OT: Other Sports: Broncos, Nuggets, Rockies... V

[chet1926]

Ill side with Flores always. NFL owners are rotten. the league is a good ol boys club. Its not hard to see there is an issue, I hope he burns it all down.

Just because you think that the league is rotten doesn't mean Flores has a case. For the record I agree with you and the league it's probably highly corrupt.

Not going to comment on the Giants and Dolphins portion. But in terms of Denver his case is extremely weak and very obvious attempt of throwing something at the wall and hoping it sticks. Based on what's available out there I can easily see how the Broncos will refute this. They'll paint the picture of a compulsive liar and they'll submit their files and more than likely this portion of Flores case will be dropped.

Sad part is knowing Elway's personality Flores was probably right about him being hungover. But there is a big difference between being an arrogant, drunk dumbass, which is what Elway is, and a racist. Was it fair to Flores probably not. But I wouldn't be shocked if Elway acted like a fool in multiple interviews.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Elway and a Dewars and Soda. Name a better duo.

 

[BobRossColton]

Washington commanders? Seems iffy

 

[Hasbro]

Elway and a Dewars and Soda. Name a better duo.

That's a trio.

 

[Bonzai12]

I think Flores is right, but I also am getting the vibe that Flores is an absolute pain in the a to deal with. Miami fired him because he couldn’t get along with anyone in the front office. He wanted to overrule everyone on player personnel and drive his starting QB out (Tua) for Deshaun Watson; and was completely open about it.


now - after reading that. Go back and insert the name Josh McDaniels in there vs using Flores. They both got fired for the exact same reasons. And ironically, they both came out of the NE tree and nobody wants to work with them. The similarities are crazy. That’s fine if he wants to use the race card, but going into a franchise and trying to perform scorched earth decision making typically hasn’t gone over well.

 

[Avaholics Anonymous]

Then an interview from him, surfaces from 2020 that literally refutes all of his claims as he says his interview with Denver "went well" and it was "great to meet the executives."

Snipped to the relevant section, but...

I seriously doubt he had much choice in saying anything else at the time, since I'm sure he still wanted to be considered for other coaching gigs.

 

[Avaholics Anonymous]

I think Flores is right, but I also am getting the vibe that Flores is an absolute pain in the a to deal with. Miami fired him because he couldn’t get along with anyone in the front office. He wanted to overrule everyone on player personnel and drive his starting QB out (Tua) for Deshaun Watson; and was completely open about it.


now - after reading that. Go back and insert the name Josh McDaniels in there vs using Flores. They both got fired for the exact same reasons. And ironically, they both came out of the NE tree and nobody wants to work with them. The similarities are crazy. That’s fine if he wants to use the race card, but going into a franchise and trying to perform scorched earth decision making typically hasn’t gone over well.

Are you referring to the Josh McDaniels who was just hired as the Raiders head coach? Weird how he seems to still get opportunities, despite being fired for the exact same reasons.

 

[Grackle Party]

Are you referring to the Josh McDaniels who was just hired as the Raiders head coach? Weird how he seems to still get opportunities, despite being fired for the exact same reasons.

Exactly imagine the labels a black man would get if he no called no showed a job he accepted (McDaniels w/ the Colts last year)

 

[AvsWraith]

If the Broncos are so racist, and only interviewing black candidates to make the quota, why hire Vance Joeseph in the first place? They could've just used him to fulfill the quota as well. And why did the Flores interview go the full three and a half hours allotted? If you're gonna blow someone off, I don't think you use the full time. Sorry, but I don't think the Broncos belong in this suit, and this is coming from someone that isn't a fan of the Elway and Ellis management.

 

[chet1926]

Snipped to the relevant section, but...

I seriously doubt he had much choice in saying anything else at the time, since I'm sure he still wanted to be considered for other coaching gigs.

Well forced or not, it's out there now as something he said. And I can guarantee the Broncos will use it against him.

 

[Avaholics Anonymous]

Well forced or not, it's out there now as something he said. And I can guarantee the Broncos will use it against him.

Agreed, and I didn't really mean to imply he was "forced", but more like trying not to burn bridges in an industry where there are only so many head coaching jobs available.

If his main complaint is they showed up late and hung over, which they are refuting and apparently have the receipts to do so, I can't see the Broncos having any issues.

 

[Avaholics Anonymous]

Exactly imagine the labels a black man would get if he no called no showed a job he accepted (McDaniels w/ the Colts last year)

Wow good call, I actually completely forgot about that one!

I think I'm even more shocked now that McDaniels got another chance, but I'm very happy to see it's with the Raiders at least

 

[willy702]

If the Broncos are so racist, and only interviewing black candidates to make the quota, why hire Vance Joeseph in the first place? They could've just used him to fulfill the quota as well. And why did the Flores interview go the full three and a half hours allotted? If you're gonna blow someone off, I don't think you use the full time. Sorry, but I don't think the Broncos belong in this suit, and this is coming from someone that isn't a fan of the Elway and Ellis management.

Agreed on that, plus he'd be hard pressed to prove they hired someone with less qualifications than he had. If they went out and hired some nobody that just was Elway's buddy or something then he might get somewhere, but they hired one of the best defensive minds in the game who very few disagreed with as a good hire at the time. Its one thing to say I think someone is racist and should have given me more respect/consideration/thought/whatever but feels like this whole add the Broncos to it was just suggested by his lawyer. I highly doubt when he first thought about pursuing action the Broncos were on top of his list of who to go after.

 

[Bonzai12]

Are you referring to the Josh McDaniels who was just hired as the Raiders head coach? Weird how he seems to still get opportunities, despite being fired for the exact same reasons.

you realize Flores still has interviews ongoing, right?

From McDaniels - “When I went to Denver, I knew a little bit of football. I didn’t really know people and how important that aspect of this process, and maintaining the culture and building the team was. And I failed, and I didn’t succeed at it. Looking at that experience has been one of the best things in my life in terms of my overall growth as a person, as a coach. What do I need to do different, how do I need to handle my role, if I have another opportunity, and do better at it? I feel like that’s really an area that I’ve tried to grow in.”

While I think there’s an obvious race problem - there’s only one black coach in the NFL, I think Flores has tended to rub people the wrong way in an almost identical path as Josh.

 

[Avaholics Anonymous]

you realize Flores still has interviews ongoing, right?

From McDaniels - “When I went to Denver, I knew a little bit of football. I didn’t really know people and how important that aspect of this process, and maintaining the culture and building the team was. And I failed, and I didn’t succeed at it. Looking at that experience has been one of the best things in my life in terms of my overall growth as a person, as a coach. What do I need to do different, how do I need to handle my role, if I have another opportunity, and do better at it? I feel like that’s really an area that I’ve tried to grow in.”

While I think there’s an obvious race problem - there’s only one black coach in the NFL, I think Flores has tended to rub people the wrong way in an almost identical path as Josh.

Fair enough, I did not know he had more interviews, that's an important point to bring up. Thank you for mentioning it, and I suppose we'll see how those play out.

I was mainly curious about what he had to say about the Broncos since they are my team. I'm not going to jump to any conclusions before all the evidence comes out, because until then it's just speculation, but I was hoping that the organization wasn't as bad as he tried to claim. (seems unlikely to me)

You brought McDaniels into the conversation though, and I found it interesting how the scenarios have played out so differently, especially since you think they have both made the same mistakes. Except for the one point that was mentioned...

Do you think Flores would've been given a second chance had he accepted a job and then decided not to show up?

 

[sethro109]

Interesting take from ex Broncos RT Polumbus. He wanted Quinn and hated McDaniels. Thinks he could find success if he learned how to manage people.

I hope you didn't learn a goddamn thing and drives that organization into the ground.

 

[chet1926]

Wrong thread, meant for Broncos forum

 

[Pokecheque]

The point is not whether Flores is a good coach or not, or whether he has an abrasive personality. It’s that he wasn’t given the same runway comparable or worse coaches have been given. And obviously black coaches are not given nearly as many opportunities either.

Flores is hardly the best guy to be leading this charge but I’m glad he’s doing it.

The Broncos stuff is pretty embarrassing but I believe it.

 

[chet1926]

The point is not whether Flores is a good coach or not, or whether he has an abrasive personality. It’s that he wasn’t given the same runway comparable or worse coaches have been given. And obviously black coaches are not given nearly as many opportunities either.

Flores is hardly the best guy to be leading this charge but I’m glad he’s doing it.

The Broncos stuff is pretty embarrassing but I believe it.

Agreed it has really nothing to do with his coaching. His personality and the "Patriot" way is maybe some insight into why he got a short leash kind if like McD in Denver. But who really knows.

At the end of the day you are correct it's that minority coaches aren't given the same chances/opportunities as white coaches. Perfect example is right here in Denver VJ got 2 seasons, Vic got 3. They both equally sucked so why did the white old guy get an extra year? They both sucked and should have been out after 2 years, since you set the precedence of 2 years of suck before firing when you fired VJ.

As for the Broncos stuff it's not at all shocking. Elway is a notorious booze hound, partier. And he more than likely conducted business in an unprofessional manner. Probably explains why he couldn't hire a coach to save his life or draft worth a shit. Because he didn't treat job with respect and continued his party goer night life ways.

If I'm the new owner my first business move would be to show Ellis and Elway out the door. They are both clowns who will not represent your organization the way it needs to be. It's time to get the Broncos back to where Pat left them.

 

[RockLobster]

Not trying start any controversies on a chat board or belittle a serious issue, but man is Flores digging his own grave with the Broncos.

Flores files a lawsuit, saying he was discriminated against and we didn't give him the time of day, and Elway and Ellis showed up hungover, Broncos didn't respect him as a candidate etc.

Then an interview from him, surfaces from 2020 that literally refutes all of his claims as he says his interview with Denver "went well" and it was "great to meet the executives."

Broncos then release statement about how the allocations are false etc.

Flores then refutes the Broncos statement today, by saying he only "deals in truth"

So then which is the truth here? You can't have it be a interview that went well in 2020, but then was awful and racist in 2022.

If Flores wants any chance of proving his case, which by the second is going down the tube, he needs to shut his f***ing mouth until court. Flores is painting the picture of a compulsive liar and I guarantee it will be used against him.

Good. God.

What an absolutely, painstakingly, brutal hot-take, even from you.

Take off your f***ing Broncos blinders man. Consider the possibility that back then he said that stuff because he didn't want to immediately have his candidacy thrown out. Consider that it's possible (and I'd say entirely likely given how the NFL hiring cycle works) that the Broncos did interview him purely to satisfy the Rooney Rule, had no intent of actually hiring him, were late & hungover (or at least Elway...he's always struck me as a "whole bottle" type of guy).

Just about everything in here is pure and utter drivel, and it's repugnant. Do better.

 

[willy702]

Good. God.

What an absolutely, painstakingly, brutal hot-take, even from you.

Take off your f***ing Broncos blinders man. Consider the possibility that back then he said that stuff because he didn't want to immediately have his candidacy thrown out. Consider that it's possible (and I'd say entirely likely given how the NFL hiring cycle works) that the Broncos did interview him purely to satisfy the Rooney Rule, had no intent of actually hiring him, were late & hungover (or at least Elway...he's always struck me as a "whole bottle" type of guy).

Just about everything in here is pure and utter drivel, and it's repugnant. Do better.

Flores will get his time in court as he should. No one is questioning if there is racism in the NFL or society in general, we all pretty much know this to be true. However, the issue is that society and the media have this guilty until proven innocent mindset when it comes to accusing someone of a crime or wrongdoing these days. Even if the Broncos are 100% exonerated in this case because their name is dragged through an apparent issue that the Dolphins have with Flores they will be tagged with "racist organization" by a lot of people for years to come. Elway will be dragged through that mess for years to come. And for what? Because you "think" he was hungover and you "believed" he didn't give you full consideration? That is the ridiculous part.

These lawsuits and how they are portrayed in the media and hence society are the problem. If the man wants compensation and vindication for how his time in Miami ended I have no problem with that. But lawyers these days play this game and have turned it into a full blown lets tarnish everyone to get what we want situation. And to make it worse, when they do, they make identifying true problems and getting true justice much harder for anyone, not just Mr. Flores.

 

[Bender]

Washington commanders? Seems iffy

Can't wait to see how "The Commis" do!

Seriously, they've known that the Redskins moniker was offensive for at least 15-20 years before they finally decided to change it - to something 'neutral' to give them EVEN MORE TIME to come up with something better - and this is the best that they can come up with ?

How frikkin' broken is that franchise??

 

[Pokecheque]

How frikkin' broken is that franchise??

Since Danny Boy took over? Broken beyond belief.

 

[The Abusement Park]

I’m pissed that Armada was an option and they didn’t pick it. Armada would be a sweet name for a sports team.

 

[5280]

What was wrong with the Football team?