Only 2 More Seasons till Lockout?

[Le Tricolore]

The last lock out brought us Therrien. I'm not looking forward to a new one.

Pierre Gauthier to the rescue!

 

[BLONG7]

Lockouts/Millionaire's and Billionaire's........................insane.

Not sure, anymore lockouts would be advised, the fans will not appreciate getting hurt, again, so soon after the last couple of lockouts...

 

[the]

Lockout or not Mr.Bettman will win, he always win!

 

[DavePeak]

Last lock-out gave us a Norris trophy winner

 

[DJ Breadman]

Hopefully the players stay out this time until the cap is gone.

 

[Roke]

Hopefully the players stay out this time until the cap is gone.

I really don't see what most NHL players get out of being a union. They lose half to a full season of wages every 8-10 years to the owners using collective bargaining to force a lockout, their individual salaries are capped, their collective salaries are capped, they have to pay into escrow because GMs and owners can't help themselves when handing out money to players, they get arbitrarily drafted to a team when entering the league, and their free agency is restricted for much of their career.

The big gains for players in sports - free agency, protection from collusion have usually come through the courts, not through collective bargaining. Historically NHL players have got what, regular lockouts and what was for much of its life a crooked pension plan? Seems like a bad trade off to me.

 

[All-Star]

See you as soon as the ink on the next CBA is barely dry.

Also, don't forget those who will be done with the NHL as soon as jerseys get littered with advertising. See them in two years also.

I once lasted 5 years due to the Roy trade. To get me back it took new ownership, new top to bottom management, and a Vezina. I don't make these threats lightly.

 

[Chili]

There was an excellent tv movie years ago on Ted Lindsey and others attempt to form a players union back in the fifties, it was called 'Net Worth'.

The players were taken advantage of, guys played hurt because they were afraid of not having a job if they were out of the lineup. I think Gordie Howe's signing bonus was a team jacket.

A lot of effort to squash a potential union by the owners too, including trading Lindsey.

It took Bobby Orr to come along and bring his good 'friend' Eagleson with him to change things.

The history between the NHL players and owners is pretty checkered, sounds like it could be more of the same.

 

[Sorinth]

I really don't see what most NHL players get out of being a union. They lose half to a full season of wages every 8-10 years to the owners using collective bargaining to force a lockout, their individual salaries are capped, their collective salaries are capped, they have to pay into escrow because GMs and owners can't help themselves when handing out money to players, they get arbitrarily drafted to a team when entering the league, and their free agency is restricted for much of their career.

The big gains for players in sports - free agency, protection from collusion have usually come through the courts, not through collective bargaining. Historically NHL players have got what, regular lockouts and what was for much of its life a crooked pension plan? Seems like a bad trade off to me.

Guaranteed contracts
Minimum salary
Likely numerous health & safety things

Keep in mind the majority of players aren't star players, they are guys who play less then 5 years in the NHL and spend a lot of time in other leagues. Think of a guy like Darche, he spent most of his career not making much money, but having that guaranteed NHL contract is probably something like 70-80% of his total earned income.

It's also questionable whether not having a union would actually mean no draft UFA @ 18, and no team salary cap.

 

[Roke]

Guaranteed contracts
Minimum salary
Likely numerous health & safety things

Keep in mind the majority of players aren't star players, they are guys who play less then 5 years in the NHL and spend a lot of time in other leagues. Think of a guy like Darche, he spent most of his career not making much money, but having that guaranteed NHL contract is probably something like 70-80% of his total earned income.

It's also questionable whether not having a union would actually mean no draft UFA @ 18, and no team salary cap.

A contract is a guarantee in and of itself, there's nothing special about collective bargaining that makes NHL contracts guaranteed while every other contract in the world can be reneged upon without penalty. The NFL's collectively bargained non-guaranteed contracts are an exception, not the rule.

The minimum salary is something, I'll grant you, but it doesn't seem to be significant. Looking at capfriendly only 9% of the guys listed there with salaries for 16-17 made the minimum. 9/120 played 41 or more NHL games last season.

The NHLPA also seems to be standing in the way of a lot of health and safety stuff -it took forever to make visors mandatory for new players, fighting's still a part of the game, and they've sure done a bad job protecting guys from cheapshots and concussions lately.

I'm not a lawyre but I don't see how the 31 teams could legally collude to keep a salary cap, draft, and restrictions on free agency if it wasn't for them being able to use collective bargaining for that purpose.

 

[Skip Bayless]

Last lock-out gave us a Norris trophy winner

Galchenyuk will hold out, come back in game 9 of the season, win the Maurice Richard.

 

[Runner77]

I once lasted 5 years due to the Roy trade. To get me back it took new ownership, new top to bottom management, and a Vezina. I don't make these threats lightly.

That's pretty impressive. Wish more fans were like you. Now that's dedication to one's principles, a rare thing these days.

 

[googlymoogly]

Last lock-out gave us a Norris trophy winner

We tend to do terrible in lockouts. The 95 lockout was half a season and Montreal started slow so we panicked and traded Desjardin, LeClair, and Dionne for Dr freakin Recchi.
The 05 lockout was good as we won the lottery and got Price.

The last lockout got us Therrien and Subban lucked out in a short season to win the Norris that got him traded as he became overpriced.

I would say overall lock outs are bad for us.

 

[All-Star]

That's pretty impressive. Wish more fans were like you. Now that's dedication to one's principles, a rare thing these days.

Life's too short to put up with products that don't meet my requirements.

 

[Sorinth]

A contract is a guarantee in and of itself, there's nothing special about collective bargaining that makes NHL contracts guaranteed while every other contract in the world can be reneged upon without penalty. The NFL's collectively bargained non-guaranteed contracts are an exception, not the rule.

The minimum salary is something, I'll grant you, but it doesn't seem to be significant. Looking at capfriendly only 9% of the guys listed there with salaries for 16-17 made the minimum. 9/120 played 41 or more NHL games last season.

The NHLPA also seems to be standing in the way of a lot of health and safety stuff -it took forever to make visors mandatory for new players, fighting's still a part of the game, and they've sure done a bad job protecting guys from cheapshots and concussions lately.

I'm not a lawyre but I don't see how the 31 teams could legally collude to keep a salary cap, draft, and restrictions on free agency if it wasn't for them being able to use collective bargaining for that purpose.

Contracts are guaranteed, but teams could put in clauses that allow them to cancel the contract. Granted the star players would be able to negotiate to have fully guaranteed contracts, but the majority of players wouldn't have the power to do that.

Without the minimum salary everybody except the stars would likely take a pay cut. The guys making 700K are making that because of the minimum salary. So just looking at the min isn't the complete list of players that benefit.

As for Health and Safety, yes and no. Just look at the concussion lawsuit as an example, teams don't seem to care about the health of their players, and the players can't be trusted to sit themselves out when they feel are injured.