GDT: New Jersey Devils vs. Toronto Maple Leafs - 7pm, MSGSN

[SteveCangialosi123]

why is it so hard to acknowledge that they’ve had a lot of lapses in coverage and a lot of long defensive zone shifts, and their scoring hasn’t made up for it?

you’re citing the on ice save percentage but it’s lower for them than it is for others- do you disagree that all shots and all chances aren’t equal? you’re cherry picking stats and situations that prove your point and dismissing anything that goes against it

I’m not playing the stupid pile on game when it’s very obvious the amount of goals going in is due to worse goaltending than last season. Not going to do it.

Who hasn’t acknowledged that they haven’t been that sharp?

 

[Call Me Al]

it’s valid criticism that only becomes a pile on when there is an unnecessarily stubborn defense that dismisses those valid points for no reason

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

it’s valid criticism that only becomes a pile on when there is an unnecessarily stubborn defense that dismisses those valid points for no reason

No, it’s a stupid pile on when you just bring up raw goals against totals as if there isn’t a massive chunk of context that explains it. You’re free to play that game if you want.

 

[MauDevils]

No, it’s a stupid pile on when you just bring up raw goals against totals as if there isn’t a massive chunk of context that explains it. You’re free to play that game if you want.

Not just raw goal totals, I also showed that relative to the rest of the team, they have actually been the two worst players on the ice for us in terms of both actual and expected goal %.

But sure...the goalie stinks.

 

[TheUnseenHand]

Erik Haula is on pace to have a career high in assists and the 3rd best offensive season of his career shooting only 5.5%.

Bring him back.

His teams never miss the playoffs.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Not just raw goal totals, I also showed that relative to the rest of the team, they have actually been the two worst players on the ice for us in terms of both actual and expected goal %.

But sure...the goalie stinks.

Over the last 10 games Bratt is getting 56.3% of shot attempts, Jack is getting 54.5%. The worst player on the team in that stat is Dawson Mercer, who is notably playing so poorly. Anyway, the goalie is saving 93.3% of shots with Miles Wood on the ice in the last 10, I’m sure that’s due to his famously stellar defense?

Their xGA is between 7 and 8 goals, obviously the goalie is a massive reason for that inflated number.

 

[Call Me Al]

none of these stats are infallible that’s kind of the point

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

none of these stats are infallible that’s kind of the point

The point was that they’ve been on the ice for tons of goals, therefore they have been really bad. Great. My point is they’re having a down stretch and the goalie is playing like an ECHLer with them on the ice and it’s obviously the reason for a goals against number being that high.

No one actually cares who was on the ice when a breakaway is given up and the goalie makes a save. It’s quickly forgotten. But when a point shot hits an ass cheek and goes in, that’s a dreaded goal against and those guys out there stink defensively, obviously. It just becomes a statistic in a couple days.

 

[Whaddagoal]

Last night.

Goal 1 (no chance on wide open net, tatar in no mans land didnt get his man covered)

Goal 3 (similar to goal 1, open net... great pass). Half the team was on wrong side of rush going back.

Goal 2 was a SHG breakaway (call that a 50/50) but meier f***ed that up but not knowing man was on him. And also whomever passed the puck into nicos skates and nico.

Goal 4 perhaps was stoppable but you have auston matthews in the slot with time.(failed PK covered by mcleod and nico judged the zone enterence poorly)

Maybe Vitek could have stopped the 4th goal and 2nd, but he had little chance of saving others.

Edit: defensive coverage/ play influenced those goals a lot...in a bad way.

 

[Call Me Al]

The point was that they’ve been on the ice for tons of goals, therefore they have been really bad. Great. My point is they’re having a down stretch and the goalie is playing like an ECHLer with them on the ice and it’s obviously the reason for a goals against number being that high.

No one actually cares who was on the ice when a breakaway is given up and the goalie makes a save. It’s quickly forgotten. But when a point shot hits an ass cheek and goes in, that’s a dreaded goal against and those guys out there stink defensively, obviously. It just becomes a statistic in a couple days.

you’re misconstruing a statement for the point. they’ve been on for a lot of goals, which doesn’t mean they’ve been bad alone. they’ve been bad because of missed coverage, letting the opposing team keep possession and boneheaded giveaways in the o zone, and that has resulted in scoring chances against, and would logically lead to a lower save percentage from quality chances . all of the explanations below the surface level “goals against = bad” have been expressed but you are clinging to this oversimplified straw man argument.

anyways let’s move on

 

[NjdevilfanJim]

Vitek will in all likelihood play 2 of the next 3 games.

If he can't figure it out and play some good games again like he was doing in January and the first few weeks of February and Schmid has a pretty good game, let him roll with it for a bit.

Really don't wanna see #29 unless it's for load management purposes. He has no future here. These are our goalies right now and hopefully will be next season and should be the just about the remainder of this season. #29 can play a game or two if need be, but it's more important to see what we have in Schmid. Vitek is signed for next season already and the year after.

I'm confident either Vitek will turn it on again or Schmid will help deliver.

Vitek will turn it around and you want to see your goalie make a save he shouldn't like Samsonov did but you can't really think Schmid is the answer down the stretch I think he might be too green yet to expect that of him....

 

[guitarguyvic]

How can anyone look at the crappy d-zone coverage from the Hughes line AND the types of goals being scored when they are out there AND the stats showing that the save % for that line is head and shoulders worse than for everyone else...and conclude that the issue is primarily the goalie not them. Like, I can't even wrap my brain around that kind of evidence resistance.

It's clear some people will never acknowledge that there's a symbiotic relationship between defense and goaltender save %. You can't just divorce the two in every situation no matter what your eyes (and other metrics) tell you. A lot of this is just plain common sense. If you took an extreme hypothetical scenario where the defense was so bad they were giving up 20 breakaways per game, complaining about the goalie's save percentage being in the toilet would be completely absurd. This is no different (just obviously to a lesser degree).

 

[Call Me Al]

schmid is green and he was not good last year but i've been really impressed this year. he's big, he's positionally sound, he controls rebounds and he can play the puck competently. i want to see more of him because he's been really good so far. i don't know that i'd trust him in the playoffs if we need him but it's not crazy

 

[Devs3cups]

schmid is green and he was not good last year but i've been really impressed this year. he's big, he's positionally sound, he controls rebounds and he can play the puck competently. i want to see more of him because he's been really good so far. i don't know that i'd trust him in the playoffs if we need him but it's not crazy

100%. He's taken huge steps this year and has taken over as our top goalie prospect for sure. I still like Daws though and he's 1 year younger than Schmid.

 

[Bleedred]

2 years - 2.5m per for Haula would be great

I've definitely come around to re-signing him, but for 2 years? I'd at least hope for a discount from what he's making this year for the extra in term.

 

[Call Me Al]

yeah his cap hit this year is 2.375, i can't imagine giving him a raise, $2m would be fine

 

[kiwidevil]

I think the point is missed of the 96-86-63 line. It is designed to outscore its matchups, not be some defensive wall hoping to come out with a slightly positive scoring average in 5 games.

So they are always going to allow more hdca if they get stuck in the dzone.

If that line had a bit of shooting % luck in the first period and didn't hit the post on the PP, we are likely talking about how they each had 2-3 points each, won the 5 on 5 battle 2-1(at worst) in goals and also scored on the PP.

 

[TF1970]

i just re-watched the SHG. i didnt even realize, hamilton rifled a pass that was into hischiers skates, then it banked off his foot to meier, who really didn't have much of an opportunity to corral it before marner was all over it.

 

[theoptimist]

How can anyone look at the crappy d-zone coverage from the Hughes line AND the types of goals being scored when they are out there AND the stats showing that the save % for that line is head and shoulders worse than for everyone else...and conclude that the issue is primarily the goalie not them. Like, I can't even wrap my brain around that kind of evidence resistance.

It's clear some people will never acknowledge that there's a symbiotic relationship between defense and goaltender save %. You can't just divorce the two in every situation no matter what your eyes (and other metrics) tell you. A lot of this is just plain common sense. If you took an extreme hypothetical scenario where the defense was so bad they were giving up 20 breakaways per game, complaining about the goalie's save percentage being in the toilet would be completely absurd. This is no different (just obviously to a lesser degree).

Free website...gotta pick and choose what you read

 

[NjDevsRR]

EHITBPITNHL

EHSTD

 

[Devs3cups]

EHSTD

Erik Haula, nightly.

 

[Emperoreddy]

A few things can be going on. That line is trying to be highly creative and high octane, which is causing them to take too many risks trying to come out the D zone when they should just dump the puck.

Bigger issue is Timo is really out of sync with the team. They are expecting him to be in one place and he is in another and it's creating issues.

The second one will fix itself as he gets adjusted and people need to just be patient with that.

 

[Emperoreddy]

i just re-watched the SHG. i didnt even realize, hamilton rifled a pass that was into hischiers skates, then it banked off his foot to meier, who really didn't have much of an opportunity to corral it before marner was all over it.

Yeah I think people ripped Timo for that, but it was really on Dougie for making a bad pass

 

[Bleedred]

Back when Haula had 2 goals in 40 games or whatever I said I think he’ll get more than the 4 he was on pace for and that if I had to guess I think he finishes with 7-9 if he plays close to the entire season. He’s now at 7.

 

[HoliksGhost]

Yeah I think people ripped Timo for that, but it was really on Dougie for making a bad pass

Not one of Dougies best games. Disappointed he was not slamming from the point on the PP… looked like he was going for the wrister tip in in. Please go back to the slap shot !!!!