Ottawa Senators announce completion of 135 million financing | MOD warning post #303

[tony d]

Interesting news. If it helps the team keep Karlsson and make improvements to the team on-ice then it's good. I still would like to see Melnyk sell all or part of his stake in the team.

 

[albator71]

These stupid promises of us getting better based on Melnycks loan ageeement - we suck because we cannot maintain relationships with our key players and there is no leadership from the owner.

Winning has nothing to do with money, we proved that once, Begas proved that this year. Winning is a habit, it’s a culture, its discipline, it’s hard work - this organization doesn’t have these qualities at the top of enough of them, therefore we will never be ready for prime time

And should we be proud of team has a $135 million dollar debt. This is a joke

i agree with everything you said, but the players need to show more leadership also on the ice and in the dressing room. Last season the players quit on eachother and that shows a lack of leadership in the dressing room.

 

[coladin]

There's a difference between not supporting and not caring. I think every single poster on this board cares about the Ottawa Senators and the future of the team. Even those I disagree with. We all just have different visions on how to best achieve that future success. I happen to count myself as one who does not believe this team can ever thrive under Eugene Melnyk's management. As do the posters you enumerated in your post. But don't mistake disgust with management with apathy. If we truly didn't care, we wouldn't be spending our time posting here.

Caring and a buck 75 get you a double double. Like, big deal. Actions speak louder than words and if the team had the same support as the other NHL teams, a lot of this uncertainty about the captain and ending up at the cap floor wouldn't even be an issue. But keep caring.

 

[coladin]

Or one number was quoted in CAD while the other in USD. Or Melnyk who now has access to a low interest 100m credit facility maxed that out then needed 135m more. The problem is that we can't see overall debt position or the financials so we will never know.

If this is all this debt, on a valuation north of 600M, the franchise is in a reasonably healthy position. You borrow on these critical valuations. If he gets decent revenues then things do not have to be so bleak. It won't change dubious hockey personnel decisions, which are not his fault, but this news is very positive. The fact that he went Trudeau and pumped his chest out to tell everyone is a message to the city that he isn't going anywhere and he is going to invest in the team. Again, for those who can put aside their disdain and vitriol for the owner, it is a crucial bit of positive news.

The fact that they smashed back hard on the Pagnotta article , emphatically, leaves very little wiggle room if he is indeed lying. But I don't see it.

 

[Sensung]

Caring and a buck 75 get you a double double. Like, big deal. Actions speak louder than words and if the team had the same support as the other NHL teams, a lot of this uncertainty about the captain and ending up at the cap floor wouldn't even be an issue. But keep caring.

Bullshit. The team made money and cut budget.

 

[Sensung]

If this is all this debt, on a valuation north of 600M, the franchise is in a reasonably healthy position. You borrow on these critical valuations. If he gets decent revenues then things do not have to be so bleak. It won't change dubious hockey personnel decisions, which are not his fault, but this news is very positive. The fact that he went Trudeau and pumped his chest out to tell everyone is a message to the city that he isn't going anywhere and he is going to invest in the team. Again, for those who can put aside their disdain and vitriol for the owner, it is a crucial bit of positive news.

The fact that they smashed back hard on the Pagnotta article , emphatically, leaves very little wiggle room if he is indeed lying. But I don't see it.

Bolded just tells us it is perfect timing for a fan boycott to crush his revenue stream.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Delete.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Caring and a buck 75 get you a double double. Like, big deal. Actions speak louder than words and if the team had the same support as the other NHL teams, a lot of this uncertainty about the captain and ending up at the cap floor wouldn't even be an issue. But keep caring.

Yeah actions like earning average revenues for the last decade yet penny-pinching every chance he gets, downsizing the scouting staff, selling draft picks, and wanting to ice the cheapest team possible.

Keep buying what the televangelist is selling.

 

[coladin]

Yeah actions like earning average revenues for the last decade yet penny-pinching every chance he gets, downsizing the scouting staff, selling draft picks, and wanting to ice the cheapest team possible.

Keep buying what the televangelist is selling.

Penny pinching because...it's fun? He is losing money dude. Like seriously. What do people do when they lose money? They cut costs. People around here want the guy to double down. of course, they don't go to the games and they want to watch their players on his dime. Doesn't work that way here. We are not the Rangers, Leafs or Flyers. It is what it is in Ottawa, and it won't change. Doesn't matter who owns the team. .

 

[Sensung]

Penny pinching because...it's fun? He is losing money dude. Like seriously. What do people do when they lose money? They cut costs. People around here want the guy to double down. of course, they don't go to the games and they want to watch their players on his dime. Doesn't work that way here. We are not the Rangers, Leafs or Flyers. It is what it is in Ottawa, and it won't change. Doesn't matter who owns the team. .

He makes money operating the Sens and CTC.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Penny pinching because...it's fun? He is losing money dude. Like seriously. What do people do when they lose money? They cut costs. People around here want the guy to double down. of course, they don't go to the games and they want to watch their players on his dime. Doesn't work that way here. We are not the Rangers, Leafs or Flyers. It is what it is in Ottawa, and it won't change. Doesn't matter who owns the team. .

Yeah he’s losing money because of the debt he has taken on, not because of the market or lack of passion from fans.

Fans can impact revenue and income before interest expenses, which have been about average.

 

[coladin]

Yeah he’s losing money because of the debt he has taken on, not because of the market or lack of passion from fans.

Fans can impact revenue and income before interest expenses, which have been about average.

Gil, the debt comes from him borrowing on shortfalls. He keeps borrowing on the valuation of the team. When he loses $10M, he is not writing the cheque, he will borrow it. Now, that the valuation has skyrocketed, he can borrow safely, and at much better rates. But he is losing money.

I like our ticket prices. But being where they are hurts the bottom line. Attendance is also a major factor costing millions. And when the margins are as tight as they are, in this market the passion from fans is not translating.

 

[Sensung]

Gil, the debt comes from him borrowing on shortfalls. He keeps borrowing on the valuation of the team. When he loses $10M, he is not writing the cheque, he will borrow it. Now, that the valuation has skyrocketed, he can borrow safely, and at much better rates. But he is losing money.

I like our ticket prices. But being where they are hurts the bottom line. Attendance is also a major factor costing millions. And when the margins are as tight as they are, in this market the passion from fans is not translating.

Except he's not losing money on his operations.

Well he didn't in the past, but we'll make sure he does from now until he sells the team.

 

[DueDiligence]

He makes money operating the Sens and CTC.

On paper maybe. But he could have a negative cash flow because he still has to pay off his debt. He owes lenders more than this $135 million.

 

[DueDiligence]

Gil, the debt comes from him borrowing on shortfalls. He keeps borrowing on the valuation of the team. When he loses $10M, he is not writing the cheque, he will borrow it. Now, that the valuation has skyrocketed, he can borrow safely, and at much better rates. But he is losing money.

I like our ticket prices. But being where they are hurts the bottom line. Attendance is also a major factor costing millions. And when the margins are as tight as they are, in this market the passion from fans is not translating.

He still has to pay off the loans! Whether he's making money or losing money it's on paper. The reality is that he is short of cash. Hence the new loan.

 

[Sensung]

On paper maybe. But he could have a negative cash flow because he still has to pay off his debt. He owes lenders more than this $135 million.

His problem, not ours.

 

[DueDiligence]

His problem, not ours.

Well if you want to keep a guy like Karlsson it is! No cash means no Karlsson.

 

[Sensung]

Well if you want to keep a guy like Karlsson it is! No cash means no Karlsson.

If Karlsson needs to go to get rid of this owner, then so be it.

 

[coladin]

He still has to pay off the loans! Whether he's making money or losing money it's on paper. The reality is that he is short of cash. Hence the new loan.

But it is not a new loan. It is a refinance of existing debt plus he borrowed some more for things he wants to do. Needs to do.

 

[DueDiligence]

But it is not a new loan. It is a refinance of existing debt plus he borrowed some more for things he wants to do. Needs to do.

Maybe $100 million or so is repaying some old debt that has come due. That leaves $35 million to help his cash flow. It is a "new loan". He also could owe another $200 million or so in addition to the $135.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Caring and a buck 75 get you a double double. Like, big deal. Actions speak louder than words and if the team had the same support as the other NHL teams, a lot of this uncertainty about the captain and ending up at the cap floor wouldn't even be an issue. But keep caring.

I am not amongst those who think this is all on Melnyk but it is hard to defend Melnyk's behaviour this past year: threatens relocation and is seemingly not in love with Lebreton all of a sudden.

Consumer confidence is low. It's on him to raise it back to where it was, there's no way around that simple fact: if people stop caring then getting them back is much harder.

 

[mysens]

But it is not a new loan. It is a refinance of existing debt plus he borrowed some more for things he wants to do. Needs to do.

Bingo, but it seems like some people have a real hard time understanding what this means. Geez.

 

[mysens]

He makes money operating the Sens and CTC.

Oh, where did you get this info? I guess you must have taken on a job within the orginaiztion or maybe you have privy to all the financials because you work with the lenders?? How can he make money? Too many seats empty. Math 101.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Oh, where did you get this info? I guess you must have taken on a job within the orginaiztion or maybe you have privy to all the financials because you work with the lenders?? How can he make money? Too many seats empty. Math 101.

He said Sens + CTC. Yes, those together make a profit. All those concerts and events, parking and other ventures not included in HRR. Overall, Eugene makes money, and has for a long time.

 

[mysens]

He said Sens + CTC. Yes, those together make a profit. All those concerts and events, parking and other ventures not included in HRR. Overall, Eugene makes money, and has for a long time.

So, Peter and Paul to pay Mary....does not work like that. The Sens as an orginization lose money because of the empty seats.