Proposal: NJD: Hall + 34OA <=> COL: 4OA (cond. '20/'21 2nd)

[MtoD]

If you’re still proposing Hall trades including 2019 draft picks, you haven’t been following the situation, and you shouldn’t be issuing a (uninformed) opinion.

This isn’t happening.

I mean, I agree it is very unlikely Hall is traded at the draft.. Shero will definitely field offers if teams provide them. If a team wants to overpay at the draft, Shero will consider.

What is dumb, however, are all the posts saying they would need an extension in place for a trade involving 2019 draft picks given Hall is prohibited from signing an extension with any club until July 1st, which is after the 2019 draft.

 

[Michael HOMERUNing]

Hall is getting severely underrated here. Reigning MVP, and he can't return a 4th overall draft pick? There's a 95% chance that that pick doesn't come close to as good as Hall. If this is more than the best NJD can get, they should stay away from trading Hall altogether

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Hall is getting severely underrated here. Reigning MVP, and he can't return a 4th overall draft pick? There's a 95% chance that that pick doesn't come close to as good as Hall. If this is more than the best NJD can get, they should stay away from trading Hall altogether

Teams don't trade A+ assets for rentals. They trade quantity.

2019 16th overall pick
2019 78th overall pick
2020 2nd Round pick
Shane Bowers
Alexander Kerfoot or Tyson Jost
2021 1st Round Pick (Only transfers if Hall extends w/ COL)

That's the type of return New Jersey could expect. A mid 1st, a 2nd, a 3rd, a B prospect, a young NHLer with upside who is not a blue chipper, and some sort of conditional element if Hall re-signs.

At the deadline, it'll be even less. Probably a 1st, a B level young player or prospect, and then another lesser piece like a 2nd or 3rd round pick.

It took an extension at the deadline for Ottawa to even get Brannstrom and a 2nd for Stone. The best rental offer if that fell through was apparently from the Islanders and the center piece was Anthony Beauvillier. Stone may not be an exact equivalent to Hall, but it is a close enough comparable to illustrate the point that rentals rarely return anything good.

 

[ScottyK]

Hall won't be moved before or at the draft.

Hall will only be moved later in the summer after Shero has proposed his plan moving forward. If Hall isn't on board then he'll be on the market.

This is literally public information.

 

[Michael HOMERUNing]

Teams don't trade A+ assets for rentals. They trade quantity.

2019 16th overall pick
2019 78th overall pick
2020 2nd Round pick
Shane Bowers
Alexander Kerfoot or Tyson Jost
2021 1st Round Pick (Only transfers if Hall extends w/ COL)

That's the type of return New Jersey could expect. A mid 1st, a 2nd, a 3rd, a B prospect, a young NHLer with upside who is not a blue chipper, and some sort of conditional element if Hall re-signs.

At the deadline, it'll be even less. Probably a 1st, a B level young player or prospect, and then another lesser piece like a 2nd or 3rd round pick.

It took an extension at the deadline for Ottawa to even get Brannstrom and a 2nd for Stone. The best rental offer if that fell through was apparently from the Islanders and the center piece was Anthony Beauvillier. Stone may not be an exact equivalent to Hall, but it is a close enough comparable to illustrate the point that rentals rarely return anything good.

So Taylor Hall will return a package marginally better than what Rick Nash returned at the 2018 deadline?

 

[Avaholic29]

Hall is getting severely underrated here. Reigning MVP, and he can't return a 4th overall draft pick? There's a 95% chance that that pick doesn't come close to as good as Hall. If this is more than the best NJD can get, they should stay away from trading Hall altogether

A 4th overall pick for one year of hall?? I have never seen such a trade. Extended contract then yes for sure

 

[MtoD]

So Taylor Hall will return a package marginally better than what Rick Nash returned at the 2018 deadline?

Was about to post this. Kinda laughable.

I agree that it's tough to trade premium premium assets like 4OA for a player who would possibly be a 1 year rental.. but that poster's trade deadline valuation is off.

Hall would be one of the biggest fishes at the deadline since Kovalchuk was traded.

 

[Cypher]

Counter, Barrie for Hall 1 for 1 .. both UFAs next summer

 

[Freudian]

Avs can't do that. Too much of a risk Hall wants to test the market in addition to the risk that his ask is so high (Marner/Matthews money) it's not possible to re-sign him even if he agreed to it.

Avs need to just keep building from within and the 4th overall pick fits into that.

 

[Lindys Lazy Eye]

Was about to post this. Kinda laughable.

I agree that it's tough to trade premium premium assets like 4OA for a player who would possibly be a 1 year rental.. but that poster's trade deadline valuation is off.

Hall would be one of the biggest fishes at the deadline since Kovalchuk was traded.

Kovy returned quite the haul.

Oduya who was a 60 point d-man 2 years prior

A first round pick

Patrice Cormier who was at the time a highly touted junior prospect

Nic Bergfors who had a promising rookie year and oodles of potential

Well at the time everyone in Devil land thought it was a huge trade haul.

 

[NOTENOUGHJTCGOALS]

Kovy returned quite the haul.

Oduya who was a 60 point d-man 2 years prior

A first round pick

Patrice Cormier who was at the time a highly touted junior prospect

Nic Bergfors who had a promising rookie year and oodles of potential

Well at the time everyone in Devil land thought it was a huge trade haul.

Did Oduya even have 60 career points before being traded?

 

[PizzaAndPucks]

The though of moving Hall for the 4th overall is tempting. Having Hughes , Hischier and maybe Byram on our team would be amazing if they pan out. Would be one of the best core 3 players to build around in the league IMO.

 

[hockeyviking]

Kovy returned quite the haul.

Oduya who was a 60 point d-man 2 years prior

A first round pick

Patrice Cormier who was at the time a highly touted junior prospect

Nic Bergfors who had a promising rookie year and oodles of potential

Well at the time everyone in Devil land thought it was a huge trade haul.

Odoyas best season was 29 points.....

 

[RoyIsALegend]

Kovy returned quite the haul.

Oduya who was a 60 point d-man 2 years prior

A first round pick

Patrice Cormier who was at the time a highly touted junior prospect

Nic Bergfors who had a promising rookie year and oodles of potential

Well at the time everyone in Devil land thought it was a huge trade haul.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

So Taylor Hall will return a package marginally better than what Rick Nash returned at the 2018 deadline?

What do you think Taylor Hall would return as a rental, both now and at the deadline?

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

Counter, Barrie for Hall 1 for 1 .. both UFAs next summer

Barrie doesn’t do a single thing for us.

No.

 

[John Eichel da GOAT]

To NJD:

COL 2019 1st (4OA)
COL 2020 2nd - conditional (condition: Hall re-signs before 2020 draft)
COL 2021 2nd - conditional (condition: Hall re-signs after 2020 draft, but anytime before 2020-2021 season)​

To COL:

Taylor Hall
NJD 2019 2nd (34OA)​

I like the updates with the conditional picks, but I'd change it to this:

To NJD:

COL 2019 1st (16OA) - changes to 4OA if Hall signs 5+ year extension before the draft.
COL 2020 3rd - changes to 2nd if Hall re-signs before 2020 draft
COL 2021 3rd - changes to 2nd if Avs make it to 2020 SF Finals

To COl:

Taylor Hall
NJD 2020 2nd (34OA)

Not much time, but I'm willing to part with 4OA for a signed Hall.

 

[John Eichel da GOAT]

If you’re still proposing Hall trades including 2019 draft picks, you haven’t been following the situation, and you shouldn’t be issuing a (uninformed) opinion.

This isn’t happening.

Is that you Ray? Glad you're bringing facts to the table so we know we shouldn't bother wasting our time proposing hypothetical trades in a public forum that has nothing to do with real GM meetings.

 

[pockets]

I like the updates with the conditional picks, but I'd change it to this:

To NJD:

COL 2019 1st (16OA) - changes to 4OA if Hall signs 5+ year extension before the draft.
COL 2020 3rd - changes to 2nd if Hall re-signs before 2020 draft
COL 2021 3rd - changes to 2nd if Avs make it to 2020 SF Finals

To COl:

Taylor Hall
NJD 2020 2nd (34OA)

Not much time, but I'm willing to part with 4OA for a signed Hall.

Hall can’t be re-signed before July 1st So the condition on the 1st round pick isn’t possible.

 

[Luger]

To NJD:

COL 2019 1st (4OA)
COL 2020 2nd - conditional (condition: Hall re-signs before 2020 draft)
COL 2021 2nd - conditional (condition: Hall re-signs after 2020 draft, but anytime before 2020-2021 season)​

To COL:

Taylor Hall
NJD 2019 2nd (34OA)​

I'm curious to know how COL fans feel about this proposal. Jeff Skinner's deal has me worried Hall will ask (and get) more than he's probably worth, with him being just a year out from UFA. And I'm not convinced now is the time for NJD to start paying top-dollar for (essentially) a UFA. If Byram is on the board when COL is on the clock, from a Devils' fan perspective, I'd much rather get an earlier (and a more known) return on Hall than risk getting mix of unknown prospects and draft picks down the line. The idea of walking away from the draft with a potential 1C and 1D and letting the rebuild play out for another year or two is worth letting Hall go IMO.

For COL, which I see as being in "win now" mode, they get a 90+ point scorer, a year removed from winning league MVP, for the price of dropping 30 spots in fairly deep 2019 draft. If Hall re-signs, they give back what will most likely be a much worse 2nd rounder than 34OA. They lose out on Byram (in this scenario), so that's the real question: is it worth passing on Byram (or whomever else you covet) to aggressively push for the cup next season (and beyond)?

I'm also curious to know what Devils' fans think. I feel most are either strongly in the "re-sign Hall" boat, or on the other end of the spectrum.

Maybe for Colorado's 16th pick and the Devils keep the 34th. Hall straight for the pick, plus next year's first if Colorado re-signs him or next year's second if Colorado does not.

 

[ImNeverWrong]

If Hall was signed, it’d be a no brainer for the Avs in my opinion.

Then it would be 4th++++++ LOL

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

Is that you Ray? Glad you're bringing facts to the table so we know we shouldn't bother wasting our time proposing hypothetical trades in a public forum that has nothing to do with real GM meetings.

Be my guest if you want to discuss these unrealistic hypotheticals, but again, if you think a draft day trade is remotely realistic, you haven’t been following the situation.

All parties involved are on the same page regarding the timeline. There is no rush, and there shouldn’t be.

 

[NJDevs]

If there's no extension than not a chance in hell.

If Hall was signed, it’d be a no brainer for the Avs in my opinion.

Signed Hall, insteantly yes. Un-signed, maybe, but probably still no. The Avs aren't quite in "all-in" mode yet.

Hall cannot re-sign until July 1, after the draft.

 

[NJDevs]

If you’re still proposing Hall trades including 2019 draft picks, you haven’t been following the situation, and you shouldn’t be issuing a (uninformed) opinion.

This isn’t happening.

Not sure whom this was directed at or what it means.

 

[NJDevs]

Teams don't trade A+ assets for rentals. They trade quantity.

2019 16th overall pick
2019 78th overall pick
2020 2nd Round pick
Shane Bowers
Alexander Kerfoot or Tyson Jost
2021 1st Round Pick (Only transfers if Hall extends w/ COL)

That's the type of return New Jersey could expect. A mid 1st, a 2nd, a 3rd, a B prospect, a young NHLer with upside who is not a blue chipper, and some sort of conditional element if Hall re-signs.

At the deadline, it'll be even less. Probably a 1st, a B level young player or prospect, and then another lesser piece like a 2nd or 3rd round pick.

It took an extension at the deadline for Ottawa to even get Brannstrom and a 2nd for Stone. The best rental offer if that fell through was apparently from the Islanders and the center piece was Anthony Beauvillier. Stone may not be an exact equivalent to Hall, but it is a close enough comparable to illustrate the point that rentals rarely return anything good.

Again, the proposal takes this into account, which is where 34OA comes into play. If that's still not to your liking, fair enough. You're not entirely off with your proposal, but I'd hope Shero could pry an even more established player/prospect in the return. Hall at his best is a top-5 LW. Given all the other pieces COL has, this makes him especially more valuable to them even if it's a one year rental; he's a $10.5m+ winger coming in at almost half that cost that could very well be the difference in getting a cup.