ConnorMcMullet
#12 Colby Cave
- Jun 10, 2017
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Oscar Klefbom vs Tyson Barrie
- Thread starter ConnorMcMullet
- Start date
Cousin Eddie
You Serious Clark?
- Nov 3, 2006
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Avs fan saying Barrie.
Barrie scored at a 69 point pace last year and is on pace for 70 this year.
Klefbom scores at a 26 point pace last year (per 82 games) and is on a 39 point pace this year (per 82).
Plus the per 82 paces help Klefbom big time in this argument since he can’t stay healthy. Actual totals give Klefbom 36 points since the start of last season while Barrie has 96. We’re talking about nearly triple the offense here.
Klefbom is undoubtedly better defensively but the production gap between the two is enormous.
Barrie scored at a 69 point pace last year and is on pace for 70 this year.
Klefbom scores at a 26 point pace last year (per 82 games) and is on a 39 point pace this year (per 82).
Plus the per 82 paces help Klefbom big time in this argument since he can’t stay healthy. Actual totals give Klefbom 36 points since the start of last season while Barrie has 96. We’re talking about nearly triple the offense here.
Klefbom is undoubtedly better defensively but the production gap between the two is enormous.
To expand on the last season point, the only defenseman with higher ppg average than Tyson was that bum from Ottawa who beat him by 0.01ppg. Tyson Barrie is elite at what he is asked to do, Klefbom isn't close to being elite at a damn thing.
Hockeyholic
Registered User
HockeyDBspecialist
Habs 2019 cup champ
Barrie is a Defensive liability, Klefbom is good on all 200ft of the ice.
Klefbom > Barrie IMO. I love Klefbom and he is underrated if you think that Barrie is better because he is producing at a good pace.
Klefbom > Barrie IMO. I love Klefbom and he is underrated if you think that Barrie is better because he is producing at a good pace.
Barrie isn't producing at a good pace. he is producing at an elite pace, he is 9th among eligible defenseman in ppg after coming 2nd to EK65 last season. Furthermore, the gap between the two offensively is far bigger than the gap defensively and Barrie's defensive struggles are blown out of proportion beyond any logic. When he's on the ice, the puck is usually going the other way, I'll take a guy who is elite at turning defense into offense and pushing the play over a guy who does a bit of everything, but isn't special at any aspect of the game of hockey.
As for underrated/overrated aspect, Klefbom is overrated if anything with how some present him on these boards, you'd think we are talking about an Ekholm type and not a run of the mill #3D on his best day.
Klefbom is not a run of the mill #3D lmao. How absurd. He's a very good #2D with potential to be a #1D
Putting health aside (and Klefbom was clearly playing injured last season), Klefbom is the better Dman. When he's on his game playing some of the toughest minutes in the league, he plays at a low end #1 level but since health is obviously a factor, you have to take Barrie here.
The thing to keep in mind about Klefbom is that he makes the Oilers a playoff contender when healthy (they were 18-12 when he went down this season, the'16-'17 season and they were actually knocking on the door of a playoff spot in December of '15-'16 before he went down). They are pretty good when he's healthy and bottom 10 in the league when he's not. Very underrated but yeah, can't count on him being healthy unfortunately.
The thing to keep in mind about Klefbom is that he makes the Oilers a playoff contender when healthy (they were 18-12 when he went down this season, the'16-'17 season and they were actually knocking on the door of a playoff spot in December of '15-'16 before he went down). They are pretty good when he's healthy and bottom 10 in the league when he's not. Very underrated but yeah, can't count on him being healthy unfortunately.
If we’re talking currently I think it has to be Barrie. Only Karlsson, Carlson, and Burns have a higher ppg over the past two years. Klefbom is better defensively for sure and is younger but the gap offensively is no doubt bigger than the one defensively. Who is more valuable might be a better question as Barrie has less term and is a little older while Klefbom has a really good contract. If Klefbom could stay healthy it might be different but for now it’s got to be Barrie.
Llamamoto
Nice Bison. Kind Bison. Yep.
- Sep 5, 2018
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Based on what? Make belief?
Based on his defensive play.
Tyson Barrie has 71% offensive zone starts.
Klefbom has 57%.
(Oh yeah, and he's 5th in TOI/gp, is a +1 on a - team).
Not sure where are you getting those numbers from. Hockey ref has Tyson at 63% (I know, why would anyone use a top 5 offensive weapon from the backend in the league in the offensive zone, pure madness) and the defensive stalwart Klefbom is at 53%. In fact, Klefbom has the highest percentage of offensive zone starts among all Oilers regular blueliners, and the only guys who start less in the defensive zone are Chris Wideman and Bouchard in their short stints. Tell me more about how amazing he is.
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cgf
FireBednarsSuccessor
News flash, Elite offensive Dmen get used in offensive roles. What's embarrassing is even with more offensive zone starts then Defensive, Klefbom still struggles to put up respectable offensive numbers.
Also, the Avs are a positive possession team and the Oilers are a negative possession team. Which means the Avs spend more time in the offensive zone then the defensive zone while the Oilers are the opposite. So I dunno if you're ready for this but news flash #2: Player A that plays on good team will have more offensive zone starts then Player B that plays on bad team.
This is Barrie and not particularly close. Nice to see the results going against what the OP no doubt was fully expecting to be a pretty lopsided Klefbom win with his smug posts on the Avs board earlier today.
Llamamoto
Nice Bison. Kind Bison. Yep.
- Sep 5, 2018
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So he puts up 30 points less than Barrie. That's the difference between a 1st and 3rd liner. Oilers fans of all people should know how valuable a puck moving OFD is.
Llamamoto
Nice Bison. Kind Bison. Yep.
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Foppberg
Registered User
- Jan 18, 2016
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Klefbom is good defensively but not an elite shutdown guy. His defensive play doesn’t make up for the enormus gap offensively.
Cousin Eddie
You Serious Clark?
- Nov 3, 2006
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Klefbom’s defense in the handful of games he’s capable of playing makes up for 30-40 points?
If both players played every game for the rest of the season and continued their current scoring paces Klefbom would finish with 30 points and Barrie would finish with 70.
So Klefbom must prevent a lot of goals to make up that gap. I had a look. Klefbom is on the ice for 1.97 goals against per 60. Barrie is on for 2.25. At 18 minutes 5v5 per game on average that means that for every game played Tyson Barrie is on the ice for 0.67 goals against and Klefbom is on for 0,59 goals against. To take it further this paces to Tyson Barrie being on the ice for 55 goals against over an entire season 5v5 while Klefbom is on the ice for 49 goals against.
So yeah, tell me more about how the gap defensively between the two is bigger than the gap offensively. A difference of 6 goals against over 82 games vs a difference of 30 points production. Not to mention that difference of 6 may have nothing to do with difficiencies of said player defensively.
This is laughable.
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