I still don’t understand Lisa MacLeod’s idea of no hitting or fighting. Fighting, sure. It’s not necessary. But hitting? There will still be forms of contact. Puck battles, puck scramble in front of the net, etc. Removing hitting and fighting will not stop contact in a hockey game.
Next Season (COVID-19 Discussion Thread as it relates to the OHL) [Part 3]
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[QUOTE="Removing hitting and fighting will not stop contact in a hockey game.[/QUOTE]
Absolutely. This is a ugly decision. You can't stop life. It won't help, it doesn't work
Absolutely. This is a ugly decision. You can't stop life. It won't help, it doesn't work
Otto
Lynch Syndrome. Know your families cancer history
Again... it's not that simple. Each player has a standard player agreement with the OHL. There are 2 ways out of it one is for the team to terminate the contract (waived through the league) I'd be shocked if any team waived top end talent. The other is for the team to not fulfill its obligations to the player. This would include scholarship moneys and stipends. Since there is no hockey being played then there is no stipend, and I doubt top end talent is interested in scholarship money at the present moment.
The only other option would be that the NHL team would need to assign the player to Europe. This only works if there is no OHL season. If the OHL plays in some way shape or form then their only options are NHL or OHL. This includes if the OHL proceeds without body checking or fighting. In order for a player to be assigned to Europe they first must have signed an NHL contract. I am unsure what the frequency of signing contracts is at right now given the NHL doesn't have a steady revenue stream. But even after all of the if somehow a player does get assigned to Europe he is not there permanently. If they are 18 years old, then next year the process starts again, at age 19 they still ave to play in the NHL or OHL if there is a 2021/22 season.
So.. in short... if a player gets to Europe it will only be if there is no OHL season... and it won't be permanent.
OHLTG
Registered User
Otto
Lynch Syndrome. Know your families cancer history
Yes, I said that... but again first the player needs to be signed to an NHL contract, and NHL teams are strapped for cash now as it is. Second it can only happen once the OHL officially shuts down, or at least there will be a clause in the lian that states the player is to return to the OHL in the event that it starts up.
There won't be a permanent exodus of top talent to Europe as is being suggested
BadgerBruce
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- Aug 8, 2013
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You are largely correct, Otto.
But I’d point out the following.
With the exception of the Gold packages, scholarship funding isn’t provided unless a player actually plays games. Dress for a game prior to January 10 (that date fluctuates a bit year to year) and one term of post-secondary funding is earned. Dress for a game after January 10, and the second term of post-secondary funding is earned.
In other words, only a tiny number of OHL players are earning scholarship entitlement right now.
If the league wishes to keep clubs’ future scholarship liability low, they should think long and hard about their chosen season start date.
Having said this, I have heard some muted chatter that breach of contract issues could arise. CHL Standard Player Agreements outline not simply what players are required to do, but also what teams must do. 2-way street. The absolute centrepiece of the clubs’ contractual obligation is to actually provide hockey opportunities for the players. I do not have a 2020-21 agreement in front of me, but I do have a 2018-19 copy and this obligation is central. Remember, the players are not employees earning salaries that are paid whether they do or do not play. At a very fundamental level, the only reason players sign SPAs is to receive the amateur hockey development opportunities the league provides. If that training is not provided AND clubs refuse to allow players to receive it elsewhere, breach of contract could be an issue, especially in an age-restricted league.
As an aside, this is one reason why the USHL quickly held a player dispersal draft when Cedar Rapids and Madison suspended operations for this season.
Otto
Lynch Syndrome. Know your families cancer history
Great insight, thanks for posting!
EvenSteven
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Agree.
I’m pretty sure it was announced that when Kitchener’s Ville Ottavainen signed to play in Europe this year, it was under the condition/understanding that he’d return to the OHL should our league start up.
Tim Wallach
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Albin Grewe for Saginaw is playing in the SHL as well on loan till the CHL starts up
beastintheeast
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- Mar 27, 2013
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There is nothing the OHL can do about COVID. You have to remember that they do not set the government rules.. They also can not force parents to allow their players to play or the fans to show up.
The problem that is causing it to take so long to get under control is the fact that people want to live the life that they had a year ago. No one in the western world has realized that that is no longer a player.
I live outside the country in SE Asia and we have reached stage 4 however, our borders are closed. People wear face masks not just mandatory but everyone accepts it. We did/ do not get into large groups. We live in a country where the government says do this and people for the most part 99% follow the rules.
People now are skating and playing hockey, football is being played and fans are in the stands. Theatres are open but it was a struggle.
Players that were drafted in the top 2 rounds of the NHL draft will be allowed to practice with the NHL teams.
Unless like the 67's players are given permission by them to play in Europe.
The OHL is going to have to set up rules for players to play in other areas. As to people that are going to be drafted 21 I think you will see mini games or leagues show up of 5-6 players playing on rinks like we used to in the back yeard.
Otto
Lynch Syndrome. Know your families cancer history
Isaac Nootin
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I'm hearing the OHF has approved the potential resumption of tryouts for U18 and U16 AAA hockey, starting early November. With 5 on 5 hockey being played within bubbles of 50. Rosters of 20 players 2 goalies. Games will be played with rosters of 10 + 1.
Not sure how this pertains to the GTHL however as they suspended all on ice activity until Jan 1st. Perhaps they are exempt to this decision.
Not sure how this pertains to the GTHL however as they suspended all on ice activity until Jan 1st. Perhaps they are exempt to this decision.
beastintheeast
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- Mar 27, 2013
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Otto
Lynch Syndrome. Know your families cancer history
OMG67
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The reality is pretty simple.
Unless the Government’s of Canada and the United States decide to take a different approach and seek a faster herd immunity strategy, there will be no sports with fans of any sort of consequence until at least next summer.
So few people as a percentage of the population have contracted the virus that it is impossible to put a stranglehold on it no matter how stringent the mitigating processes are because if those mitigating processes work, there is pressure to loosen the reigns which will continually cause a yo-yo effect of positive cases.
This is the reality. Anyone that thinks otherwise is naive.
For example, the Provincial Government has identified three hot spots and has rolled back to Stage 2 for those spots for 28 days. Unless there is legal action to force the Government to do otherwise, or there is some change of heart, those restrictions will carry through the entire winter. We will not see numbers go back down into the 100’s until the spring, similar to last year.
Far too few people have contracted the virus. The current approach is to wait for a vaccine. Without a vaccine or a change in approach to reach herd immunity naturally, this yo-yo peak and valley graph will continue through the next 4-5 years because we are trickling out the infections over a long period of time. 0.4% of the Ontario Population has tested positive. That translates to 1 in every 250 people.
With so few people having contracted the virus, this cycle will continue indeterminately for many years provided the government only uses the metric of # of positive cases and doesn’t look at hospitalizations and deaths, which right now they are not.
I know all of this is speculation with respect to whether the OHL will play etc. That is what this forum is for. However, there is zero chance the OHL will play with meaningful fans this season. Absolute ZERO. The question now is whether the league feels there is a meaningful way to conduct a season of some kind. Without a more strict bubble, I see no way of doing that considering the current situation as well as how this situation forecasts forward.
If the players are doing remote learning with tutors, there is no significant reason why they should not bubble other than projected costs. Playing games in their home cities with billets etc isn’t viable. There is too much risk of transmission. On top of that, without a more controlled bubble, the silly on ice restrictions make the season virtually meaningless. They would simply be scrimmage games. They may as well just practice as a team and play 10 on 10.
Unless the Government’s of Canada and the United States decide to take a different approach and seek a faster herd immunity strategy, there will be no sports with fans of any sort of consequence until at least next summer.
So few people as a percentage of the population have contracted the virus that it is impossible to put a stranglehold on it no matter how stringent the mitigating processes are because if those mitigating processes work, there is pressure to loosen the reigns which will continually cause a yo-yo effect of positive cases.
This is the reality. Anyone that thinks otherwise is naive.
For example, the Provincial Government has identified three hot spots and has rolled back to Stage 2 for those spots for 28 days. Unless there is legal action to force the Government to do otherwise, or there is some change of heart, those restrictions will carry through the entire winter. We will not see numbers go back down into the 100’s until the spring, similar to last year.
Far too few people have contracted the virus. The current approach is to wait for a vaccine. Without a vaccine or a change in approach to reach herd immunity naturally, this yo-yo peak and valley graph will continue through the next 4-5 years because we are trickling out the infections over a long period of time. 0.4% of the Ontario Population has tested positive. That translates to 1 in every 250 people.
With so few people having contracted the virus, this cycle will continue indeterminately for many years provided the government only uses the metric of # of positive cases and doesn’t look at hospitalizations and deaths, which right now they are not.
I know all of this is speculation with respect to whether the OHL will play etc. That is what this forum is for. However, there is zero chance the OHL will play with meaningful fans this season. Absolute ZERO. The question now is whether the league feels there is a meaningful way to conduct a season of some kind. Without a more strict bubble, I see no way of doing that considering the current situation as well as how this situation forecasts forward.
If the players are doing remote learning with tutors, there is no significant reason why they should not bubble other than projected costs. Playing games in their home cities with billets etc isn’t viable. There is too much risk of transmission. On top of that, without a more controlled bubble, the silly on ice restrictions make the season virtually meaningless. They would simply be scrimmage games. They may as well just practice as a team and play 10 on 10.
Isaac Nootin
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Decision, again from what I hear, will come down early next week.
As stated, it's confined to just U18 and U16, and only at the AAA level, to coincide with Jr. leagues starting up.
Not surprising, it's no contact and all the other new bells and whistles when it comes to rules/regulations.
Isaac Nootin
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swoopster
Politally incorrect
OMG I stated this a few days ago...play in your own bubble. However it would still impact the US teams with Canadian players. I doubt they can journey back into the States.
OMG67
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Or vice-versa with American kids on Canadian Teams.
Point being, the OHL will need to find a way to play without fans for an entire season AND bubble in a way to ensure they get no Covid cases.
At this point, I cannot see this happening with their current plan of playing in their own cities/towns and residing in billet homes.
If we see OHL hockey, I cannot see this as a viable option.
If they are just going to go to their OHL cities to practice and scrimmage, they might as well just stay home. For the majority of the players, they are able to skate/workout with other players of their calibre all offseason anyways.
The biggest mistake the OHL can make is rushing the start like they did in the QMJHL. In the Q, the BEST case scenario was that they play their season out, finish around May and likely wait somewhere around 2 months for a Memorial Cup, then have another extended offseason. They already are failing miserably at that.
I've mentioned this before but I'll reiterate, there is absolutely no reason to start in December and force a 64-game schedule into 5 months, besides the fact that the Q already started. The next NHL season will go all the way through the summer and likely into the fall, so what is the point of forcing an early May start to the playoffs if the next season isn't going to get underway until December? I say this assuming the "new normal" doesn't consist of the CHL starting 3 months before the NHL from now on and that they will try to get back around the same timeline.
The biggest mistake the OHL can make is rushing the start like they did in the QMJHL. In the Q, the BEST case scenario was that they play their season out, finish around May and likely wait somewhere around 2 months for a Memorial Cup, then have another extended offseason. They already are failing miserably at that.
I've mentioned this before but I'll reiterate, there is absolutely no reason to start in December and force a 64-game schedule into 5 months, besides the fact that the Q already started. The next NHL season will go all the way through the summer and likely into the fall, so what is the point of forcing an early May start to the playoffs if the next season isn't going to get underway until December? I say this assuming the "new normal" doesn't consist of the CHL starting 3 months before the NHL from now on and that they will try to get back around the same timeline.
OMG67
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Good point. Align the leagues together.
The only issue is viable ice at the Major Junior Level. Many rinks don’t have the dehumidifying required to maintain strong ice.
I know in Ottawa, training camp the first week of September is tough. I can just imagine what it would be like in mid-July. I would assume many rinks would have the same issue.
In Peterborough, hockey in the summer at the Memorial Centre wouldn't work for this reason, as well as the fact that the Lakers (lacrosse) take over the floor from end of May until early September (and draw more fans than the Petes). I suppose they could put down boards over the ice for lacrosse the way they do when the Mann Cup is running in early September along with Petes training camp and exhibition games, but I don't think the ice would stand a chance.
Of course, it's probably all irrelevant, as there's no way the government will be allowing 3500 people to cram into the building for lacrosse by June 1 or so, when the season usually starts.
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