OT: Official HFCaps STAR WARS Episode 7 Discussion (Warning: may contain E7 spoilers)

[sycamore]

What is it with people and Star Wars? I'm trying to understand this obsession but I cant come up with anything.

Star Wars is the American Lord of the Rings.

 

[strungout]

I've seen Rey as a Kenobi proposed in other places. That'd be reasonably interesting.

I kinda like that...plus it would be a door to bring back Ewen as a jedi spirit to talk to her or something. (considering he's already helped with the voices in the Rey flashback scene)

Here's my theory...Im still going with Luke being the father...and the mother dying in the Kylo and Knights of Ren massacre. The shot of R2 being touched by Luke...there appears to be a fire going. I'm going with that's Luke burning the dead mother and saying "**** this **** R2....I need a vacation after I hide my daughter on Jakku".

Seems kinda simple....but would make for a nice comeuppance when Father and Daughter go after Kylo and Snoke for all they have done to this point. And they just cannot do the redemption angle now that he's killed Han. F that. Dude is going to get got.

 

[artilector]

Some thoughts on TFA:

-Goosebumps when "A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away" popped on the screen turned into a giddy fanboy squeal when the score kicked in with the receding STAR WARS

-Daisy Ridley (Rey), Adam Driver (Kylo Ren), and Oscar Isaac (Poe Dameron) were all really good, IMO. John Boyega (Finn) was okay, and I think hurt by the script. As I said before, he seemed to be the non-droid comic relief character, and it came off forced. He didn't have much chemistry with Ridley or Harrison Ford. It's a shame, because a conflicted former Storm Trooper is a really good starting place for a new character.

-The portion from when Rey and Finn meet through Han coming in was easily the weakest part of the movie. No chemistry at all. The scene on the freighter was a bit 'meh', but I thought the movie hit its stride after that.

-The re-hashing of the "destroy the deadly space station by attacking the one weakness" was a bit lazy, and the execution (one X-wing squadron and four people with a bag of explosives taking down a planet-sized Death Star) even lazier. The ease of it is by far my biggest complaint beyond Boyega's character.

-Loved how they did Kylo Ren/emo-Vader. Obviously a misguided brat driven by rage and spite. None of the cool discipline and total control real Vader had. I hope they don't go with the lame redemption story arc with him (unless it's the double agent the whole time thing that some are speculating).

-Harrison Ford's aged Han Solo was perfect, and I like how they did the bridge scene.

-With Rey, they're either going full circle back to the original trilogy and she and Ren are twins a l Luke and Leia, or she was one of Luke's young apprentices they mentioned that they hid from Ren's rampaging. That's my guess, anyway. Why else would Leia hug a girl she's never met when mourning Han and send her to find Luke?

-Couldn't have ended the movie with a better scene, IMO. Introduce Luke any earlier, and he dominates the plot.

-Carrie Fisher sounded terrible, like she's been smoking since ROTJ.

Overall, I thought it was a good homage to the original and a fitting reboot. I suspect they'l go a little less campy and repetitive with the sequels.

That's a good summary, I mostly agree with it.

The exception being Driver/Kylo, who probably has the most difficult task and will probably be the most polarizing guy. I think it comes down to whether you "believe" in how the character is scripted and acted... and I didn't. Vader in a diaper is a bit too jarring Maybe they should've kept the mask off, introduce him as a weak but up-and-coming force in the "Order", then one could slowly get used to the character... make him try on the mask towards the end.. otherwise the whole re-hashed Empire looks (even more) silly with this guy installed as 2nd in command. Then they made him look even sillier getting his butt kicked by untrained Rey.. after getting trained by Luke AND the Sith? It would be like Agent Smith getting his butt kicked by Neo before Neo got picked up by Morpheus.. come on.. wouldn't be able to take the bad guy seriously after that.

Btw, this didn't really bother me, but the direct re-hashing of Empire as First Order is also really lazy. Emperor, Vader.. seriously? Not even a wrinkle? You'd think the Empire would make some organizational changes after the previous fiasco, you know, fire the GM or something, bring in sexier uniforms.. even amoebas evolve!

Another thing, not necessarily a negative, but they will have a challenge with the girl in the next movie. They scripted her almost inhumanly perfect and apparently insanely powerful (already). Thing is.. characters without flaws.. ultimately it's hard to make them interesting. And if her flaw is her thing for Finn, that's pretty bad, because that was one of the most forced parts of the movie. Next, Emo Vader is not really a challenge, as shown already. So.. they have her on a path to become some sort of Jedi Phoenix in the next movie and do some super-hero magic battle with the overgrown emperor... then what? I think they should've kept her weaker and more human in the 1st movie, would've given her more room to act and would've made things more interesting/more options down the line.

 

[strungout]

I find the idea of her being a bad ass Jedi in the making far more interesting than more human and working her way to it. That's been done with Anaikin and Luke already.

Have her be an untapped raw kick ass Jedi from the start....the true balance of the force. F the beating around the bush crap. I was worried they were going to have her be a reluctant Jedi....but I think when she found the force in the battle with Kylo in the snow...she knew then what she was about to become. Embrace it Rey. Embrace it.

 

[g00n]

I think she's Luke's daughter, possibly with another Jedi as the mother. As was mentioned the mother may have been killed or exiled after the uprising. What would make it interesting is if Luke hid Rey to hide her from HER MOTHER primarily, rather than himself, with the mother being a dark influence he hadn't forseen initially. Then Rey takes a drastic turn the darkside, as influenced by her cousin Neo-Vader, and somewhat indirectly kills Luke, setting up a final confrontation with....lots of options.

Would be better than something that's 85% parallel to the previous movies.

 

[strungout]

If Rey's the baddie...who's the Jedi to lob her and cousin off since Luke is the last one right of this moment?

You say lots of options....but only two episodes to come up with someone that really needs to be badass on the level she's nearly already to.

Unless you're talking complete doom and gloom ending of the new trilogy...then yeah, that works I suppose.

 

[g00n]

If Rey's the baddie...who's the Jedi to lob her and cousin off since Luke is the last one right of this moment?

You say lots of options....but only two episodes to come up with someone that really needs to be badass on the level she's nearly already to.

Unless you're talking complete doom and gloom ending of the new trilogy...then yeah, that works I suppose.

Not the baddie, a flawed possible antihero similar to Heisenberg. All the Jedi are tempted by the dark side. She will have to be tempted as well. Something in how that comes about could cause something horrible to happen, and she becomes twisted and confused like her presumed cousin.

We also haven't met the mother, and Finn could play a role. With two more movies there are plenty of characters that can be introduced. Remember, we didn't really meet the Emperor or Yoda, two primary figures for everyone, until the 2nd movie ever made. Similarly, Jabba was only mentioned (if you don't count the deleted scene at the hangar) in ANH, but was a key player in the original trilogy due to the bounty on Han, the relationship with bounty hunters, and the tie ins with the Empire. Boba Fett also didn't appear until the 2nd movie and the Fett family was a key part of several movies.

So yeah, lots of ways this COULD go. But will they free it up? I'm skeptical. It's going to be too tempting to ride the wave of Han's death as the grabbing moment and then try to tell a decent story that somehow neatly fits all the pieces together for a happily ever after ending.

 

[strungout]

I'd be fine with them killing of Leia as well somehow (since they cant really expect Carrie Fisher to be in the next two and stay sane in reality)....really flip the switch on old Luke with that one.

 

[g00n]

I'd be fine with them killing of Leia as well somehow (since they cant really expect Carrie Fisher to be in the next two and stay sane in reality)....really flip the switch on old Luke with that one.

Right. Was thinking about that. I bet they probably also got Ford to agree to reprise a role he swore he'd never play again by promising to kill him off. I don't think HF wanted to drag this out another 5 or so years, or whatever it takes. CF is probably the same.

 

[g00n]

Also, with the relationships, remember we were kept in the dark about the Skywalker family through most of two movies, and were even teased about a perceived rivalry for Leia between Luke and Han (remember the kiss at the beginning of Empire) until the 3rd movie, iirc. We could be getting plenty of false signs about who's related to whom.

 

[strungout]

They could go with Kylo really wanting to off her (mother) to complete his journey to the dark side (Snoke aka Darth Plagueis in his ear...thats whole other discussion)...so the First Order goes balls to the wall to find the Resistance and kill her off...with Luke and Rey training to take them on full bore.

I also dont want Luke to be all sissy about it....it terms of "I dont want to train you only for you to turn on the light"....but man did he look wore down by it all.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

I didn't know this was Captain Phasma....I recognized the voice but couldn't place it. Brienne!
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3729225/?ref_=tt_cl_t7

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Because of the British Accent. Some have even suggested she might be Palpatine's daughter!

One thing is for sure I intend to avoid as MUCH as possible with Episode 8. Even watching some of the teasers and trailers for this one kind of lessened the impact of the movie. I want to go into Episode 8 as innocent as possible. Its being directed by one of the hottest directors in Hollywood (Rian Johnson) so its in good hands, and that's all I need to know.

I wouldn't call him that. He's got two really solid movies (Looper and Brothers Bloom), but nothing much since 2012 aside from some Breaking Bad. I'm reasonably nervous about someone else taking over. Big shoes...

 

[strungout]

The two best Breaking Bad episodes of all of them. I'm excited that he's taking over...little nervous...but still excited overall. Looper was an excellent movie.

 

[g00n]

The two best Breaking Bad episodes of all of them. I'm excited that he's taking over...little nervous...but still excited overall. Looper was an excellent movie.

Wait, someone who directed BB is coming in and I was talking about a Heisenberg type antihero?

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

The two best Breaking Bad episodes of all of them. I'm excited that he's taking over...little nervous...but still excited overall. Looper was an excellent movie.

The two BEST? No way. I'd have Face Off up there easily without even thinking of any others.

In fact. http://www.thetoptens.com/best-breaking-bad-episodes/

I'll give him that credit for Ozymandias.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Wait, someone who directed BB is coming in and I was talking about a Heisenberg type antihero?

Relax he didn't write the series he directed 3 episodes over 3+ years (2010, 2012, 2013) and hasn't done any Directing since.

 

[strungout]

The two BEST? No way. I'd have Face Off up there easily without even thinking of any others.

In fact. http://www.thetoptens.com/best-breaking-bad-episodes/

I'll give him that credit for Ozymandias.

Fly is WAYYYY better than 16th.

Regardless...I think they are in good hands. Especially from a character standpoint...which is the direction it needs to take.

 

[sycamore]

Relax he didn't write the series he directed 3 episodes over 3+ years (2010, 2012, 2013) and hasn't done any Directing since.

Which means he'll be fresh. That was one of my concerns with Abrams, who was coming off two Star Trek Movies when he accepted to direct TFA. I thought he might be burnt out.

 

[strungout]

So do most of you follow the reasoning that Snoke is Darth Plagueis? I think that makes the most sense since he was always considered the wisest Sith lord. Google it for more....too much to even go into in a single post.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Which means he'll be fresh. That was one of my concerns with Abrams, who was coming off two Star Trek Movies when he accepted to direct TFA. I thought he might be burnt out.

I guess that's one way to look at a long career layoff.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

So do most of you follow the reasoning that Snoke is Darth Plagueis? I think that makes the most sense since he was always considered the wisest Sith lord. Google it for more....too much to even go into in a single post.

I have zero clue what you just said, nor would I look. I prefer to NOT know the plot.

 

[sycamore]

BTW, why isn't Kylo Ren a "Darth"?

 

[NobodyBeatsTheWiz]

BTW, why isn't Kylo Ren a "Darth"?

Because he's not (yet) a Sith.

 

[Hivemind]

As far as we know, there are no remaining Sith. Supreme Lord Snoke has not been referred to as "Darth," either. What we know is that Kylo Ren is the leader of the Knights of Ren, and that Supreme Lord Snoke is mentoring him in the ways of the dark side. It's entirely possible the Sith are gone.