Speculation: NJD Offseason Part VII

[NJDevs26]

lol I hope **** like this happens, as long as its not to us

Except then people will complain why didn't we do it

At least until the Jets match anyway. 95% of all offer sheets wind up being nuisance. The 5% that actually get passed over generally you'd be better off if they did get matched.

 

[Bleedred]

Draft 3rd liner in the first round? Check.

Use 4 first round picks to offer sheet Trouba? Check.

I'm starting to really feel like Sweeney is Irish for Benning.

Sweeney really is becoming Benning East.

And how much longer before Seabass loses his job there?

 

[NJDevils17]

Except then people will complain why didn't we do it

At least until the Jets match anyway. 95% of all offer sheets wind up being nuisance. The 5% that actually get passed over generally you'd be better off if they did get matched.

No way the Jets match.

Compensation would be 4 1st rounders. Unless they feel Trouba is a true #1. He's really not that special IMO.

 

[NJDevils17]

Seriously they'd pay Trouba that much but wouldn't pony up for Hamilton?

Edit: and that the risk of 4 first rounders and 9 million+.

 

[Bleedred]

Except then people will complain why didn't we do it

At least until the Jets match anyway. 95% of all offer sheets wind up being nuisance. The 5% that actually get passed over generally you'd be better off if they did get matched.

Dustin Penner LOL, that was one of my favorite offer sheets.

What a waste from that brain dead sack of **** Kevin Lowe.

 

[Bleedred]

Isn't Neely Sweeney's boss? Time for him to go.

One day I got really bored right after the season ended, and came across a link from the Bruins board of some local radio show that Neely was on. He sounded clueless and unsure of himself on the show and even seemed to get mad and flipped out at the end of his spot on the show.

I usually don't browse other teams boards, but occasionally I'll come across a thread on the side in the ''Latest threads'' posted on the site.

 

[TheNumber4]

Oiler fan here:

I would offer:

Hall + Fayne for Larsson + 3RD Pick.

I think this would be more than fair. Fayne can still play. He just has never had a partner like Greene in Edmonton to allow him to play at his best.

So you down grade from Larsson to Fayne but upgrade the offence hugely with Hall. Hall can drive a line all by himself.

What do you guys think?

 

[Devil X]

Oiler fan here:

I would offer:

Hall + Fayne for Larsson + 3RD Pick.

I think this would be more than fair. Fayne can still play. He just has never had a partner like Greene in Edmonton to allow him to play at his best.

So you down grade from Larsson to Fayne but upgrade the offence hugely with Hall. Hall can drive a line all by himself.

What do you guys think?

Larrson is a non-starter. So i would politely decline your offer.

 

[ghdi]

Oiler fan here:

I would offer:

Hall + Fayne for Larsson + 3RD Pick.

I think this would be more than fair. Fayne can still play. He just has never had a partner like Greene in Edmonton to allow him to play at his best.

So you down grade from Larsson to Fayne but upgrade the offence hugely with Hall. Hall can drive a line all by himself.

What do you guys think?

Hell to the no, and vehemently. Its cutting off our nose to spite our face. So we fill a hole with Hall, and create a brand new one with Larsson. Fayne is not even comparable to Larsson. Larsson's still only 23, on a superb contract and is improving even still. Fayne is a third pairing defender.

I like the idea of bringing in Hall, but not at the cost of Larsson.

 

[ScottyK]

Oiler fan here:

I would offer:

Hall + Fayne for Larsson + 3RD Pick.

I think this would be more than fair. Fayne can still play. He just has never had a partner like Greene in Edmonton to allow him to play at his best.

So you down grade from Larsson to Fayne but upgrade the offence hugely with Hall. Hall can drive a line all by himself.

What do you guys think?

Nah, too much of a downgrade on the D end, we don't want to be Edmonton east with a potent offence but zero defense.

I would do Severson and bostons 2nd ( we got it in the stempniak trade ) for RNH and Fayne.

 

[NJDevs26]

Seriously they'd pay Trouba that much but wouldn't pony up for Hamilton?

Edit: and that the risk of 4 first rounders and 9 million+.

Trouba is a better all around player than Hamilton...but not four first-rounders better

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Oiler fan here:

I would offer:

Hall + Fayne for Larsson + 3RD Pick.

I think this would be more than fair. Fayne can still play. He just has never had a partner like Greene in Edmonton to allow him to play at his best.

So you down grade from Larsson to Fayne but upgrade the offence hugely with Hall. Hall can drive a line all by himself.

What do you guys think?

its not that its not fair value, its just that the Devils cannot realistically afford to trade Larsson at the moment.

it would solve one problem while creating another

 

[Zippy316]

Trouba is a better all around player than Hamilton...but not four first-rounders better

An offer sheet of 7 years 44 million (~6.28 AAV) would still fall under the threshold of two first round picks, a second, and a third. An offer sheet of 7 years 35 million would fall under the one first, two seconds, and three thirds.

For deals over five years, they take the entire salary and divide it over just 5 years. With the minimum for 4 first round picks being about 9.1 million, on a seven year deal anything less than 45.5 million (5x9.1) would only cost a 2 1st, 1 2nd, and 1 3rd. Anything under 7.3 million would only cost Boston 1 1st, 1 2nd, and 1 3rd.

So it's not out of the possibility for an offer sheet to be worth it for Boston. 7 years at about 35 million means they only have to give up 1 1st, 1 2nd, and 1 3rd.

 

[TheUnseenHand]

its not that its not fair value, its just that the Devils cannot realistically afford to trade Larsson at the moment.

it would solve one problem while creating another

Yup. In a vacuum the trade is fair. However, Edmonton can much more easily handle the loss of Hall than the Devils can handle the loss of Larsson. We just don't have the prospect pipeline to make that kind of deal.

 

[TheNumber4]

What if you guys could take the Hall offer I proposed and sign Demers.

Larsson out.

Demers + Fayne + Hall in. I think at this point Demers and Larsson are not too far off. Might be workable.

 

[NJDevs26]

An offer sheet of 7 years 44 million (~6.28 AAV) would still fall under the threshold of two first round picks, a second, and a third. An offer sheet of 7 years 35 million would fall under the one first, two seconds, and three thirds.

For deals over five years, they take the entire salary and divide it over just 5 years. With the minimum for 4 first round picks being about 9.1 million, on a seven year deal anything less than 45.5 million (5x9.1) would only cost a 2 1st, 1 2nd, and 1 3rd. Anything under 7.3 million would only cost Boston 1 1st, 1 2nd, and 1 3rd.

So it's not out of the possibility for an offer sheet to be worth it for Boston. 7 years at about 35 million means they only have to give up 1 1st, 1 2nd, and 1 3rd.

Boston doesn't have their own 2nd next year (or their own third for that matter)

I do wonder how the picks get spread over multiple years or whether they all (except first-rounders) have to be the same year though?

 

[Classic Devil]

What if you guys could take the Hall offer I proposed and sign Demers.

Larsson out.

Demers + Fayne + Hall in. I think at this point Demers and Larsson are not too far off. Might be workable.

Demers would be an awful replacement for Larsson. Just godawful. Plus you can't incorporate an asset you don't own into a trade.

If you think they're not far off, you sign Demers and keep Hall.

 

[Emperoreddy]

I'm not sure I see the big appeal with Demers. I definitely wouldn't say he and Lars are close from looking at the stats (is there some advanced stat that says otherwise?). Plus Lars is younger and under control on a favorable contract.

He had a better season than Severson definitely, but that doesn't factor in that this was Severson's first full NHL season, and he is really young at 21.

 

[TheNumber4]

Almost every Oilers fan thinks we get FLEECED trading Hall for Larsson ++. Even Larsson + 1st + Zacha doesnt work for alot of Oilers fans. I think if a Hall for Larsson ++ trade happens, HF main boards laughs at Oilers for getting fleeced.

But I'd do it, I'm suprised there is like ZERO interest here. Larsson is a risk, he only recently came into his own and he is playing with Greene. Greene makes everyone look better it seems.

So the Oilers are trading the 3rd best LWer in the league with elite production numbers and a former first overall pick and you won't consider it even if you can replace Larsson with Fayne and Demers. I don't get it. I think its a trade that works for both sides.

Demers played a solid year and brought more offence than Larsson.

So... Larsson -> Demers. Sure maybe a downgrade, but you get Taylor Hall!

 

[OmNomNom]

Almost every Oilers fan thinks we get FLEECED trading Hall for Larsson ++. Even Larsson + 1st + Zacha doesnt work for alot of Oilers fans. I think if a Hall for Larsson ++ trade happens, HF main boards laughs at Oilers for getting fleeced.

But I'd do it, I'm suprised there is like ZERO interest here. Larsson is a risk, he only recently came into his own and he is playing with Greene. Greene makes everyone look better it seems.

So the Oilers are trading the 3rd best LWer in the league with elite production numbers and a former first overall pick and you won't consider it even if you can replace Larsson with Fayne and Demers. I don't get it. I think its a trade that works for both sides.

Demers played a solid year and brought more offence than Larsson.

So... Larsson -> Demers. Sure maybe a downgrade, but you get Taylor Hall!

it's about relative value to the teams. you can afford to lose hall. we can't afford to lose larsson. if you've looked at trade proposals recently re: oilers/devils, you know we can't agree on anything

 

[Emperoreddy]

Lars is only 24 and on his way to becoming one of the better shut down guys in the league.

No one could score with him and Greene on the ice. He is also an amazing PKer. He also has untapped offensive potential (how much remains to be seen).

The net gain on the ice is greater with Lars than with Demers easily.

Also your fellow Edmonton fans are out to lunch if they wouldn't take Lars, Zacha, and a 1st for Hall. I would never do that trade as a Devils fan, but I would take it and run as an Oiler fan.

 

[TheNumber4]

it's about relative value to the teams. you can afford to lose hall. we can't afford to lose larsson. if you've looked at trade proposals recently re: oilers/devils, you know we can't agree on anything

We can only afford to do this trade if Lucic is signed. Otherwise it's not even close to being on the table.

Hall >> Lucic. But we do it anyways because it allows for options like Hall for Larsson+.

Similarly, Larsson > Demers (which is a bit debatable at this point in their careers) it allows you guys to finally get some offence and an impact franchise level player like Hall.

 

[CerebralGenesis]

Larsson for Hall is definitely an interesting discussion. We are just in a tough spot to do that.

Severson to Edm for something is what might be feasible

 

[Emperoreddy]

We can only afford to do this trade if Lucic is signed. Otherwise it's not even close to being on the table.

Hall >> Lucic. But we do it anyways because it allows for options like Hall for Larsson+.

Similarly, Larsson > Demers (which is a bit debatable at this point in their careers) it allows you guys to finally get some offence and an impact franchise level player like Hall.

Yes, but we would be trading away a #1 D to do it, and we don't have another one just lying around (Severson might be there, but he isn't yet).

Whatever goals Hall provides, we will be giving up more by losing Lars on defense. Also you can't trade Demers since he isn't signed and would almost certainly use his NTC he will be getting to block a trade after the 1st because no one signs a contract just to be traded a day later.

You would have to add Nurse and it still won't happen.

 

[Triumph]

Almost every Oilers fan thinks we get FLEECED trading Hall for Larsson ++. Even Larsson + 1st + Zacha doesnt work for alot of Oilers fans. I think if a Hall for Larsson ++ trade happens, HF main boards laughs at Oilers for getting fleeced.

But I'd do it, I'm suprised there is like ZERO interest here. Larsson is a risk, he only recently came into his own and he is playing with Greene. Greene makes everyone look better it seems.

So the Oilers are trading the 3rd best LWer in the league with elite production numbers and a former first overall pick and you won't consider it even if you can replace Larsson with Fayne and Demers. I don't get it. I think its a trade that works for both sides.

Demers played a solid year and brought more offence than Larsson.

So... Larsson -> Demers. Sure maybe a downgrade, but you get Taylor Hall!

The Devils can afford to lose Larsson. They can't afford to lose Larsson AND Zacha AND a 1st, even though I'm in full agreement that the Devils win that trade.

The problems are -

1: Taylor Hall is not a center - The Devils' biggest need is at center, and right now Hall would be playing with either Henrique or Zajac. Disaster - it means not getting full value out of the asset the Devils just traded away 3 of their top assets for.

2: Taylor Hall is not fungible. So yeah, the Devils 'win' that trade for sure because Hall is an elite LW signed to a good contract. But the Devils can't flip him elsewhere and gain assets, either. You rarely win a trade when you trade a superstar. The Devils are stuck with Taylor Hall.

3: The Devils are short on assets. I like the last two drafts they've had but they just don't have the kind of organization that can reliably recover from a trade like this. Replacing Larsson won't be easy.

It's the kind of trade NJ can think about in 2 years if some of their young players continue to develop well. Right now, even though it's an NJ win in value, it'd still be a no for me.