OT - Argos Yay or Nay?

[Phion Keneuf]

Leafs > Raptors >>>>> Jays >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TFC>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>ARGOs

Could care less about Football in general and especially CFL Football.

id have the Rock in there way before the argos

 

[hockeyfanz*]

when the Argos played at exhibition stadium in the 70's, they'd get 50,000 on most nights because it was a football stadium, since they playing at the sky dome or roger's centre, there are NO good seats and even the most die hard fan can't enjoy the game.
Toronto has become a NFL wannabe city, but I'm not sure they can even do that until they get a new stadium. The Bills experiment showed that Toronto may not even be an NFL supporter, but I think it has more to do with the stadium, and same with the Argos, a better stadium would increase attendance.

The truth is Toronto is not a very good sports town regardless of what people want to tell you.

The Jays haven't had good attendance since their glory days of WAMCO and World Series....

The Raptors have a decent "cult like" following but are far from sports darlings in this town...if they win..people get interested...and if they dont (which is a large part of their history) nobody cares.

The Argos are a joke attendance wise. Not sure how or why this team even exists...its pretty pathetic...they play in a 45000 seat stadium and they draw about 15K fans on average. To boot, they are a legitimately good team with possibly the best chance of any Toronto sports team of becoming champions.

The Marlies don't even draw that well if you ever been to the RICOH on a Sunday afternoon...lots and lots of empty seats. You would think that they would sell out being the Leafs farm team in a Leaf-crazed city. Not to mention..they are also a top team in the AHL and the tickets are very affordable. Doesn't matter.

Finally there are the Leafs..one of the worst NHL franchises(winning wise) since 67 expansion and maybe the absolute worst since the 2004 lockout but yet they seem to print money and are by far the most profitable NHL franchise.

The superior NFL cannot even draw 50K to the Rogers center. They have to give away tickets to fill the stadium, so they are not embarrassed.

Toronto is NOT a sports town. Toronto is not even a hockey town.

Toronto is a Leafs town.

 

[Bionda]

Please. Jays and Raptors fan presence is huge online. Attendance is solid even in lean years. I don't know where you're from, but my friends who watch sports are knowledgeable on the NHL, NBA, MLB and NFL, there is no exclusivity. Perhaps this is a product of my generation.

Few cities have a well rounded fanbase for every major sport. Which city has dedicated fans for multiple sports? Chicago? Sure. Maybe Boston (Celtics in a lull, Pats were never popular until Belichick showed up). Detroit is hardly deserving of being called a hockey town, when the Tigers, Lions, UofM, MSU all take precedence.

No one in Philly cares about the Sixers.. the Flyers have a small fanbase etc..
New York is a baseball city. Then come the Knicks.. Rangers are ignored.

I'm tired of people taking shots at Toronto. It is pathetic, our city has a complete lack of self-esteem/confidence. Some of the people who are critical of the city make up baseless accusations without actually having been here. One of them is the outrageous claim that no one cares about teams other than the Leafs.

Maybe if you're from some non-descript white town like Oshawa or Peterborough. People usually have a wider range of sporting interests due to population/ethnic diversity/large percentage of foreign births.

 

[hoglund]

The truth is Toronto is not a very good sports town regardless of what people want to tell you.

The Jays haven't had good attendance since their glory days of WAMCO and World Series....

The Raptors have a decent "cult like" following but are far from sports darlings in this town...if they win..people get interested...and if they dont (which is a large part of their history) nobody cares.

The Argos are a joke attendance wise. Not sure how or why this team even exists...its pretty pathetic...they play in a 45000 seat stadium and they draw about 15K fans on average. To boot, they are a legitimately good team with possibly the best chance of any Toronto sports team of becoming champions.

The Marlies don't even draw that well if you ever been to the RICOH on a Sunday afternoon...lots and lots of empty seats. You would think that they would sell out being the Leafs farm team in a Leaf-crazed city. Not to mention..they are also a top team in the AHL and the tickets are very affordable. Doesn't matter.

Finally there are the Leafs..one of the worst NHL franchises(winning wise) since 67 expansion and maybe the absolute worst since the 2004 lockout but yet they seem to print money and are by far the most profitable NHL franchise.

The superior NFL cannot even draw 50K to the Rogers center. They have to give away tickets to fill the stadium, so they are not embarrassed.

Toronto is NOT a sports town. Toronto is not even a hockey town.

Toronto is a Leafs town.

they are a Leaf's town for sure, but in the 70's and early 80's, the Argos 40 to 50 thousand per game, it wasn't until the move to the dome where the attendance decreased.

 

[hockeyfanz*]

Please. Jays and Raptors fan presence is huge online. Attendance is solid even in lean years. I don't know where you're from, but my friends who watch sports are knowledgeable on the NHL, NBA, MLB and NFL, there is no exclusivity. Perhaps this is a product of my generation.

Few cities have a well rounded fanbase for every major sport. Which city has dedicated fans for multiple sports? Chicago? Sure. Maybe Boston (Celtics in a lull, Pats were never popular until Belichick showed up). Detroit is hardly deserving of being called a hockey town, when the Tigers, Lions, UofM, MSU all take precedence.

No one in Philly cares about the Sixers.. the Flyers have a small fanbase etc..
New York is a baseball city. Then come the Knicks.. Rangers are ignored.

I'm tired of people taking shots at Toronto. It is pathetic, our city has a complete lack of self-esteem/confidence. Some of the people who are critical of the city make up baseless accusations without actually having been here. One of them is the outrageous claim that no one cares about teams other than the Leafs.

Maybe if you're from some non-descript white town like Oshawa or Peterborough. People usually have a wider range of sporting interests due to population/ethnic diversity/large percentage of foreign births.

What I stated are facts. What you state are emotional biased opinions. Look up the numbers if you like. In every sport to see where exactly the team sits attendance wise.

If you don't believe attendance is a good measuring stick of how popular a team is then why are you even in this discussion?

 

[hockeyfanz*]

they are a Leaf's town for sure, but in the 70's and early 80's, the Argos 40 to 50 thousand per game, it wasn't until the move to the dome where the attendance decreased.

I agree..the Argos were very relevant when I was growing up. I remember the fabled Grey Cup game where Joe Theisman handed the ball off to Leon McQuade for the potential winning touchdown and he fumbled inside the ten yard line I believe.

The Argos were huge. I remember the NFL also being huge then too...so it wasnt either CFL or NFL. But the fact remains that right now its a team that bleeds money. I wonder if they are kept alive to keep the CFL alive...although Im not sure the CFL needs the Argos.

Both the Jays and Raptors have had an opportunity to take the bull by the horns and grab the spotlight given how bad the Leafs have been for a decade now but sadly both teams have rivaled the Leafs for ineptitude. The Raps went to the first round this year and the city was buzzing with Raptormania...

Imagine what a championship team would do for these franchises......Jays and Raptors.

 

[Bionda]

Raptors were 10th in attendance last year. Pretty impressive, considering they were never contenders and the tumultuous Rudy Gay saga.

Jays were 18th (14th in 2013) and suffered a massive collapse, continuous injury.

A great deal of the teams I listed had poor attendance. Yet, none of those cities get bagged for being bad fans or even being poorly versed in certain sports. You could easily make a case for all those other cities for being lacking sports towns if you assert the same about Toronto.

A lot of this has to do with perceptions that Canada is dismissive of sports other than hockey. Yes, we are hockey centric. It is a passion many of us share, but I am trying to assert that we as a nation are well-rounded consumers including Toronto.

Online presence, radio coverage are all indicative of this. Yes, the Leafs are No.1, but the Jays and Raptors each have a strong fanbase.

Contrary to whatever propaganda TSN and other outlets were spewing during the playoff appearance, diehard basketball fans have existed in Toronto for a long time. You cannot pass us off as bandwagoners, but fans who are starved for some postseason success.

 

[Bionda]

What I stated are facts. What you state are emotional biased opinions. Look up the numbers if you like. In every sport to see where exactly the team sits attendance wise.

If you don't believe attendance is a good measuring stick of how popular a team is then why are you even in this discussion?

I don't believe that attendance is the be all and end all of popularity. TV ratings must be taken into account. Traffic in the GTA is hell. The Rogers Centre is a poor facility for football, NFL or otherwise. This is a factor in Argos attendance.

My point is, that the team can be supported with proper facilities, instead of a cavernous one like the 'ol dome.

 

[keonsbitterness]

I don't believe that attendance is the be all and end all of popularity. TV ratings must be taken into account. Traffic in the GTA is hell. The Rogers Centre is a poor facility for football, NFL or otherwise. This is a factor in Argos attendance.

That's true. Argo TV ratings are consistently better than the Raptors, completely annihilate TFC, and are competitive with the Jays.

Where the Argos lose out is perception in the marketplace, and that has a lot to do with a lack of stable ownership and mediocre or nonexistent marketing. It'll be interesting to see how that might change if the MLSE/BMO deal goes through.

 

[Bionda]

There is a multitude of CFL and baseball fans in towns outside the GTA. Fellow Torontonians don't realize this. (County baseball and Box Lacrosse are strong and in good health across Southern Ontario during summer).

Some CIS schools enjoy great football fan support. Certainly see this as a Queen's student.

Just ranting at this point.. just feel there are many misconceptions about Canadian sporting culture. People also seem to love to disparage Toronto in any capacity they are able.

 

[hockeyfanz*]

There is a multitude of CFL and baseball fans in towns outside the GTA. Fellow Torontonians don't realize this. (County baseball and Box Lacrosse are strong and in good health across Southern Ontario during summer).

Some CIS schools enjoy great football fan support. Certainly see this as a Queen's student.

Just ranting at this point.. just feel there are many misconceptions about Canadian sporting culture. People also seem to love to disparage Toronto in any capacity they are able.

This isn't true if directed at me. I am a born and bred Torontonian. I am proud of being one too. Toronto to me is one of the best cities in North America for its diversity, ethnicity and culture. Its a great great city. I'm not sure there is actually another city of this size on this continent that I'd rather call home.

I lived on the west coast for 5 years in Victoria BC and frequented Vancouver a lot because I had friends and relatives there. For sheer beauty, the west coast is the place to be...mountains, ocean and plenty of pretty landscape....but as far as a city goes, Toronto blows Vancouver out of the water (no pun intended), IMO.

I speak of sports here and I call a spade a spade. You haven't sold me on anything I already didn't know. The truth is nobody cares about the Argos. Witnessed by their embarrassing attendance after winning the Grey Cup (sad sad)...I agree their TV ratings are good, which is probably why they are so vital to the CFL for survival.

Jays and Raptors really only get widespread support if they are wiinning. TFC..meh...who cares other than die hard soccer fans...ditto for the Rock and lacrosse..

The biggest head scratcher for me are the Marlies. Why don't they have better attendance? Cant figure this one out. Cheap tickets. Future Leafs. Good venue with no really poor seats. They actually made the finals this past year, so obviously a decent team, but attendance is nothing special. Ninth in attendance in the AHL with a drop in attendance of 10% for a team that reached the final.


Why?

Because they are not the Leafs.

 

[Bionda]

This isn't true if directed at me. I am a born and bred Torontonian. I am proud of being one too. Toronto to me is one of the best cities in North America for its diversity, ethnicity and culture. Its a great great city. I'm not sure there is actually another city of this size on this continent that I'd rather call home.

I lived on the west coast for 5 years in Victoria BC and frequented Vancouver a lot because I had friends and relatives there. For sheer beauty, the west coast is the place to be...mountains, ocean and plenty of pretty landscape....but as far as a city goes, Toronto blows Vancouver out of the water (no pun intended), IMO.

I speak of sports here and I call a spade a spade. You haven't sold me on anything I already didn't know. The truth is nobody cares about the Argos. Witnessed by their embarrassing attendance after winning the Grey Cup (sad sad)...I agree their TV ratings are good, which is probably why they are so vital to the CFL for survival.

Jays and Raptors really only get widespread support if they are wiinning. TFC..meh...who cares other than die hard soccer fans...ditto for the Rock and lacrosse..

The biggest head scratcher for me are the Marlies. Why don't they have better attendance? Cant figure this one out. Cheap tickets. Future Leafs. Good venue with no really poor seats. They actually made the finals this past year, so obviously a decent team, but attendance is nothing special. Ninth in attendance in the AHL with a drop in attendance of 10% for a team that reached the final.


Why?

Because they are not the Leafs.

Not directed at you hockeyfanz. Just venting, general frustration. With some success I hope the other teams enjoy more widespread support. The Marlies are a head scratcher for me too.

As a diehard lacrosse fan, and player at the Jr. B level.. I must admit it is still a niche sport. I doubt many people are aware the Canada just won the gold at the World Field Lacrosse championships (men).

I don't think you can directly compare Vancouver to Toronto, two distinct experiences (I love BC as a whole). Two of the best cities in North America, and the world as far I'm concerned--> culture, amenities, ethnic diversity, dining, arts etc..

 

[hockeyfanz*]

Not directed at you hockeyfanz. Just venting, general frustration. With some success I hope the other teams enjoy more widespread support. The Marlies are a head scratcher for me too.

As a diehard lacrosse fan, and player at the Jr. B level.. I must admit it is still a niche sport. I doubt many people are aware the Canada just won the gold at the World Field Lacrosse championships (men).

I don't think you can directly compare Vancouver to Toronto, two distinct experiences (I love BC as a whole). Two of the best cities in North America, and the world as far I'm concerned--> culture, amenities, ethnic diversity, dining, arts etc..

Toronto Rock(s)!!!!!!

 

[AINEC*]

Always happy to see a Toronto team win, but at the end of the day I couldn't care less about the CFL.

 

[OG6ix]

There are a lot of Baby boomers in Southern Ontario... Younger generations have had exposure to all sports. This whole Toronto only likes hockey stuff is BS. We are a sports city.

What's a better sports city? Montreal? LOL... Vancouver? Even more LOL..

I don't hate the CFL ... but it was much more prominent when Toronto was a much smaller city. I'm sure it's still popular everywhere else in Canada where they have pretty much no other option and the NHL is the only real pro sports presence.

Why isn't anyone buying the Argos? They can't make money in Toronto... that's why...

 

[ACC1224]

MLSE has started their play for the Bills.

http://www.thestar.com/sports/footb...rogers_bid_for_buffalo_bills_takes_shape.html

Further to this.

http://www.thestar.com/sports/footb...lls_pros_and_cons_of_finding_home_in_gta.html

With news that an investment team including Jon Bon Jovi, Larry Tanenbaum and Edward Rogers has scouted out locations for an NFL stadium in the Toronto area, we thought we’d take a look at some potential new homes for the Buffalo Bills.

 

[ACC1224]

Further to this.

http://www.thestar.com/sports/footb...lls_pros_and_cons_of_finding_home_in_gta.html

Down to 3 bidders.

http://www.tsn.ca/nfl/story/?id=458342

It appears there are three bidders to buy the Buffalo Bills.

According to multiple reports, Buffalo Sabres owner Terry Pegula, real estate developer Donald Trump and a Toronto-based group involving Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment CEO Larry Tanenbaum, the Rogers family and musician Jon Bon Jovi entered bids to purchase the NFL team

 

[Remotion]

thinking of going to a game next week. What seats are good but not too expensive? And also are you able to move down without getting into too much trouble?

 

[napoleon in rags]

Watched a great documentary on the '71 Argos. If you were a fan of that team, I highly recommend it.

Nonetheless, I have to confess my interest in the Argos has waned, but not because it's CFL. Lately I just find football (CFL or NFL) boring. One minute of huddles vs 10 seconds of action.

 

[Sensrule]

Was snooping around the forum and I think this was the "newest" topic regarding the Argos so I figured that this would be the official Argos thread? lol. If so, please tell me someone on here watched the Argos/Ti-Cats game last night? What thrilling finish and a wonderful comeback, glad the Argos pulled it out in the end.

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

Was snooping around the forum and I think this was the "newest" topic regarding the Argos so I figured that this would be the official Argos thread? lol. If so, please tell me someone on here watched the Argos/Ti-Cats game last night? What thrilling finish and a wonderful comeback, glad the Argos pulled it out in the end.

Too bad they don't get more love. It's a shame.

 

[Remotion]

Was snooping around the forum and I think this was the "newest" topic regarding the Argos so I figured that this would be the official Argos thread? lol. If so, please tell me someone on here watched the Argos/Ti-Cats game last night? What thrilling finish and a wonderful comeback, glad the Argos pulled it out in the end.

My friend and I were there last night! We almost left but decided to see if Ray was going to get us that first down on third and 4 I believe. Then after that it just progressively got better and better. Had us jumping around and high fiving everyone! Great finish for sure.

 

[Sensrule]

Too bad they don't get more love. It's a shame.

Very true. The game was trending here in Toronto on twitter, which was the first time in quite a while so that's a positive step I suppose.

My friend and I were there last night! We almost left but decided to see if Ray was going to get us that first down on third and 4 I believe. Then after that it just progressively got better and better. Had us jumping around and high fiving everyone! Great finish for sure.

Nice! Must have been a fun game to attend. Especially against the rival Tiger Cats. Easily the best CFL game I've seen in quite some time, always love beating the Ti-Cats. It seemed as if the Ti-Cat players loved chucking the ball into the side of the Ti-Cat fans in the audience. Would have been hilarious had Ray decided to troll the Cats and throw the ball into the stands on that final throw of his.

 

[FuriousSenator]

Was snooping around the forum and I think this was the "newest" topic regarding the Argos so I figured that this would be the official Argos thread? lol. If so, please tell me someone on here watched the Argos/Ti-Cats game last night? What thrilling finish and a wonderful comeback, glad the Argos pulled it out in the end.

Argos are for real the best thing coming out of Toronto right now from a sports perspective. Very competitive and exciting to watch.

 

[OG6ix]

Argos are for real the best thing coming out of Toronto right now from a sports perspective. Very competitive and exciting to watch.

I'd say the Raptors are. Competitive in a 9 team league is questionable.