of a team in the defunct CIHL. Lots of attention towards our son, promises on development and all that a good junior team would normally offer (sticks, equipment, track suits, daily practices when no games etc..). Coming back from Boston the pressure mounted every day from phone calls, emails pressing on a commitment. Our son was of course very happy about all this stuff which of course added to making a decision although he was invited to a few CJHL camps; coming out of Minor Midget AAA he was also guarantee a spot at Major Midget if he wanted it. He liked the idea of playing with older players and being away from home. We finally agreed to join that league and early August he moved out accompanied by a fat cheque.

Long story short, early November the owners started cancelling games to which we found out lead to a split of teams, our joining the WUHL (or something like that).

New start, lasted about a month to then find out our team was now cancelling practices, the owner didn't respond to our emails. We drove down, could not find the owner, found out the head coach had just quit and some young man was now running the whole show but didn't know where the owner was. Third week of December; kids are told to leave all team gear in the locker room but take their own personal stuff; next thing we know, the team has folded. Ouch......

About 8K gone, 21 kids from Canada, US and Europe left to themselves and not knowing what to do next.

Above is simply to send a warning to all those parents and kids about new Junior leagues; we never thought it would happen to us but it did.

I am not saying this new league will be the same. Take my word of advice though; make sure you do not pay the full amount in advance. Ensure you ask lots of questions and ask to see proof (what brand of sticks, hours of practice, etc..) just be very cautious.

To finish, I certainly wish the best of success to this new league and players/parents that will be joining. There is a majority of good people in hockey and it is too bad a very few tarnish the sport by greed and deceit as it hurts those honest people that work so hard at it. Hockey (Minor or Junior) has become a business and where there is money, there is always an opportunity for crooks to pounce on innocent people for their own benefits.

First on puck.....

 

[arcjoif6]

I can only speak for my self

A note of caution to all parents/kids tempted by joining a new Junior league.

In 2014, we were approached during the Chowder Cup of Boston by the owner of a team in the defunct CIHL. Lots of attention towards our son, promises on development and all that a good junior team would normally offer (sticks, equipment, track suits, daily practices when no games etc..). Coming back from Boston the pressure mounted every day from phone calls, emails pressing on a commitment. Our son was of course very happy about all this stuff which of course added to making a decision although he was invited to a few CJHL camps; coming out of Minor Midget AAA he was also guarantee a spot at Major Midget if he wanted it. He liked the idea of playing with older players and being away from home. We finally agreed to join that league and early August he moved out accompanied by a fat cheque.

Long story short, early November the owners started cancelling games to which we found out lead to a split of teams, our joining the WUHL (or something like that).

New start, lasted about a month to then find out our team was now cancelling practices, the owner didn't respond to our emails. We drove down, could not find the owner, found out the head coach had just quit and some young man was now running the whole show but didn't know where the owner was. Third week of December; kids are told to leave all team gear in the locker room but take their own personal stuff; next thing we know, the team has folded. Ouch......

About 8K gone, 21 kids from Canada, US and Europe left to themselves and not knowing what to do next.

Above is simply to send a warning to all those parents and kids about new Junior leagues; we never thought it would happen to us but it did.

I am not saying this new league will be the same. Take my word of advice though; make sure you do not pay the full amount in advance. Ensure you ask lots of questions and ask to see proof (what brand of sticks, hours of practice, etc..) just be very cautious.

To finish, I certainly wish the best of success to this new league and players/parents that will be joining. There is a majority of good people in hockey and it is too bad a very few tarnish the sport by greed and deceit as it hurts those honest people that work so hard at it. Hockey (Minor or Junior) has become a business and where there is money, there is always an opportunity for crooks to pounce on innocent people for their own benefits.

First on puck.....

Could I ask which team your son played on, the reason I ask is a lot of bogus stories have been popping up lately from people trying to discourage options in hockey.
I am really sorry that happened to you if it is true.

I totally agree with you, parents should do their homework.

let me state how I am a little different.
1\ I do not do this to take advantage of kids, never have and never will. you will notice by the price I will be charging. 8k is extremely far from what I will be charging
2:\besides us being in the Cpjhl we will be in 2-3 American junior hockey showcases
3:\ I have a track record with my minor hockey programs.
4:\the cpjhl is built on cost effective rules, we do not want to see happen, what is happening everywhere else, whith outrageous league fees, and money just going to the top, having nothing to do with the efficient running of the league.
5:\equipment package, will be directly done by the players, through the sherwood website. you will see that equipement package price is below what other leagues are charging.
6:\As for it becoming a business, I do not disagree with you, but I am trying to do everything I can to slow it down from becoming a cuthroat business.

7:/I always protect my family, in the event something HAPPENS like what happened in the CIHL, I have made arrangementS to be in more showcases,
CPJHL is REALLY DOing A GREAT JOB OF CREATING A LEAGUE THAT IS FINANCIALLY SOUND. NOT BUILT ON MONEY FIRST. i HAVE TOTAL CONFIDENCE IN WHAT MR.Elliott and his staff are doing. As I said before I had 4 options on the table.
I chose this one because the numbers make sense and the talks I have had with CJPHL STAFF, have reinforced my belief that we can build something special.
8:\this will be a drug free environment,
because you do not know me, I understand your heed of caution, but only time will tell, if I am A liar or not.
thank you
Angelo

 

[arcjoif6]

spin off

No, but your joining a spin off league that is being created by GMHL teams. Its going to have the same impact regarding CHL scouts being able to see your players. They are banned from seeing any non sanctioned league, no matter the initials in it.

I know right now you believe it is just a spin off league, but I promise before the first puck drops you will be surprised at some of the people involved and things that are planned.
not everything is perfect, but like everything we do, our rule is simple, how can we make things better for the kids
as for banning scouts, if you really believe scouts do not attend. there is nothing else I can really say. I would suggest you ask a family the next time, you see one, that participated in my programs.
thanks

 

[Tigers1992]

I know right now you believe it is just a spin off league, but I promise before the first puck drops you will be surprised at some of the people involved and things that are planned.
not everything is perfect, but like everything we do, our rule is simple, how can we make things better for the kids
as for banning scouts, if you really believe scouts do not attend. there is nothing else I can really say. I would suggest you ask a family the next time, you see one, that participated in my programs.
thanks

As an agent/adviser, my job is to talk and interact with OHL and sometimes QMJHL scouts. They are NOT ALLOWED to go to outlaw games and have told me that they do not go.

Its from the horses mouth, and its from Hockey Canada.....I'm not sure what else there is to be said here.

Could I ask which team your son played on, the reason I ask is a lot of bogus stories have been popping up lately from people trying to discourage options in hockey.
I am really sorry that happened to you if it is true.

They are not making it up, its right here
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_United_Hockey_League

The fiasco of the CIHL is very well documented.

 

[cchltier1fan]

Tigers1992 is right all this stuff is well documented.
More and more of these types of programs are popping up across North America and disappearing also. If I was a parent looking to spend my hockey $$'s I certainly would not do so in the first year of operation. I would be concerned that it looks like a spin-off of the GMHL. The hockey in the GMHL is not very good (Junior C at best and costs a lot more), it seems to survive by charging big $$ to European players and younger players. If you look at the top scorers most are European or 20/21 years old.
In my time being involved in CCHL many GMHL players tried out but none made it with the organization I worked with and I only know of 1 or 2 that made other teams, none were impact players.
In the end it is buyer beware, it was only a matter of time before this type of league tried Eastern Ontario. My advice to a player would be to play Jr B or Midget AAA (even AA) if you can instead.

 

[arcjoif6]

Tigers1992 is right all this stuff is well documented.
More and more of these types of programs are popping up across North America and disappearing also. If I was a parent looking to spend my hockey $$'s I certainly would not do so in the first year of operation. I would be concerned that it looks like a spin-off of the GMHL. The hockey in the GMHL is not very good (Junior C at best and costs a lot more), it seems to survive by charging big $$ to European players and younger players. If you look at the top scorers most are European or 20/21 years old.
In my time being involved in CCHL many GMHL players tried out but none made it with the organization I worked with and I only know of 1 or 2 that made other teams, none were impact players.
In the end it is buyer beware, it was only a matter of time before this type of league tried Eastern Ontario. My advice to a player would be to play Jr B or Midget AAA (even AA) if you can instead.

again I repeat please do your homework.
I agree with A, the but there are things that differs, is in the following days, I will publicize players being signed, and you the parents can be the judge of what was said by A, sometimes its the leagues you know that you should beware of. please follow the best option for you In all my responses I have not talked about negatives of other leagues, but if things are misrepresented, I will be forced to talk about those issues. I have no problem A talking about facts, that seems fair, also warning parents seems fair, but there are many differences with what I am running. there is a track record of teams last year. So please all I ask if you attack my program, not an imaginary program, that has nothing to do with me. and please judge for your yourself, just like on the ice your instincts are seldom wrong.
thank you

 

[arcjoif6]

just when I was respecting you

as an agent/adviser, my job is to talk and interact with ohl and sometimes qmjhl scouts. They are not allowed to go to outlaw games and have told me that they do not go.

Its from the horses mouth, and its from hockey canada.....i'm not sure what else there is to be said here.




They are not making it up, its right here
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/world_united_hockey_league

the fiasco of the cihl is very well documented.

please do not be one of those,playing with words and trying to confuse the topic at hand.
But on the topic of your interactions with junior scouts what is their biggest complaints about ottawa hockey players. Just curious

 

[cchltier1fan]

again I repeat please do your homework.
I agree with A, the but there are things that differs, is in the following days, I will publicize players being signed, and you the parents can be the judge of what was said by A, sometimes its the leagues you know that you should beware of. please follow the best option for you In all my responses I have not talked about negatives of other leagues, but if things are misrepresented, I will be forced to talk about those issues. I have no problem A talking about facts, that seems fair, also warning parents seems fair, but there are many differences with what I am running. there is a track record of teams last year. So please all I ask if you attack my program, not an imaginary program, that has nothing to do with me. and please judge for your yourself, just like on the ice your instincts are seldom wrong.
thank you

There are no facts to talk about regarding this league other than franchises have been assigned, that is reality. You have not disclosed any either. The history of these types of leagues is not very good in this province and that is a fact. All I am saying is that I would not recommend anyone to commit to this type of league , especially in year 1.

If you are going to come on here to self promote, which is what you are doing, then arm yourself with facts. To date everything you have talked about is vague and your opinion only. What you have said would only make me more concerned. It sounds a lot like CIHL, lots of talk.

 

[Tigers1992]

please do not be one of those,playing with words and trying to confuse the topic at hand.

What? All I did was present facts. OHL/CHL scouts do not go to these leagues, they've told me, they are not allowed to go to them, they go they loose their job.

Here, I don't know the policy off by heart but this is exactly what Ive been told

1. No OHL Member Team representative nor any representatives of the OHL Central Scouting Bureau are permitted to scout players who are playing for teams who are Members of Leagues outside of the auspices of Hockey Canada, USA Hockey or the IIHF (“Outlaw Leagues”).

2. Players currently playing in “Outlaw Leagues” (eg. Greater Metro Junior Hockey League, Canadian International Hockey League) are ineligible for selection in the OHL Priority Selection Process.

3. Undrafted players currently playing in “Outlaw Leagues” (eg., Greater Metro Junior Hockey League, Canadian International Hockey League) who make application and who are otherwise eligible to play in the Ontario Hockey League for the 2014-15 playing season would be placed on waivers by the Ontario Hockey League and subject to claim based on current OHL Waiver Policies and Procedures.
http://thejuniorhockeynews.com/?p=27330

Your new league falls into the Outlaw classification. There's no playing with words here, its black and white.

But on the topic of your interactions with junior scouts what is their biggest complaints about ottawa hockey players. Just curious

They don't have any complaints about the players. They dislike the new setup because they feel it to the benefit of the CCHL, not to the players. Well see.

 

[arcjoif6]

not a problem with that answer

What? All I did was present facts. OHL/CHL scouts do not go to these leagues, they've told me, they are not allowed to go to them, they go they loose their job.

Here, I don't know the policy off by heart but this is exactly what Ive been told

1. No OHL Member Team representative nor any representatives of the OHL Central Scouting Bureau are permitted to scout players who are playing for teams who are Members of Leagues outside of the auspices of Hockey Canada, USA Hockey or the IIHF (“Outlaw Leaguesâ€).

2. Players currently playing in “Outlaw Leagues†(eg. Greater Metro Junior Hockey League, Canadian International Hockey League) are ineligible for selection in the OHL Priority Selection Process.

3. Undrafted players currently playing in “Outlaw Leagues†(eg., Greater Metro Junior Hockey League, Canadian International Hockey League) who make application and who are otherwise eligible to play in the Ontario Hockey League for the 2014-15 playing season would be placed on waivers by the Ontario Hockey League and subject to claim based on current OHL Waiver Policies and Procedures.
http://thejuniorhockeynews.com/?p=27330

Your new league falls into the Outlaw classification. There's no playing with words here, its black and white.




They don't have any complaints about the players. They dislike the new setup because they feel it to the benefit of the CCHL, not to the players. Well see.

I do not have a problem with your last answer, but the answer before you sent people to a cihl link at wikapedia, that is all I meant, you could of sent them to Hockey canada's site or even my site. but you decided to send them there.
Once again I will repeat I never said there was not a hockey canada rule, I was just stating what is happening on the ground, and the exemptions to that rule.

 

[Tigers1992]

I do not have a problem with your last answer, but the answer before you sent people to a cihl link at wikapedia, that is all I meant, you could of sent them to Hockey canada's site or even my site. but you decided to send them there.
Once again I will repeat I never said there was not a hockey canada rule, I was just stating what is happening on the ground, and the exemptions to that rule.

But again, regarding the OHL scouts, I interact with them 8 months a year, from their mouths, they're not going to these leagues. If they where, you'd see players getting OHL camp invites. It just doesn't happen.

Re the WUHL, I'm confused.

You questioned the posters story (suggesting that alot of outlaw league stories are bogus), I posted a link to the league in which he was talking about, showing that its wasn't a 'bogus story'.

Why would I post a link to your site to prove his WUHL story correct? That doesn't make sense.

 

[arcjoif6]

There are no facts to talk about regarding this league other than franchises have been assigned, that is reality. You have not disclosed any either. The history of these types of leagues is not very good in this province and that is a fact. All I am saying is that I would not recommend anyone to commit to this type of league , especially in year 1.

If you are going to come on here to self promote, which is what you are doing, then arm yourself with facts. To date everything you have talked about is vague and your opinion only. What you have said would only make me more concerned. It sounds a lot like CIHL, lots of talk.

I have no problem with your opinion A, that is everyone's right, and you can keep referencing CIHL ALL YOU WANT. we could also talk about things that were promised on your end, and did not deliver, and imagine you had all the advantages to start it right. so lets see we have a new league starting, your right, there is no record of that league in particular. so no arguments here, but then we do have a track record of new league that was started last year. maybe we should discuss that league. but I will not for one simple reason. I believe there are other options out there and nobody has the perfect answer.
as for promoting myself, if I was really trying to sell myself, I would play the same game everyone plays, but I choose to make sure parents educate themselves and then choose the best option for them. I am just decoration, rather unpretty if I say myself.

 

[arcjoif6]

you got to be kidding me

I'm confused.

You questioned the posters story (suggesting that alot of outlaw league stories are bogus), I posted a link to the league in which he was talking about, showing that its wasn't a 'bogus story'.

Why would I post a link to your site to prove his WUHL story correct? That doesn't make sense.

so I state again anyone reading you're post will surely notice that we were discussing hockey canada rules regarding scouting. if you must.coontinue the game.
as for leagues that started as an independent league, you got me excited, so just for you. I am compiling a list of references to leagues that began as independent and where are they now. I got go now, but will post it once I am finished.
I HOPE I DO NOT GET DELETED BEFORE i AM ABLE TO POST.

 

[Tigers1992]

so I state again anyone reading you're post will surely notice that we were discussing hockey canada rules regarding scouting. if you must.coontinue the game.
as for leagues that started as an independent league, you got me excited, so just for you. I am compiling a list of references to leagues that began as independent and where are they now. I got go now, but will post it once I am finished.
I HOPE I DO NOT GET DELETED BEFORE i AM ABLE TO POST.

Your all over the map? You where upset that I linked to the WUHL page when someone was talking about the WUHL and it folding? You wanted me to link to your site? It makes no sense to link to your site to prove the WUHL folding? What does this have to do with this post? If you are upset about people talking about folded independent leagues, sorry, but it folded, and that was the topic.

Anyone else reading this utterly confused here?

If you where nicer to people, they wouldn't get deleted. Simple rule, treat others with respect. You don't, your posts get deleted.

 

[cchltier1fan]

so I state again anyone reading you're post will surely notice that we were discussing hockey canada rules regarding scouting. if you must.coontinue the game.
as for leagues that started as an independent league, you got me excited, so just for you. I am compiling a list of references to leagues that began as independent and where are they now. I got go now, but will post it once I am finished.
I HOPE I DO NOT GET DELETED BEFORE i AM ABLE TO POST.

I am confused also Tigers1992, something we agree on!!

Not sure that makes any sense to compose a list (even the OJHL was independent 25 years ago). The recent history for these leagues is not good nor is the reputation of the GMHL where your member partners come from for the most part.....

 

[arcjoif6]

Your all over the map? You where upset that I linked to the WUHL page when someone was talking about the WUHL and it folding? You wanted me to link to your site? It makes no sense to link to your site to prove the WUHL folding? What does this have to do with this post? If you are upset about people talking about folded independent leagues, sorry, but it folded, and that was the topic.

Anyone else reading this utterly confused here?

If you where nicer to people, they wouldn't get deleted. Simple rule, treat others with respect. You don't, your posts get deleted.[/QUO

Again we were talking about ohl scouts and rules, and you jumped to the wikapedia, article, I am far from upset about stories of leagues going under. I think it is a viable source of education, for a various of reasons, for both sides of the argument.
I did not say that poster had a bogus story, I even said sorry if it really happened, not because it affected me, but because it gives hockey a bad name.
MY SITE has references to hockey canada rules, that is why I said that
but if you are asking about making sense you tell me, if your post did.
as for being all over the map, that's okay my map has no borders.
lastly I think I am really nice, I do not hide behind a Tag name, that is why I have great respect for Clarke as a person, it says a lot about someone.
But if you think I will just sit back and let the car salesman/woman be the gatekeepers of the truth. you do not know me really well.
unfortunately I have weakness but I find it is also a strength, when I balance it, I am an idealist.

 

[Tigers1992]

Again we were talking about ohl scouts and rules, and you jumped to the wikapedia, article, I am far from upset about stories of leagues going under. I think it is a viable source of education, for a various of reasons, for both sides of the argument.
I did not say that poster had a bogus story, I even said sorry if it really happened, not because it affected me, but because it gives hockey a bad name.
MY SITE has references to hockey canada rules, that is why I said that
but if you are asking about making sense you tell me, if your post did.
as for being all over the map, that's okay my map has no borders.
lastly I think I am really nice, I do not hide behind a Tag name, that is why I have great respect for Clarke as a person, it says a lot about someone.
But if you think I will just sit back and let the car salesman/woman be the gatekeepers of the truth. you do not know me really well.
unfortunately I have weakness but I find it is also a strength, when I balance it, I am an idealist.

This is silly but I think I got my head around it. First you said you where upset about the wiki article

I do not have a problem with your last answer, but the answer before you sent people to a cihl link at wikapedia, that is all I meant, you could of sent them to Hockey canada's site or even my site. but you decided to send them there.

But I think you mean the Junior Hockey News article. You confused the two.

With all due respect, you can't get upset about us not linking to the 'right' links. You can't attempt to control what is posted and said. The cool thing about this board is we are all allowed to come on here and articulate our beliefs and views, as long as we do it respectfully. That was the first link that came up in Google, no more then thar, so to suggest that I'm in here 'playing with words', when I'm simply offering a link to backup my statements, is unfair. You can't expect us to only post things you like or make your venture look good, that's not how it works.

No one is a used car sales person here, everyone is talking about the functions of independent leagues and what realistic outcomes are. If your unhappy about that, don't instigate the topic on a public message board. The only reason your posts are deleated are because your rude to people in them. It has nothing to do with taking away your message and everything to do with treating people with respect. If you did that, nothing would be taken down. You can't co e on here, call people names after disagreeing with you and expect to be allowed to do so, that's not how it works here.

 

[Tigers1992]

delete

 

[arcjoif6]

This is silly, again, the only reason I posted to the WUHL site was because the poster was talking about the WUHL. If you expect me not to, your not being realistic, and you should know that

No one is a used car sales person here, everyone is talking about the functions of independent leagues and what realistic outcomes are. If your unhappy about that, don't instigate the topic on a public message board. The only reason your posts are deleated are because your rude ago people in them. It has nothing to do with taking away your message and everything to do with treating people with respect. If you did that, nothing would be taken down. You can't co e on here, call people names after disagreeing with you and expect to be allowed to do so, that's not how it works here.

I am not calling anybody names, because I do not know anybodie's name on here, and do not know who everyone is ,on the board,

 

[arcjoif6]

Joining the GMHL will take away any CHL scouts ability to scout your games, this is a fact. As Im sure your aware, they are banned from attending any non sanctioned Hockey Canada games.

Either way, there is no doubt a market for your product and as long as you say, parents are educated, then all the power too you.

you can deny, but this what started our conversation
as for links to defunct leagues, i will repeat it again, i think links are good to share, it can be used to learn from, from both sides.
thanks

 

[Bossman]

How many Sharpshooters got drafted yesterday ?